NYT:More New Jobs Are in City Centers, While Employment Growth Shrinks in the Suburbs

[10023]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

good point. clustering not only works for individuals looking for greater opportunity in career moves, it also works for the companies who want access to the best talent in the entirety of a given metro area

And to add to this - it also works better in today's world where both partners are likely to have careers.

Suburbia also developed when most wives stayed home. Nowadays, how likely is it for a couple to both work in the same cluster of suburban office parks? More likely you'll have a couple living in the western suburbs because one of them works in Downers Grove and the other commutes to Deerfield or something. The suburban dream of a five minute drive to the office doesn't work in that context. They might as well commute downtown (and at least there would be a train).

[chris08876]

^^^

I recently got a job for a Geology company (Veolia North America) 12 miles from my house. I mean, its kinda good because its a god sent commute, but I'm not in a city. But its still better than commuting to Newark. I've seen the same happen to a couple of friends where they have commutes in the suburbs, and so close to where they live. Always pains me to see those office parks, and think, hey, that could of been a potential skyscraper.

It comes down to money. If its cheaper to build out there, they will. Likewise, if talent is in the area, and with an extensive highway network, they will come. I can see the point of major fortune 500's being located in the cities, but for mid or small sized companies, the suburbs work and are far cheaper rent wise. Even many fortune 500's have operations in the suburbs.

But in the end, I guess I am part of the problem since I work in a suburb lol but its still better than taking I-78, paying for parking, and at times, taking NJ Transit. So from a worker standpoint, convenience is a luxury. Even if we look at NYC, love the place, but the commute there sucks unless you live close by.

[10023]

^ I think you have it exactly backwards. It's the Fortune 500 type companies that the suburbs work best for. They're big, they can get others (suppliers, consultants, accountants, attorneys, etc) to come to them for meetings, and they need to get a lot of heads together in one place. Smaller businesses benefit more from proximity to the other companies that they're doing business with, and with an urban location as a draw in competing for talent.

But cities like NYC aren't really the best example of this trend, because it's just so big and Manhattan is so expensive. The Tri-State area is much too big to be primarily concentrated in one CBD.

[chris08876]

Hmm, your right. Could be maybe the headquarters work best in CBD of major global centers due to the international aspect of it. Thats what I meant to say, but yea, operations and logistical portions of it are plentiful in suburban areas.

I guess though it really does depend on the metro.

[SlidellWx]

Here is a recent video from WWL TV about the continued redevelopment in the New Orleans CBD. It's mostly focused on redevelopments of older buildings into hotels and residences, but also mentions several ground up developments near the end of the video. There has also been positive absorption in the CBD office market for the past several quarters. The CBD is the most vibrant I've seen it in a long time.

http://bcove.me/tqfufnag

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by SlidellWx

There has also been positive absorption in the CBD office market for the past several quarters.

Which is odd considering the utter lack of new construction... this is driven by the repurposing of old industrial buildings to office use, but I would think that is canceled out by the conversion of large old office buildings for hotel and residential.

New Orleans is a small enough market that you can't really rely on quarterly figures to assess the office market... one deal can throw off the figures wildly. What are the growth sectors for office jobs?

[Jasonhouse]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ I used to believe that but, meh, we'll all be driving electric cars some day

Actually, the car will drive you and will probably be owned by a 3rd party.

[SlidellWx]

There is still a lot of space to fill up in the current office towers in New Orleans. 1.4 million square feet in total. Over the last 2 years there has been 300,000 square feet of absorption in the market. If that absorption rate continues, I'd think we have at least another 5 years to go before any new office construction occurs. Overall, the trend is for more absorption of space which was not the case a decade ago.

The drivers in the office market right now are digital media and film, gaming, tech, and bio-science companies.

[JivecitySTL]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

clayton does seem to be a thorn in downtown st. louis' side.

it's great that downtown st. louis is seeing strong residential growth (as we discussed in that other recent thread), but downtown is still somewhat anemic on the jobs front.

here's a comparison of the CBD & downtown employment of cities in our region from a recent study:

city: CBD workers - greater downtown workers

indianapolis: 113,467 - 128,181
milwaukee: 88,110 - 125,581
cleveland: 85,672 - 116,069
st. louis: 67,626 - 90,405
cincinnati: 57,956 - 86,128
kansas city: 39,548 - 66,007

source: http://definingdowntown.org/


without the existence of clayton, i wouldn't be surprised if st. louis were #1 on the above list.

True that, but it's noteworthy that St. Louis's central corridor, stretching from downtown to Midtown to the Central West End to Clayton is holding strong, and easily the most expansive urban stretch in the Midwest outside of Chicago (and maybe Detroit), linked entirely by MetroLink rail.

[C.]

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/...e_booming.html


graphic from Slate.com

Stories about America's urban renaissance have become something of a cliché by now. But there's a reason for that—they're true! Big cities are growing faster than the country as a whole, which is basically for the best (dense urban areas tend to be more efficient and economically productive, after all). And today, the Census Bureau shared its estimates of which locales have expanded quickest in these post-recession years. Among the 25 largest cities in the country, top prize goes to Austin, Texas, which experienced a 12 percent population surge between 2010 and 2013.

[Jasonhouse]

For Miami.

Population, 2013 estimate 417,650
Population, 2010 estimate 399,508
Population, percent change - April 1, 2010 to July 1, 2013 4.5%

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/12/1271000.html


and Tampa.

Population, 2013 estimate 352,957
Population, 2010 estimate 335,715
Population, percent change - April 1, 2010 to July 1, 2013 5.1%

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/12/1271000.html



And little ole Orlando...

Population, 2013 estimate 255,483
Population, 2010 estimate 238,834
Population, percent change - April 1, 2010 to July 1, 2013 7.0%

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/12/1253000.html


Obviously these cities have smaller pops than the cities charted above (so the growth rate can seem amplified), but they are the center cities of notable metros nonetheless.

[llamaorama]

I think it helps too as some metros have become geographically massive.

What kind of sucks about Houston and Dallas is the way that the suburban office trend is still going strong. If you bought a house in Pearland then got a job in The Woodlands you now have a really long commute. And as crawford said if you were a dual income household then both family members are off driving in different directions it might become unworkable.

If more of the jobs were centralized in downtown you could always count on a relatively moderate commute. And it would benefit neglected parts of the region. The overall outcome is more access to affordable housing and letting people put down roots where they live.

[chris08876]

Yeah U.S. metros are massive. And thats not even exaggerating it. Incredible the land they take up and size. While not as dense as other world metros, many just go on and on and are a mix of low and medium density.

[Jasonhouse]

I think it's funny how 'freedom loving' modern day rightwing ideology in the US goes out of its way to say that everyone has a right to a suburban tract home commoditized by Wall St corporations, and subsidized by society at large.

[chris08876]

^^^

I remember flipping to Fox one day to see what those plastic surgery mutants were talking about, and they had a guy on who said that "smart growth" is Obama's way of limiting our freedoms. How he is FORCING smart growth and its going to ruin the fabric of American society. Thing is, people will believe it. Some do view cities as bad, and like you said, they feel entitled to a suburban home with a acre plus of land, and all the roads they can dream of so they can go to Walmart and buy doritos.

Well, luckily, our urban areas are making strides when it comes to mass transit, and developers are incorporating aspects of smart growth, but, we still have a long way to go in this country.

[Leo the Dog]

I think we can thank the creation of cell phones and smart phones with the Rennaisance of our inner cities. Crime dropped because it's simply much more difficult to commit a crime and get away with it if everyone has a camera, gps, and access to 911 in seconds.

Scary areas suddenly became not so scary when you have backup.

[ardecila]

Uh what? The drop in crime happened before the widespread adoption of smartphones.

[Leo the Dog]

Originally Posted by ardecila

Uh what? The drop in crime happened before the widespread adoption of smartphones.

Cell phones were pretty prevalent in the mid/late 90s. Our cities have drastically improved since then, no?

Edit: just googled the subject and others have suggested a strong correlation with the drastic reduction of crime rates coinciding with the mobile phone.

http://www.abajournal.com/mobile/art...us_cellphones/

[Buckeye Native 001]

Statistics and/or Sociology 101: Correlation does not imply causation

[mhays]

The book Freakanomics tied the legalization of abortion to the drop in crime, via a drop in unwanted pregnancies.

Others point to newer policing styles.

I'd also suggest gentrification and infill.

Lots of correlations to debate amongst. Maybe a lot of factors played a part.