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  #4741  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 4:52 PM
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https://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...venue-by-2025/

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That’s the idea being pitched to city and provincial officials by Canadian e-sports and entertainment company OverActive Media (OAM), owners of four teams that compete for big prize money in popular video-game leagues. OAM owns Spain-based MAD Lions franchises in the League of Legends European Championship and Counter Strike Global Offensive. It also owns Toronto Defiant of the Overwatch League, and Toronto Ultra of the Call of Duty League – both leagues with teams based in big cities with deep-pocketed owners who ultimately want to play home-and-away games just like teams in traditional North American pro sports.

The venue would be a home arena for the Defiant and the Ultra. It would have amenities such as locker rooms and player lounges, house their practice facilities and OAM’s offices, restaurants and spaces for fans to play games and mingle with the e-sports players.

The design illustrations – created by global architecture firm Populous – have been kept from public eyes until now as OAM worked to brief city, provincial and federal politicians and get some informal support, which they’re now confident they have. The illustrations show a performance venue and hotel tower built together adjacent to BMO Field, at an estimated cost of $500-million.

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  #4742  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 5:06 PM
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That looks awesome!
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  #4743  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 5:09 PM
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Originally Posted by thurmas View Post
Based on the 1976 exhibition stadium renovation that created the baseball grandstands at the CNE for the blue jays that was roughly 30000 seats it cost 17 million in in 1976 using an inflation calculator a similar bare bones stadium today would cost 77 million for a Canadian stadium
$77 million for a CFL stadium? THF seats 24,000 and seems very bare bones. It cost $145 million in 2014.
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  #4744  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 6:20 PM
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Originally Posted by khabibulin View Post
$77 million for a CFL stadium? THF seats 24,000 and seems very bare bones. It cost $145 million in 2014.
Costs of everything housing and infrastructure exploded well beyond inflation. The original Metro in Montreal was $213.7 Million, or $1.668 Billion today, for 22 kilometers of fully underground rapid transit and 26 cathedral like stations.

Anything remotely close would be at least $6.6 Billion today.

To be fair, the stringent safety standards of today have a significant impact on cost and construction timelines. Far greater accessibility standards also result in more expenses and station build times. Our rolling stock is also far more sophisticated than in the 20th Century.

As for stadiums, safety standards are also a factor, but also new building codes that require more space, washrooms etc.
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  #4745  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 7:11 PM
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Originally Posted by FrankieFlowerpot View Post

I had to google the term E-Sports to see if it was what I thought it was. Very cool idea and perfect location for such a venue. Why not be home to the first ever such venue. The CNE grounds are the perfect location for for a design like this. I'm also glad if it gets built with a new tower it will help block out that horrible X-Hotel from certain angles.
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  #4746  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 7:16 PM
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Sorry I am confused are they proposing a brand new BMO field for TFC and the Argos here? Or some sort of video game stadium?
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  #4747  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 7:40 PM
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Originally Posted by thurmas View Post
Sorry I am confused are they proposing a brand new BMO field for TFC and the Argos here? Or some sort of video game stadium?

Video Games Stadium. But I'm sure it could be used for many events, like conventions, and performances.
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  #4748  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2021, 7:55 PM
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Nice looking venue proposed for Toronto.
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  #4749  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 3:33 PM
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Somewhat surprised by this news yesterday.

https://montrealgazette.com/business...m-legault-says
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  #4750  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 3:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Somewhat surprised by this news yesterday.

https://montrealgazette.com/business...m-legault-says


Any funding from Government should come with first and foremost a guarantee that a major league team will be awarded (or moved) to the city, and that the team would stay for at least 20 years. It should also come with revenue splitting from concessions, parking and naming rights. If that can't be agreed upon, then taxpayer money invested should be in the form of a low interest loan, not a subsidy.
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  #4751  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 3:48 PM
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
Any funding from Government should come with first and foremost a guarantee that a major league team will be awarded (or moved) to the city, and that the team would stay for at least 20 years.
You're right, Quebec would never provide funding for a team that never materializes.
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  #4752  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 4:08 PM
MalcolmTucker MalcolmTucker is offline
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
Any funding from Government should come with first and foremost a guarantee that a major league team will be awarded (or moved) to the city, and that the team would stay for at least 20 years. It should also come with revenue splitting from concessions, parking and naming rights. If that can't be agreed upon, then taxpayer money invested should be in the form of a low interest loan, not a subsidy.
A low interest loan is a subsidy. The assumption that there is profit to split is a perennial problem for stadiums. Certainly there should be binding terms on occupation.



What you can do is set up the agreement to capture 'excess profits', which protects the city from being hosed in negotiation on the subsidy amount, especially if naming rights are way more valuable than predicted. Basically, you keep the stadium, and associated revenue like (basic) concessions, parking and naming rights as part of a different corporation. Instead of a lease payment in the millions, you use a stadium fee on tickets (with a revenue guarantee from your chief tenant (excess losses protection)). You set the maximum margin on the profit for the stadium at lets say, 5 or 10%. This is used on modern private toll roads to avoid the Highway 407 problem.



Somewhat logical arrangements for the capital split would be to design and cost a bare bones stadium with the same capacity with no profit maximization considerations (boxes, clubs), and have the government contribute that much. Then the private operator pays for all the fancy features through the stadium fee. Operating costs, maintenance, and any capital upgrades need to be covered by the stadium fee, so it creates a tradeoff for the private operator to not request money losing upgrades during construction and the lease.
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  #4753  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 11:33 PM
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Legault is an idiot.

He needs to go.

First the stupid curfew. Now, it's wanting to use taxpayer money to bring in a MLB team.

What an utter disappointment this guy has been. Hopefully the next provincial elections will show that.

To quote University of Chicago economics professor Allen Sanderson: "If you want to inject money into a local economy, it is more efficient to fly over the city in a helicopter by throwing that money into the streets rather than investing in a new baseball stadium".
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  #4754  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 11:39 PM
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Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
Legault is an idiot.

He needs to go.

First the stupid curfew. Now, it's wanting to use taxpayer money to bring in a MLB team.

What an utter disappointment this guy has been. Hopefully the next provincial elections will show that.
Umm hate to burst your bubble but:

https://www.macleans.ca/politics/338...legaults-lead/

Among decided and leaning voters, the governing CAQ receives 48 per cent of voting intentions, a crushing 27-point lead over its closest rival, the Quebec Liberals. These new numbers remain consistent with most Quebec polls on the field throughout 2020, and restate clearly that Legault sits comfortably in the driver seat of Quebec politics:

Moreover, among francophone voters who make up close to 80 per cent of the Quebec electorate, the CAQ leads by 40 points over the second-place Parti québécois (54 to 14 per cent). The Quebec Liberals are dead last in this key demographic, with only 11 per cent.
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  #4755  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 11:52 PM
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^ I know this.

Hence why I said "hopefully at the next elections."

Investing taxpayer money in sports franchises or stadiums is never worth while for the taxpayer. We have seen this countless times.

One of the latest studies to this effect has just been published. Conducted by economist and researcher J.C. Bradbury, the study examines the economic impact of Truist Park, the new stadium the Atlanta Braves moved to in 2017. This new stadium is located in Cobb County, far from the city center. Originally, project promoters argued that visitors from Atlanta would inject huge sums of money into the local economy. Figures compiled since the stadium opened show that sales tax revenue has indeed increased in Cobb County. However, the increase was likely due to the overall health of the economy as neighboring counties recorded, on average, higher revenue increases than Cobb County.

In 2015, Temple University economics professor Michael Leeds argued that if all of Chicago's professional teams (the Bears, Bulls, White Sox, Cubs and Blackhawks) suddenly disappeared at the same time, the impact of their departure on the city's economy would amount to a fraction of 1%.
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  #4756  
Old Posted Mar 24, 2021, 11:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
^ I know this.

Hence why I said "hopefully at the next elections."

Investing taxpayer money in sports franchises or stadiums is never worth while for the taxpayer. We have seen this countless times.

In 2015, Temple University economics professor Michael Leeds argued that if all of Chicago's professional teams (the Bears, Bulls, White Sox, Cubs and Blackhawks) suddenly disappeared at the same time, the impact of their departure on the city's economy would amount to a fraction of 1%.

One of the latest studies to this effect has just been published. Conducted by economist and researcher J.C. Bradbury, the study examines the economic impact of Truist Park, the new stadium the Atlanta Braves moved to in 2017. This new stadium is located in Cobb County, far from the city center. Originally, project promoters argued that visitors from Atlanta would inject huge sums of money into the local economy.

However, figures compiled since the stadium opened show that sales tax revenue has indeed increased in Cobb County. However, the increase was likely due to the overall health of the economy as neighboring counties recorded, on average, higher revenue increases than Cobb County.
I agree with you. While I do not support massive expenditures, people need a little fun! And other cultural infrastructures get money in various forms... sports should benefit as well.
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  #4757  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 1:01 PM
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Originally Posted by ScreamingViking View Post
I agree with you. While I do not support massive expenditures, people need a little fun! And other cultural infrastructures get money in various forms... sports should benefit as well.
Invest that money in healthcare. Give our nurses a proper raise ! Don't build a fucking baseball stadium with my money !
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  #4758  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 1:12 PM
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Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
You're right, Quebec would never provide funding for a team that never materializes.
Point taken. Though that was a few governments ago and a different colour.

Though we do have the saying in French "plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose..."
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  #4759  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 1:15 PM
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Originally Posted by thurmas View Post
Umm hate to burst your bubble but:

https://www.macleans.ca/politics/338...legaults-lead/

Among decided and leaning voters, the governing CAQ receives 48 per cent of voting intentions, a crushing 27-point lead over its closest rival, the Quebec Liberals. These new numbers remain consistent with most Quebec polls on the field throughout 2020, and restate clearly that Legault sits comfortably in the driver seat of Quebec politics:

Moreover, among francophone voters who make up close to 80 per cent of the Quebec electorate, the CAQ leads by 40 points over the second-place Parti québécois (54 to 14 per cent). The Quebec Liberals are dead last in this key demographic, with only 11 per cent.
I wonder what the polling would say on public funding for a new baseball stadium?

Legault I believe is heading for a near-record electoral performance with over 90 seats out of 125 if his numbers keep up.

Somehow I doubt that the Expos stadium will be a huge banana peel that his re-election fortunes slip up on.

Anyway, the 2021 Quebec budget is this afternoon, so we'll see how that sounds to people... (Not sure if the stadium will be in there.)
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  #4760  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 1:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Though we do have the saying in French "plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose..."
We have the same saying in English (but you know this).

Quote:
Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
In 2015, Temple University economics professor Michael Leeds argued that if all of Chicago's professional teams (the Bears, Bulls, White Sox, Cubs and Blackhawks) suddenly disappeared at the same time, the impact of their departure on the city's economy would amount to a fraction of 1%.
So, I presume you're not a sports fan then...……

I would argue that while sports teams do not have much of a measurable economic impact on a city, they can do wonders for the soul of the city. They can help induce pride and can improve peoples moods. People need a distraction. Sports teams can accomplish this in spades.

Sports teams can add prestige to a community too. Where do you think the term "major league city" came from????
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