CHICAGO | Rush University Medical Center | 14 FLOORS | COM

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by J_M_Tungsten

I haven't heard that there was going to be retail in the Ortho building. I know there will be some sort of retail on the ground floor of the new main hospital on the corner of Harrison and Ashland. I also know for sure that there will be retail on the ground floor of Flournoy and Paulina in the new parking structure. Where did you hear the plans for retail in the ortho building spyguy? The first floor of the ortho building so far is just the main lobby for Midwest orthopedics and the street side of the building is void of any doors, not sure where they would put the retail .

^ According to this, there is supposed to be retail in the Ortho building.

Also, can somebody explain to me why this parking structure is being built when there already is a gargantuan garage already in existence behind the u/c Ortho building?

[J_M_Tungsten]

Rush has thousands of employees and they claim that they are making more room for patients in the main garage and the new garage will be for employees and students of the college only, there by freeing up the main structure. There is still a rush owned parking garage on the north side of 290, which is almost to capacity, which shows you just how many people work at rush! I hate parking structures for the most part, they do little to enhance the surroundings and are ugly to look at, but I think the new one looks quite nice and it will have some retail so that should help a bit. I'm doubting that the retail will be on the ground floor of the ortho building, only because rush is notorious for having retail easily accessible to patients from the inside of the hospital, rather than for the surrounding community

[the urban politician]

^ My main pet peeve with this part of town is that, with the exception of Taylor St (which is mostly restaurants and cafes), it seems to lack a walkable retail strip. The strip center at Roosevelt and Ashland just does so little to improve that situation. I feel really, really bad for the residents and med students training at Rush/UIC/Stroger who either a) will not get to enjoy the kind of urban experience Chicago has to offer because they have to live in this poorly planned part of town, or b) may choose to live elsewhere but then will have to commute.

While other Universities (Columbia College, UIC, Roosevelt, U of C) are busy creating attractive, walkable, liveable campuses, the IMD is still stuck in a 1960's mentality of superblocks, commuter parking behemoths, and strip center shopping.

[J_M_Tungsten]

My thoughts exactly. I worked at childrens memorial in Lincoln park, and now at rush. The differences of the surroundings are huge!! It was so nice being able to walk to the starbucks or to one of many local restaurants or shops. Now I just run back to my car and go home. It would be great to be able to have the same experience at childrens at rush with out fearing walking around the neighborhood! It is doubtful that this will change anytime soon, and that Roosevelt- Ashland corner is pretty "depressing" for urban "shopping".

[the urban politician]

^ Yeah, the only hope comes from a development planned on the site that was formerly planned to be a tech park. It has a lot of potential towards improving the desirability of this area--it would be hard to find those renderings again, but I think Spyguy posted them somewhere about a year ago.

You know, being in the health profession I can tell you that doctors are just so damn one-track minded. They are so focused on patient care and research, research, research that they forget that you need to provide MORE than that to attract talent. When students/residents/staff look at a potential employer they always look at the hospital's surroundings. Nowadays that is very important--people want to be able to live near their jobs and actually take pride in their neighborhood, and that usually entails attractive streetscapes and walkability. IMD will forever be at a disadvantage in attracting talent from, say NWU and U of C as long as their campus looks like some concrete goliath dropped next door to an expressway, a strip center, and large swaths of useless, empty space. These people really need to get their noses out of their medical texts and operating suites for just a few minutes, take a look around, and realize this simple concept.

[ChicagoChicago]

Originally Posted by J_M_Tungsten

My thoughts exactly. I worked at childrens memorial in Lincoln park, and now at rush. The differences of the surroundings are huge!! It was so nice being able to walk to the starbucks or to one of many local restaurants or shops. Now I just run back to my car and go home. It would be great to be able to have the same experience at childrens at rush with out fearing walking around the neighborhood! It is doubtful that this will change anytime soon, and that Roosevelt- Ashland corner is pretty "depressing" for urban "shopping".

My wife now works at Rush, and we live about 10 minutes (walking) from Children’s. It makes very little sense for Rush (financially) to design their facilities around a plan to make the area more walkable when the entire surrounding area is absolutely not walker friendly.

Also, as you know, the people that work at hospitals work absurd hours, including days that start at 4am. They will almost always drive given the choice, simply for the convenience and speed of getting in. If they worked more normal hours, it would be understandable to expect a more transit oriented staff.

[the urban politician]

^ I disagree.

One, nobody is telling people not to drive to Rush. Fine, build the garages, whatever--that's not the issue.

There is no reason why a developer can't build a walkable community in that area, but if nobody comes up with a plan then it's a missed opportunity.

When I interviewed at Rush for residency years ago, the location and the surroundings were one of the reasons why I ranked them so poorly and ended up going elsewhere. The truth is, Rush basically has to apologize for its surroundings, a scenario that will forever put them at a disadvantage.

The IMD employs tens of thousands of people--they have the clout. For example, how about some streetscaping? How about some nice median pedestrian islands and planters/flowers on the streets, so that their employees living in those apts/townhomes in the area or staying at the Marriot don't have to feel like they are crossing deadly expressways on their way to/between the hospital/physician offices? These things matter to people. The lawyers, bankers, corporate types downtown get this stuff--but for some reason people in health care often don't.

Instead of that hell-hole at Roosevelt/Ashland, couldn't the IMD have worked with the developer to create something more akin to University Village? I know many of you don't care much for University Village, but I promise you that if Rush worked with some developers to create a campus like atmosphere (apts, townhomes, some street level convenience retail such as cleaners, pharmacy, white hen pantry, bank, subway, ice cream shop, a tavern or two) it would go a long way toward attracting talent to that hospital.

[ChicagoChicago]

^^^
Walkable where though? Rush’s campus is somewhat compact, and the surrounding area leaves a lot to be desired.

Isn’t it really the city’s job to fund streetscaping? Excluding the sidewalks, which I’m sure will be redone as the buildings are renovated/built, what else can they do? Putting planters in the middle of the street is going to impact traffic flow, and likely require Rush to cede right-of-way to the city.

[J_M_Tungsten]

I completely agree with you TUP. With the thousands of people that work in this area I can't imagine why no one has capitalized on a 24 hour coffee house, other than a Dunkin Donuts in the Polk station "L" stop (actually not even sure its 24 hours?) and the awful cold coffee from Au Bon Pain (horribly run store btw) inside the hospital. The closest retail and restaurant area is Taylor st, which is a bit of a walk from Rush (not including the Sbarro's Pizza that closes at 5pm, umm dinnertime?) From a financial aspect, this area is a goldmine. With so many people with a mid to large income, this area could become very profitable for businesses. Btw, I love the idea to build a University Village like street life. It’s extremely sad that the area around Rush even has to become a factor for students and residents choosing to come to Rush.

Also, the majority of workers are on first or second shift, more than enough reason to get restaurants or shops into the mix. Peak times could be 6:15-6:45am for breakfast, 11:00am- 1:00pm for lunch, and 4:00pm-6:00pm for dinner. If I were a restaurant owner looker for thousands of neglected people to serve breakfast, lunch, and dinner to, I couldn't think of a better spot than this campus.

With that said, Chicago you are right. As it stands now this area is very undesirable to walk through or even live in. Maybe I'm just a hopeful, possibly disillusioned, optimist, but I see potential in this area and would love to see it come alive with more than just ambulances. Children’s Memorial does great, as well as Northwestern, why not Rush? The area is slowly, SLOWLY, turning better, and I think in another 15-20 years this area WILL be booming!

[J_M_Tungsten]

Originally Posted by ChicagoChicago

^^^
Isn’t it really the city’s job to fund streetscaping? Excluding the sidewalks, which I’m sure will be redone as the buildings are renovated/built, what else can they do? Putting planters in the middle of the street is going to impact traffic flow, and likely require Rush to cede right-of-way to the city.

Trust me traffic around there already sucks, adding nice plants wont make a difference. Also, if they make the area nicer to live in, maybe more people will move to the area, thereby reducing traffic.

[ChicagoChicago]

I totally agree that there are development opportunities in the area. The sheer amount of catered food that comes in could support businesses. I suppose my only argument is that Rush needs to stick with the hospital business, and let private development come to the area.

[J_M_Tungsten]

The hospital isn't worrying about retail development, nor do they need to be, I agree with you there. They are focused on expanding the medical center to take in more patients and better serve the people of the community. The problem is that developers are not seeing the potential of this area, and this is the dilemma.

[Abner]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

IMD will forever be at a disadvantage in attracting talent from, say NWU and U of C as long as their campus looks like some concrete goliath dropped next door to an expressway, a strip center, and large swaths of useless, empty space.

Exactly. I don't think the conversation so far has sufficiently emphasized just how horrible a place the IMD is. TUP, did you work or study there at any point? If so, you know how crappy it is to be stuck there all day. It's a suburban office park in the middle of the city. Considering what a huge job center it is, it's absolutely shocking how little retail is there.

Unfortunately, the IMD itself is to blame for this pathetic state of affairs. Virtually all the land anywhere near the hospitals, except the surrounding housing developments, is hospital-owned. The amount of unchecked power the IMD wields over its surroundings is probably unequaled anywhere else in the city. The hospitals that constitute the IMD do not seem to have any interest whatsoever in selling or renting space in their older buildings to create a more diverse mix of uses. It's almost impossible for most of the office workers in the area to walk anywhere other than the cafeteria for lunch or to find any basic retail in the area. So while it's true that hospitals should stick to the health care business, it sort of changes things when the hospitals own the entire neighborhood.

Of course if you want to see just how silly the current state of affairs is, you need look no further than the vast wasteland between Roosevelt and the train tracks. Of course there are historical and logistical reasons that make developing that land difficult, but I have a hard time believing it would be 100% vacant for so long if it weren't being sat on by the IMD, apparently as it awaits some unfathomable future in which it needs to almost double in land area.

[whyhuhwhy]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ Yeah, the only hope comes from a development planned on the site that was formerly planned to be a tech park. It has a lot of potential towards improving the desirability of this area--it would be hard to find those renderings again, but I think Spyguy posted them somewhere about a year ago.

You know, being in the health profession I can tell you that doctors are just so damn one-track minded. They are so focused on patient care and research, research, research that they forget that you need to provide MORE than that to attract talent. When students/residents/staff look at a potential employer they always look at the hospital's surroundings. Nowadays that is very important--people want to be able to live near their jobs and actually take pride in their neighborhood, and that usually entails attractive streetscapes and walkability. IMD will forever be at a disadvantage in attracting talent from, say NWU and U of C as long as their campus looks like some concrete goliath dropped next door to an expressway, a strip center, and large swaths of useless, empty space. These people really need to get their noses out of their medical texts and operating suites for just a few minutes, take a look around, and realize this simple concept.

Hmmm as one of these doctors who just signed a 5 year contract with Rush starting in 2010 I have to say you are being awfully harsh. Part of the reason I personally chose the IMD over Northwestern, which is where I currently work, is because of the much easier commute from the suburbs and ease of parking. The IMD is a destination center, it is not a live-work-play area and shouldn't be. Now I agree with you that perhaps the surrounding neighborhoods are not living up to their potential. But to put this on the shoulders of doctors, and paint with such a broad brush that doctors "only care about research" and to pretend they don't like desirable neighborhoods (WTF?) and they are somehow at fault is just strange. I mean how broad of a brush do you have to paint here, LOL. Let's get realistic: much of the revenue has to come from the vast suburbs who are transfers from outside hospitals or patients with more complicated situations that the suburban hospitals can't handle. This isn't a local community hospital, this is one of the largest medical districts in the country and a virtual Rochester, MN in the middle of the city. The IMD handles these cases. If you are having open heart surgery you come here, and you will 99% of the time drive from some place else. If you are a doctor you work weird hours, and you will 99% drive from some place else. Heck, I drive from Lakeview, because it is unacceptable as a Radiologist to be late for work and I have been late far too many times taking the L.

The IMD and Rush in particular is particularly well positioned to become a major center for care for all of these people, if it isn't already, as it has some of the easiest access from all areas of Chicago anywhere, especially from the vast suburban areas, being situationed at basically the Circle and four of Chicago's main expressways. And it has to keep this in mind. Jane Oak Brook and Bob Lombard and Suzy Burr Ridge and Tom Winnetka hopefully will all get their transplant surgery done here. That's the goal. And they will all drive and park. That said, I agree that it would be nice to make the surrounding neighborhoods better, but let's be realistic, doctors are probably not going to be living near Rush/IMD for a long long time. But I agree that the area is not living up to its potential. But this is 100% the job of private developers and the surrounding area. The district is doing all it can financially to become an exceptional center of health care. It is no more a Radiologist's job to make the community urban and walkable than it is a commerical developer's job to tell me what is on my patients spiral lung CT. That said, EVERY doctor I know would support and sign on the dotted line a proposition to make the surrounding area more walkable and "nice." Heck I may even take some time off from all my massive research and having my nose in books all day to do it, LOL!

[whyhuhwhy]

Originally Posted by J_M_Tungsten

With that said, Chicago you are right. As it stands now this area is very undesirable to walk through or even live in. Maybe I'm just a hopeful, possibly disillusioned, optimist, but I see potential in this area and would love to see it come alive with more than just ambulances. Children’s Memorial does great, as well as Northwestern, why not Rush? The area is slowly, SLOWLY, turning better, and I think in another 15-20 years this area WILL be booming!

I agree with your post, but the bolded part I was like huh? Northwestern is in Streeterville right off of Michigan Avenue, and Children's is in the heart of perhaps the most desirable intersection of Lincoln Park mere blocks from Depaul University. It isn't Rush's fault that the West Side isn't urban and walkable and hip and cool and booming anymore than Northwestern is responsible for building Michigan Avenue into what it is, or Children's for how great the area around Depaul is. Completely apples and oranges neighborhood wise, and I think you have the egg before the chicken. Though I do share your optimism and goals!

[whyhuhwhy]

Originally Posted by J_M_Tungsten

The hospital isn't worrying about retail development, nor do they need to be, I agree with you there. They are focused on expanding the medical center to take in more patients and better serve the people of the community. The problem is that developers are not seeing the potential of this area, and this is the dilemma.

There you go. Agreed. Hopefully this will change though. I think it is. Pilsen is becoming the next Wicker Park IMHO, and that is right on the IMD's doorstop.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by whyhuhwhy

Hmmm as one of these doctors who just signed a 5 year contract with Rush starting in 2010 I have to say you are being awfully harsh. Part of the reason I personally chose the IMD over Northwestern, which is where I currently work, is because of the much easier commute from the suburbs and ease of parking. The IMD is a destination center, it is not a live-work-play area and shouldn't be. Now I agree with you that perhaps the surrounding neighborhoods are not living up to their potential. But to put this on the shoulders of doctors, and paint with such a broad brush that doctors "only care about research" and to pretend they don't like desirable neighborhoods (WTF?) and they are somehow at fault is just strange. I mean how broad of a brush do you have to paint here, LOL. Let's get realistic: much of the revenue has to come from the vast suburbs who are transfers from outside hospitals or patients with more complicated situations that the suburban hospitals can't handle. This isn't a local community hospital, this is one of the largest medical districts in the country and a virtual Rochester, MN in the middle of the city. The IMD handles these cases. If you are having open heart surgery you come here, and you will 99% of the time drive from some place else. If you are a doctor you work weird hours, and you will 99% drive from some place else. Heck, I drive from Lakeview, because it is unacceptable as a Radiologist to be late for work and I have been late far too many times taking the L.

The IMD and Rush in particular is particularly well positioned to become a major center for care for all of these people, if it isn't already, as it has some of the easiest access from all areas of Chicago anywhere, especially from the vast suburban areas, being situationed at basically the Circle and four of Chicago's main expressways. And it has to keep this in mind. Jane Oak Brook and Bob Lombard and Suzy Burr Ridge and Tom Winnetka hopefully will all get their transplant surgery done here. That's the goal. And they will all drive and park. That said, I agree that it would be nice to make the surrounding neighborhoods better, but let's be realistic, doctors are probably not going to be living near Rush/IMD for a long long time. But I agree that the area is not living up to its potential. But this is 100% the job of private developers and the surrounding area. The district is doing all it can financially to become an exceptional center of health care. It is no more a Radiologist's job to make the community urban and walkable than it is a commerical developer's job to tell me what is on my patients spiral lung CT. That said, EVERY doctor I know would support and sign on the dotted line a proposition to make the surrounding area more walkable and "nice." Heck I may even take some time off from all my massive research and having my nose in books all day to do it, LOL!

^ So we agree that the area is not living up to its potential. Because, all due respect, the entire rest of your post argues against a point that I never made. I never said that the IMD should not have ample parking.

Being an Internist/Hospitalist, I for one guarantee you that I get the importance of automobile access to a hospital, especially if you have to get back and forth between 2 hospitals or the clinic and hospital. My issue continues to be with the neighborhood around the IMD. But, perhaps that will change with time...

[whyhuhwhy]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ So we agree that the area is not living up to its potential. Because, all due respect, the entire rest of your post argues against a point that I never made. I never said that the IMD should not have ample parking.

Being an Internist/Hospitalist, I for one guarantee you that I get the importance of automobile access to a hospital, especially if you have to get back and forth between 2 hospitals or the clinic and hospital. My issue continues to be with the neighborhood around the IMD. But, perhaps that will change with time...

Sorry it is just as easy for me to get jumpy at the quick anti-automobile attitude that runs rampant on this forums as it is for someone to get jumpy and quick to say no at the idea of adding more parking on here. I took your post for not what it was--I guess I automatically assume everyone on this forum wants everywhere to eventually be middle Manhattan, LOL. I think you were being a little harsh on the docs though. No doc I know wants anything less than an area to become nicer. This is the job of the developers though. Unfortunately we are in the middle of a very deep recession that is clearly getting worse. I have seen almost every major project halted lately. Heck there is a 10 story building near my house on Belmont and California that has just been sitting there, unfinished with no one working on it, for months now. It is incredible the times we are living in.

Appreciate the pics guys. Keep 'em coming. This will be an outstanding hospital, and very visible from the Eisenhower.

[J_M_Tungsten]

Some new pics of the site, the shape of the south end of the building is starting to take shape.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by whyhuhwhy

Heck there is a 10 story building near my house on Belmont and California that has just been sitting there, unfinished with no one working on it, for months now. It is incredible the times we are living in.

^ OUCH! Ten stories is some good density.

Are you talking about this project?