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  #1301  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 12:47 AM
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urbandreamer urbandreamer is offline
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Exactly one year after my dog died, my car almost died. Thankfully I didn't need an expensive tow. Alternator is shot. It's an old car but I think it has another 150,000km to go before I retire it. So far have gotten 35,000km out of a $2000 car. Good value imo. Had to take the TTC home in a pandemic again - some people were cough cough coughing another tool kept lowering his mask.
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  #1302  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 6:32 AM
ssiguy ssiguy is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theman23 View Post
UK to ban new petrol and diesel car sales by 2030:
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-54981425

Hybrids allowed until 2035.
That's great news and clearly exemplifies how we are very quickly phasing out ICE.

What will be really interesting to see is what our cars look like post-ICE. Cars have gotten so small but many people under 40 doesn't realise that what today is considered a large car would have once been considered a glorified tin can.

The shrinkage of car sizes began in the 1970s with the oil embargo and increasing environmental concerns combined with new competition from Japan.
After the end of ICE, pollution and gas mileage concwerns will no longer be relevant and it will be interesting to see if we go back to larger cars and the more individualistic designs they once had as opposed to today where all cars are essentially the same design and are a study in beige.
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  #1303  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 9:45 AM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by ssiguy View Post
That's great news and clearly exemplifies how we are very quickly phasing out ICE.

What will be really interesting to see is what our cars look like post-ICE. Cars have gotten so small but many people under 40 doesn't realise that what today is considered a large car would have once been considered a glorified tin can.

The shrinkage of car sizes began in the 1970s with the oil embargo and increasing environmental concerns combined with new competition from Japan.
After the end of ICE, pollution and gas mileage concwerns will no longer be relevant and it will be interesting to see if we go back to larger cars and the more individualistic designs they once had as opposed to today where all cars are essentially the same design and are a study in beige.
Car size hasn’t related to mileage for decades. A little Q3 crossover has the same horsepower as a 1955 Deville. The 1964 Tbird that she had “fun, fun, fun” in has less HP than a little S3. Tastes in larger vehicles shifted to trucks years ago, and probably won’t ever come back.
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  #1304  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 2:58 PM
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chris08876 chris08876 is online now
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I'll miss ICE when its gone. I've driven the Teslas, and its just not the same, not the same.

IDK, maybe I just like ICE cars, but it will be missed.

On the topic of self driven cars... driving is a pleasure IMO. A sort of freedom. Just sitting in the car, reading the newspaper, while it drives itself, its just not the same.

Self driving or electric can't replace the feeling and engagement of a good manual transmission nor can it replicate the joy of a high powered ICE car.
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  #1305  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 7:23 PM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssiguy View Post
That's great news and clearly exemplifies how we are very quickly phasing out ICE.

What will be really interesting to see is what our cars look like post-ICE. Cars have gotten so small but many people under 40 doesn't realise that what today is considered a large car would have once been considered a glorified tin can.

The shrinkage of car sizes began in the 1970s with the oil embargo and increasing environmental concerns combined with new competition from Japan.
After the end of ICE, pollution and gas mileage concwerns will no longer be relevant and it will be interesting to see if we go back to larger cars and the more individualistic designs they once had as opposed to today where all cars are essentially the same design and are a study in beige.
What are you talking about?

Cars have gotten bigger. Compare any of the same model to its predecessor from 2-3 decades ago.

As an example, I compared to 2020 Corolla and a 1990 Corolla.

Passenger volume: 89 ft3 vs. 84 ft3
Luggage volume: 13 ft3 vs. 11 ft3
Curb Weight: 2888 lbs vs. 1940 lbs

What is notable is that safety and fuel economy have also improved:

Driverside front crash rating: 5 star vs. 3 star
Passengerside front crash rating: 5 star vs. 2 star
Fuel economy (combined): 37 mpg vs. 25 mpg

Source: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find...=15844&id=6619 .... and Wikipedia.


Cars have gotten noticeably larger and substantially heavier. And a lot of buyers are upsizing the models themselves. This is actually a particularly worrisome trend in Canada, wiping out a substantial fuel economy gains and leaving Canada with among the worst fuel economy per km, in the world:

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  #1306  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 7:59 PM
wave46 wave46 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truenorth00 View Post
What are you talking about?

Cars have gotten bigger. Compare any of the same model to its predecessor from 2-3 decades ago.

As an example, I compared to 2020 Corolla and a 1990 Corolla.

Passenger volume: 89 ft3 vs. 84 ft3
Luggage volume: 13 ft3 vs. 11 ft3
Curb Weight: 2888 lbs vs. 1940 lbs

What is notable is that safety and fuel economy have also improved:

Driverside front crash rating: 5 star vs. 3 star
Passengerside front crash rating: 5 star vs. 2 star
Fuel economy (combined): 37 mpg vs. 25 mpg

Source: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find...=15844&id=6619 .... and Wikipedia.


Cars have gotten noticeably larger and substantially heavier. And a lot of buyers are upsizing the models themselves. This is actually a particularly worrisome trend in Canada, wiping out a substantial fuel economy gains and leaving Canada with among the worst fuel economy per km, in the world:
Cars declined in size and weight from the early 1970s to the mid 1980s.

From the 1980s onward, they've increased in size and weight. Some of this gain has been dedicated has been improving safety, a laudable goal unto itself.

Per pound, cars are more efficient today than any time in history. The problem as you mention is that the median Canadian vehicle is now much heavier than its predecessor.

I say the larger problem (pun not intended) is that Canadians are selecting bigger and heavier vehicles. The F-series is the best-selling vehicle in Canada today. It wasn't before. The top 10 is now dominated by trucks/SUVs, whereas models like the Civic and Corolla used to be on that list.
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  #1307  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2020, 9:50 PM
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I used to hate the Toyota Corolla but the latest hatchback model is nice. I could see myself buying a used 2020 model c.2024. Because I missed two and half decades of cars I feel like buying random cars I've admired over the years just to drive them for a while. eg I'd like to drive the original Smart For Two, the '93 Mazda RX-7, original Acura NSX, late 90s Lotus Elise.
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  #1308  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2020, 1:04 AM
Mister F Mister F is offline
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Originally Posted by wave46 View Post
The top 10 is now dominated by trucks/SUVs, whereas models like the Civic and Corolla used to be on that list.
They still are.
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  #1309  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2020, 1:06 AM
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In Canada they are but not the US from my understanding.

Historically compacts sold better in Canada and the US bought mid sized though, so they have always trended towards slightly larger vehicles. (I.e the Accord sold better in the US than the Civic)
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  #1310  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2020, 1:26 AM
Mister F Mister F is offline
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Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
In Canada they are but not the US from my understanding.

Historically compacts sold better in Canada and the US bought mid sized though, so they have always trended towards slightly larger vehicles. (I.e the Accord sold better in the US than the Civic)
We were talking about Canada.

But since you bring up the US, both cars are in the top 10 in the US, at least in 2019. With the ongoing arms race on the roads, who knows how long that will last.
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  #1311  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2020, 2:14 AM
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Why the hell can't Canada come up with one car of their own? Pisses me off.

Would probably be covered in vinyl siding though.
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  #1312  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2020, 3:54 PM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wave46 View Post
Cars declined in size and weight from the early 1970s to the mid 1980s.

From the 1980s onward, they've increased in size and weight. Some of this gain has been dedicated has been improving safety, a laudable goal unto itself.

Per pound, cars are more efficient today than any time in history. The problem as you mention is that the median Canadian vehicle is now much heavier than its predecessor.

I say the larger problem (pun not intended) is that Canadians are selecting bigger and heavier vehicles. The F-series is the best-selling vehicle in Canada today. It wasn't before. The top 10 is now dominated by trucks/SUVs, whereas models like the Civic and Corolla used to be on that list.
The safety and efficiency gains are laudable. But at the end of the days, heavier vehicles do negate a small portion of those efficiency gains. And upsizing negates a massive proportion of the efficiency gains. Canada' vehicle fleet would be averaging over 30 mpg if we had the same mix of vehicle types as they 80s today.


Forget a carbon tax. The government needs to start taxing vehicles by GVWR to get Canucks to slim down a bit on vehicle sizes.
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  #1313  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2020, 4:59 PM
wave46 wave46 is offline
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Originally Posted by Mister F View Post
I stand corrected.

But looking at this list for 2001, there are many more compact cars.

2. Honda Civic.
4. Chevrolet Cavalier
5. Mazda Protege
7. Ford Focus
8. Pontiac Sunfire
10. Toyota Corolla
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  #1314  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2020, 5:06 PM
wave46 wave46 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truenorth00 View Post
The safety and efficiency gains are laudable. But at the end of the days, heavier vehicles do negate a small portion of those efficiency gains. And upsizing negates a massive proportion of the efficiency gains. Canada' vehicle fleet would be averaging over 30 mpg if we had the same mix of vehicle types as they 80s today.


Forget a carbon tax. The government needs to start taxing vehicles by GVWR to get Canucks to slim down a bit on vehicle sizes.
I'm wondering if that will even work. People still buy these things even with a higher purchase price (the biggest cost of a vehicle overall) and in an era of >$1/litre fuel prices, so I think it represents a fundamental change in the market.

Maybe in an era of the Bank of Canada rate being 5.5% as it was in early 2001 might change that. Auto loans were probably close to double that, so that would be the bigger factor.
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  #1315  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 6:10 PM
jonny24 jonny24 is offline
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Now this is intriguing, you'll be able to buy an electric crate motor in 2021 from GM:

https://arstechnica.com/cars/2020/10...lt-ev-hotrods/

So you'll be able to electrify classics. Ultimate restomod. I wonder how the batter packs will work though, they did it on an old K5 Blazer and used the whole rear area for the battery. Do they need to wide+flat like that or will other form factors work (I.e., maybe replacing the gas tank?


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  #1316  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 6:21 PM
wave46 wave46 is offline
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Originally Posted by jonny24 View Post
Now this is intriguing, you'll be able to buy an electric crate motor in 2021 from GM:

https://arstechnica.com/cars/2020/10...lt-ev-hotrods/

So you'll be able to electrify classics. Ultimate restomod. I wonder how the batter packs will work though, they did it on an old K5 Blazer and used the whole rear area for the battery. Do they need to wide+flat like that or will other form factors work (I.e., maybe replacing the gas tank?
Interesting idea, but if there's a set of vehicles that should have an internal combustion engine, classic cars should be them.

For a drag-strip wonder, sure, electrics all the way.

A mint 1970 Dodge Challenger or 1970 Chevrolet Chevelle? It doesn't seem right to not have a V8 rumble and big-cam lopey idle.
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  #1317  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 6:43 PM
lio45 lio45 is offline
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I was going to say, "hey, that's a K5 Blazer/Jimmy!" but then I noticed you'd pointed that out already
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  #1318  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 6:50 PM
lio45 lio45 is offline
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Originally Posted by wave46 View Post
Interesting idea, but if there's a set of vehicles that should have an internal combustion engine, classic cars should be them.

For a drag-strip wonder, sure, electrics all the way.

A mint 1970 Dodge Challenger or 1970 Chevrolet Chevelle? It doesn't seem right to not have a V8 rumble and big-cam lopey idle.
I almost bought a 1939 Ford coupe shell (no drivetrain) a while ago, and instead of a proper flathead I wanted to put an electric motor in it. My good friend who's an electrical engineer (and Nissan Leaf driver) convinced me not to attempt that, but I think he failed to see the point of having classic steel to drive around in (his main argument was "a used Leaf would be much much cheaper and a LOT less trouble!")
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  #1319  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 7:47 PM
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Toyota is about to release a prototype ev equipped with solid state batteries, with the expectation of mass production in 2025. Solid state batteries have 2x the energy density of current lithium batteries, and they charge much faster.
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  #1320  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 7:58 PM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Originally Posted by logan5 View Post
Toyota is about to release a prototype ev equipped with solid state batteries, with the expectation of mass production in 2025. Solid state batteries have 2x the energy density of current lithium batteries, and they charge much faster.
Where's ssiguy to tell us all about the Japanese banking on hydrogen?
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