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  #13201  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 3:51 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by kolchak View Post
Today:

I swear Cedar Street does construction in the slowest most fucked up manner possible. When is the last time you saw someone put glass on the building starting on top and working down??
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  #13202  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 4:21 PM
ChiPlanner ChiPlanner is offline
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
I swear Cedar Street does construction in the slowest most fucked up manner possible. When is the last time you saw someone put glass on the building starting on top and working down??
If you've watched the construction progress, they stripped the old office building from the top down- therefore have been following the same process for rehabbing the building post demolition work.

Honestly though, this has to be one of the fastest jobs Cedar Street has done. Per Alderman Osterman in March: "Tentative window replacement is scheduled for January 2019," which would place them ahead of schedule.
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  #13203  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 4:35 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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^ great to see this building being put back to use. This will really enliven the area.
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  #13204  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 5:12 PM
k1052 k1052 is online now
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Originally Posted by ChiPlanner View Post
Honestly though, this has to be one of the fastest jobs Cedar Street has done.
Yea I'm actually pretty happily impressed about how quickly this has moved for a developer that never seems to be in a hurry to get jobs done.
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  #13205  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 6:34 PM
JK47 JK47 is offline
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
Lol, this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. If I'm a big business moving into an area why on earth would I want to disclose that and cause speculators to drive up prices before I can acquire the other properties I need? Real Estate is not stocks, there is no group of shareholders reliant on me to disclose things in a uniform and fair manner. If I go to a factory owner and want to buy his building and he wants to sell it to me, why should anyone else be involved? Why would we want anyone else to be involved?

While I agree with your overall point that barring insider trading in real estate is impractical I can't agree with your logic. We arrived at the same answer but your reasoning is, quite frankly, backwards. Your logic above basically amounts to "Prohibiting insider trading would make transactions prohibitively expensive for insiders by allowing the public to bid up the price of parcels" which is actually an argument in favor of barring insider trading.


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The biggest issue with this is that it's impossible for there not to be insider trading. And by this I mean there is wayyyyy too much unique information on each property to ever uniformly disseminate it. A stock is a piece of paper, it has the same rights and value as every other share. One of the defining features of real estate is that literally every parcel is slightly different in terms of location, improvements, size, shape, grade, etc etc. How would you ever possibly capture and quantify all that data? For example I just did a deal on a 100,000 SF old ass warehouse, the amount of data I needed to gather just to get that sale closed was immense and took 6+ months. I needed two rounds of environmental reports (one was 500+ pages, the other 800+ pages), surveys which showed encroachments and easements, had to have leases in hand with tenants, had to get contractor bids, had to examine structural damage from roof leaks, needed to meet with the local politicians to make sure they were OK with my proposed use, had to check local zoning laws, needed to check the taxes, had to get architects involved, etc etc.

The maddening thing though is that, based on this second quote, is you were SO close to a good answer. The prohibition against insider trading arose with and is linked to the requirement to disclose a company's performance and finances to the public as a condition of marketing ownership of the company to the public via a marketplace where incremental portions of the company are bought and sold. Where insiders have sought public ownership they cannot disadvantage the public by trading their own securities using information they have not disclosed to the public. In the real estate context, in order to prohibit insider trading there would need to be a much greater level of transparency in terms of information on specific parcels and buildings that would be disclosed to the general public. That kind of reporting is simply impractical for the numerous reasons indicated in the second quote above. Real estate is generally held privately and most often wholly and is not owned by shareholders who buy/sell the lots in a marketplace. Thus since insiders have not co-mingled their ownership with members of the public there's no interest served by prohibiting purchases based on insider information.
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  #13206  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 7:58 PM
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BVictor1 BVictor1 is online now
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Atrium Village was a draw vote

6 - Yay
6 - Nay

I've never seen a more explosive plan commission. Alderman/Commissioner Burnett railed on Alderman Tunney and told to to mind the business and politics of his own ward. I wish I was filming.

The project goes before zoning and council without a recommendation from the commission.

The project was Atrium Village
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  #13207  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 8:02 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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^ what was the vote on?
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  #13208  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 8:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Vlajos View Post
^ what was the vote on?
Atrium Village
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  #13209  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 8:10 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
Atrium Village
I'm sorry, what specifically. Isn't it already under construction.
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  #13210  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 8:22 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is online now
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^ I think they wanted to increase the density and add more units.

Damn, even more reason they need to look at adding a Brown Line stop on Division
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  #13211  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 8:34 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by JK47 View Post
While I agree with your overall point that barring insider trading in real estate is impractical I can't agree with your logic. We arrived at the same answer but your reasoning is, quite frankly, backwards. Your logic above basically amounts to "Prohibiting insider trading would make transactions prohibitively expensive for insiders by allowing the public to bid up the price of parcels" which is actually an argument in favor of barring insider trading.
No, my point is that it's not only impractical, but there is no point. In order to "ban insider trading" you would have to make all information public on a regular basis which isn't possible because most property owners don't even have all information on their property. So you would constantly be doing environmental reports and surveys on properties for literally no reason because they aren't even on the market.





Quote:
The maddening thing though is that, based on this second quote, is you were SO close to a good answer. The prohibition against insider trading arose with and is linked to the requirement to disclose a company's performance and finances to the public as a condition of marketing ownership of the company to the public via a marketplace where incremental portions of the company are bought and sold. Where insiders have sought public ownership they cannot disadvantage the public by trading their own securities using information they have not disclosed to the public. In the real estate context, in order to prohibit insider trading there would need to be a much greater level of transparency in terms of information on specific parcels and buildings that would be disclosed to the general public. That kind of reporting is simply impractical for the numerous reasons indicated in the second quote above. Real estate is generally held privately and most often wholly and is not owned by shareholders who buy/sell the lots in a marketplace. Thus since insiders have not co-mingled their ownership with members of the public there's no interest served by prohibiting purchases based on insider information.
That's my point though, there is no one harmed by a real estate transaction being completed where one party knows something the other doesn't except the disadvantaged party. That's classic caveat emptor or in this case seller. There is some regulation in real estate, but it actually only pertains to sellers, not buyers. If you are selling a property you must disclose known defects to a buyer. Ironically this further surpresses the flow of information because sellers and owners often take a "I don't wanna know" stance on big issues like environmental. They would rather dump the property at a lower price than take the risk themselves that there is something terrible they will discover that they will be forced to disclose to any other potential buyer.

I actually just got a multi hundred thousand dollar discount because of this. They buyer said "look, just waive environmental contingency and I'll give you a discount to compensate for the risk", so I did it and it turns out there's only $35k of asbestos remediation and nothing else. But it could have turned out that I have to set up a super expensive remediation system to remove hydro carbons from the soil under the building.
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  #13212  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 9:01 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
^ I think they wanted to increase the density and add more units.

Damn, even more reason they need to look at adding a Brown Line stop on Division
They completed the first building and a second is under construction. So they plan to build more? Why did people vote against it?
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  #13213  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Vlajos View Post
They completed the first building and a second is under construction. So they plan to build more? Why did people vote against it?
Yes, this is for phase three.
https://twitter.com/ChicagoDPD/statu...73646692970496

What was the issue? Affordable housing?
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  #13214  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 10:26 PM
west-town-brad west-town-brad is offline
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
I've never seen a more explosive plan commission. Alderman/Commissioner Burnett railed on Alderman Tunney and told to to mind the business and politics of his own ward. I wish I was filming.
oh, the politics and intrigue of the city council!
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  #13215  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 10:53 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Originally Posted by r18tdi View Post
Yes, this is for phase three.
https://twitter.com/ChicagoDPD/statu...73646692970496

What was the issue? Affordable housing?
Oh yeah, completely forgot it was to be 3 buildings. I assumed it was approved already either way. What was the hang up? This is pretty rare, right?
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  #13216  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 11:45 PM
Barrelfish Barrelfish is offline
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
Atrium Village was a draw vote

6 - Yay
6 - Nay

I've never seen a more explosive plan commission. Alderman/Commissioner Burnett railed on Alderman Tunney and told to to mind the business and politics of his own ward. I wish I was filming.

The project goes before zoning and council without a recommendation from the commission.

The project was Atrium Village
Please share the juicy details. A twitter search was unhelpful.

On the plus side, the rehabs of both the Uptown Theater and the Congress Theater were approved (the latter with a rental development as well). Good news for some great old spaces, and maybe it will help convince Lincoln Yards to drop it's silly entertainment district.
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  #13217  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2018, 12:30 AM
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BVictor1 BVictor1 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r18tdi View Post
Yes, this is for phase three.
https://twitter.com/ChicagoDPD/statu...73646692970496

What was the issue? Affordable housing?
Yes... The issue was affordable housing and how it's being or not being distributed through the project

Quote:
^ I think they wanted to increase the density and add more units.

Damn, even more reason they need to look at adding a Brown Line stop on Division
Not really added density, but more of a reshuffling. There were originally going to be 4-tower, now there will be 3. A nine-story building currently existing won't be demolished, so this tower took on those units.

Everyone is in agreement about a new stop on the brown line, but it's about the $$. The alderman wants it.
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  #13218  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2018, 3:21 AM
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Sounds like the project will get figured out then... Not too worried about this split decision
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  #13219  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2018, 2:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
Yes... The issue was affordable housing and how it's being or not being distributed through the project

...

There were originally going to be 4-tower, now there will be 3. A nine-story building currently existing won't be demolished, so this tower took on those units.
I figured a much, this issue between Onni and Burnett has been brewing for a while. Probably a big reason why the Greyhound Goose Island project is DOA.
I'm all for putting a third taller tower at AV, but a dedicated income-segregated building is simply bad policy.
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  #13220  
Old Posted Dec 21, 2018, 3:00 PM
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* Moderator Note *

Aon Center observation deck discussion moved to the Aon Center thread: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=154966
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"Missing middle" housing can be a great middle ground for many middle class families.
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