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  #21  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 9:21 PM
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https://ny.curbed.com/2020/1/30/2108...0-water-street

Is a new tower coming to South Street Seaport’s historic district?
A developer is eyeing an air rights transfer for a contested South Street Seaport lot


By Caroline Spivack
January 30, 2020


Quote:
The Howard Hughes Corporation has expressed an interest in transferring development rights from three high-profile properties to 250 Water Street, which sits above the toxic remnants of a 19th-century thermometer factory. Renderings presented during a recent community workshop show a building that has a contextually appropriate base, with a taller tower rising above it. This preliminary vision has emerged as Howard Hughes embarks on a master planning process for the South Street Seaport with community input led by architecture firm Skidmore, Owings & Merrill.
Quote:
City Council member Margaret Chin, who represents the area, is monitoring proposals for the site and currently does not have a position on would-be development in the area, according to her office. Manhattan Borough President Gale Brewer hopes any plans for the site “take into consideration the context of the area, especially since it is a historic district, and conforms to what is permissible,” Brewer said in a statement.
Quote:
Howard Hughes purchased the Water Street lot (bounded by Peck Slip and Beekman Street to the north and south, and Water and Pearl streets to the east and west) from Milstein Properties in 2018 for $180 million, after the latter failed to develop the site.

But the developer also controls a significant chunk of the historic Seaport under a lease with the city, including Pier 17, the Tin Building, and the New Market building. Included in its holdings is approximately 311,000 square feet of development rights at 250 Water Street; roughly 415,000 square feet of unused rights at Pier 17 and the Tin Building. Some 212,000 square feet of air rights is also owned by the city at the New Market site.
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  #22  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2020, 3:48 AM
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Here are a few grabs from that November workshop. Though nothing has been designed yet, it appears there will basically be a tower set back over a low level base.


1.



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13.

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  #23  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2020, 5:30 PM
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Go with the 'zoning envelope' version.

No tower. It will look like absolute sh** encroaching over the neighborhood.

Much better to step up to the FiDi via the 'zoning envelope' - otherwise you get a little Tour Montparnasse in the Seaport.
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  #24  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2020, 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted by NYer34 View Post
Go with the 'zoning envelope' version.

No tower. It will look like absolute sh** encroaching over the neighborhood.

Much better to step up to the FiDi via the 'zoning envelope' - otherwise you get a little Tour Montparnasse in the Seaport.

The zoning envelope is just what they’re allowed to build before they transfer those development rights from the other sites. So you’d get that squat box - only nearly 3x the height - a monster for the neighboring streets. Meanwhile, the tower would have more height, but much less that bulky mass. But really, whatever get’s built here won’t matter heightwise if a 1,400 ft 80 South Street rises as well.


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  #25  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2020, 12:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYer34 View Post
No tower. It will look like absolute sh** encroaching over the neighborhood.

Much better to step up to the FiDi via the 'zoning envelope' - otherwise you get a little Tour Montparnasse in the Seaport.
Uh, there's a 1,450 ft. tower planned a block to the south.

And Water Street is already lined with giant highrises. It would actually be noncontextual to not build a big tower. The NIMBYs fighting local development live in modern apartment towers just to the west, and don't want their views blocked. The historic district is like two blocks and already surrounded by modern towers.
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  #26  
Old Posted Mar 4, 2020, 4:51 PM
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THE GREATEST CITY IN THE WORLD STRIKES AGAIN!

Yeah, baby!

South Street Seaport redevelopment plan includes up to 990-foot tower

https://ny.curbed.com/2020/3/4/21163...990-foot-tower

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  #27  
Old Posted Mar 4, 2020, 5:33 PM
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Wow that is a game changer for the Brooklyn Bridge view point. What with 2WTC coming. 1WTC will be crowded out from that view point!
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  #28  
Old Posted Mar 4, 2020, 5:56 PM
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Originally Posted by JMKeynes View Post
South Street Seaport redevelopment plan includes up to 990-foot tower

https://ny.curbed.com/2020/3/4/21163...990-foot-tower

It’s all hands on deck for the NIMBYs...



Quote:
The mixed-use building would rise on the edge of the historically low-slung patch of Lower Manhattan under a scenario that would transfer more than 700,000 unused development rights, many from three high-profile properties, to alter the zoning at 250 Water Street, which is currently a parking lot that sits above the toxic remnants of a 19th-century thermometer factory, according to the urban planning firm Skidmore, Owings & Merrill (SOM) tasked with developing a master plan for the Seaport.

... The current zoning for the Water Street lot caps development in a roughly 10-block historic district at 12 stories. But by modifying the zoning, Howard Hughes seeks to build a red brick podium that’s contextually appropriate with the neighboring Georgian and Federal-style brick buildings, and a tower that would soar above anywhere from 570 to 990 feet depending on how the high-rise is configured on that podium (a dual tower scenario is one of four options that’s being most seriously considered).
Quote:
The base would feature some office and retail space, while the residential tower would bring between 550 and 700 overall units; it would be the district’s first project to utilize mandatory inclusionary housing—approximately 200 apartments could be set aside as affordable housing under the current proposal. The building would also bring with it a package of upgrades throughout the Seaport area tied to changing the Water Street site’s zoning, said a lead designer on the effort.

“We are trying to look at this to find a holistic solution to the district,” says Chris Cooper, a design partner at SOM, who worked on crafting the Seaport-wide master plan. “[By] moving the air rights upland to 250 Water that becomes the enabler—the economic engine, so to speak—for improvements for the whole district.”


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  #29  
Old Posted Mar 5, 2020, 1:15 AM
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I would prefer a combination of these two versions...I love the pointed top, especially Downtown, but I also love setbacks...







A look at the base...










The planned New Market Building...






New South Street Seaport Museum...


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  #30  
Old Posted Mar 5, 2020, 1:47 AM
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Another overview of the area...





























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  #31  
Old Posted Mar 5, 2020, 1:52 AM
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Awesome news, if it hits 990 feet that is. I wonder if the podium configuration is the only deciding factor in the height. 990 or 880 is pretty good but the other heights are okay but seem like a waste tbh.

But yea NYC
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  #32  
Old Posted Mar 5, 2020, 2:07 AM
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I wonder what the square footage is for plan B. Looks like the most ideal option to max out the site.
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  #33  
Old Posted Mar 5, 2020, 7:51 AM
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I prefer the first two, and wouldn't mind the third... the fourth is too blocky, clunky. We can only hope to keep the NIMBYs at bay here, but they'll try.
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  #34  
Old Posted Mar 5, 2020, 2:50 PM
PhyllisJerry2 PhyllisJerry2 is offline
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I’m hoping they go with option 2, the setbacks plus a masonry facade as depicted in the renderings will fit right in with both the seaport buildings and the older towers in FiDi (and hopefully provide less fodder for NIMBYs). I think this is a simple air-rights transfer as opposed to a weird zoning lot situation so opponents may not have a legal leg to stand on as is.

As a sidenote, I can’t believe there’s been a surface parking lot on this location for so long.
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  #35  
Old Posted Mar 5, 2020, 3:00 PM
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Quote:
a dual tower scenario is one of four options that’s being most seriously considered).

The issue here is more bulk than height. From street level there’s not much difference between 700 ft and 900 ft.
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  #36  
Old Posted Mar 7, 2020, 4:58 PM
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  #37  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2020, 12:13 PM
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Let the battles begin...


http://www.tribecatrib.com/content/a...rce-opposition

Another Tower Plan for the Seaport: 'There's Going to Be Fierce Opposition'




Screen shot from video of Chris Cooper of Skidmore, Owings & Merrill as he shows a model of one of three development concepts for 250 Water Street to a Howard Hughes Corp. "stakeholder workshop." The one pictured is a model of a 990-foot-high building. Video courtesy of Seaport Coalition


By CARL GLASSMAN
Posted Mar. 10, 2020

Quote:
Six years after losing a bruising battle to build a tower at the South Street Seaport, the Howard Hughes Corp. has set the stage for its next development clash with the community.

Last week, at an invitation-only “stakeholder workshop,” Hughes executives and architects from Skidmore, Owings & Merrill revealed their options for a soaring project at 250 Water Street, buildings that would many times exceed zoning limits in the South Street Seaport Historic District. Among the ideas is a residential tower nearly 1,000 feet tall.

To sweeten the deal, the developer is dangling a host of tantalizing neighborhood investments and amenities, chief of which is a new building for the struggling South Street Seaport Museum.
Quote:
Along with a 990-foot-high tower are three other concepts for the site, now a parking lot stretching from Peck Slip and Beekman Street. They include an 880-foot tower that rises in stepped setbacks; two towers, one 770 feet tall, the other 385 feet; and a 285-foot-wide, 570-foot-high building.

Each project, which would include 200 below-market rate apartments, features a base about eight stories high meant to fit in with the low-rise neighborhood and, the developer hopes, convince the Landmarks Preservation Commission that the project is appropriate for the low-rise historic district.
Quote:
At the recent workshop, Skidmore, Owings & Merrill architect Chris Cooper pitched the towers as reasonably sized compared to other Lower Manhattan skyscrapers, while the base is in scale with the neighborhood. In a video, he is shown pointing to a model of the 990-foot-high building and saying: “You see, that base corresponds to the context. And then the height responds to the rest of the city.”
Quote:
“I don’t think they once mentioned that 250 Water Street is in the historic district,” said Paul Goldstein, the chair of Community Board 1’s Waterfront, Parks and Cultural Committee, who attended the workshop. “I don’t think the word historic district even arose.”

Community Board 1 and local activists are expected to fight any large-scale project at 250 Water Street during the public land use review required for a zoning variance. And they are likely to oppose the developer’s efforts to scrap a city rule that specifically prohibits its needed transfer to 250 Water Street of 450,000 square feet of air rights from two Seaport properties that Hughes Corp. leases from the city.

That air rights transfer would almost certainly need the consent of Councilwoman Margaret Chin, who said she has her own doubts. She told the Trib in a statement: “With the future of the Seaport District at stake, the community’s priority is clear: we need a conversation about bulk and density that fully takes into account the context of this historic area. At this point, I don't believe the case has been properly made to residents that an air rights transfer is even necessary.”
Quote:
On a possible air rights transfer, a spokesperson for the city’s Economic Development Corp., the agency that oversees the Seaport properties, emphasized in a statement the long road ahead for the developer, which has to go through a “competitive public procurement as well as multiple land use approval processes.”

“As stewards of the Historic South Street Seaport,” the spokesperson said, “we take the community’s priorities seriously and look forward to engaging further with local stakeholders on how to best equip the neighborhood for the future.”

Hoping to pave a path forward, Hughes Corp. is promising an array of local improvements, including a new $50 million, 30,000-square-foot building for the South Street Seaport Museum at John and South Streets, and a $100 million, 75,000 square-foot building for an undetermined community use, at the site of the current New Market Building. Then there are the host of other possible local improvements, from an upgraded play street for the Peck Slip School to a community theater to a skate park.
Quote:
“We have a rare opportunity to bring affordable housing to an area where it’s in short supply, secure the long-term future of the Seaport Museum, boost resiliency along the waterfront and provide public realm and infrastructure improvements across the historic neighborhood,” a Howard Hughes spokesman said in a statement.

“This neighborhood like any other neighborhood could use improvements. And we like a lot of the things that have been discussed,” Goldstein said. “But the price is not the price we’re willing to pay, and we’re not that desperate for these things to give away ten percent of the historic district.”
Quote:
In a resolution passed last November, CB1 repeated its long-standing position for keeping the existing zoning in the Seaport Historic District that “ensures that new buildings maintain the low scale character of this very special area.” The resolution supports a “Seaport Strategic Vision” drawn up by the Seaport Coalition, an activist group that calls the current height limits non-negotiable.

“We certainly can’t stomach the idea that you can buy your way out of the zoning and that you can buy your way out of history,” said Michael Kramer, a leader of the coalition, which includes Children First, Save Our Seaport, and residents of Southbridge Towers. “This is a very fragile and unique neighborhood.”


Video Link







Concept renderings, inside and out, of a new building for the South Street Seaport Museum at South and John Streets. Credit: Skidmore, Owings & Merrill and the Howard Hughes Corp.



I grabbed some additional shots...














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  #38  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2020, 12:46 PM
JMKeynes JMKeynes is offline
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I love the last one. It reminds me of 270 Park.

I hope that the a..hole residents and Commie politicians don't kill this.

P.S.: The elevated FDR must come down. NYC doesn't need more cars. The FDR can end at the Brooklyn Bridge/City Hall exit. Furthermore, I'd ideally like to eliminate the FDR in its entirety and replace it with an East River Park. Traffic can exit at 125th and go down the avenues.
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  #39  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2020, 1:13 PM
SkyHigher SkyHigher is offline
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I like the second one. 880 footer. If only it was taller.

The one that looks like 270 Park?
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  #40  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2020, 3:11 PM
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I find myself liking the supertall after seeing those models. The 880 footer would be overbearing, not preferable for the neighborhood. As nyguy mentioned, the height is less of an issue from ground level. I can see why SOM prefers the two-tower scheme, dividing the bulk. I have my doubts anything at all will come out of this though. CB1 will sandbag anything tall no matter what incentives the developer offers.
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