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  #641  
Old Posted Jun 1, 2014, 6:44 PM
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I don't mind what the nay-sayers are saying. I do know that the company doing the electric work on the Colorado tower are still anticipating ground breaking on this project, that's when, by rule, they can bid for the contract. Of course there's no guarentees so they are also poised to bid on upcoming projects if groundbreaking doesn't occur or if they lose the bid. For me, from talks with my source, confidence is high that the Fairmont will be built with no indication of a redesign. In fact, per Manchester's stategy to be the premiere hotel in Austin, scaling back would be ludicrous imo.

Last edited by the Genral; Jun 1, 2014 at 7:39 PM.
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  #642  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 3:09 PM
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Originally Posted by the Genral View Post
I don't mind what the nay-sayers are saying. I do know that the company doing the electric work on the Colorado tower are still anticipating ground breaking on this project, that's when, by rule, they can bid for the contract. Of course there's no guarentees so they are also poised to bid on upcoming projects if groundbreaking doesn't occur or if they lose the bid. For me, from talks with my source, confidence is high that the Fairmont will be built with no indication of a redesign. In fact, per Manchester's stategy to be the premiere hotel in Austin, scaling back would be ludicrous imo.
This project is a barometer of developer confidence in DT Austin..If Manchester balks, other potential projects could be impacted..
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  #643  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 5:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Spaceman View Post
This project is a barometer of developer confidence in DT Austin..If Manchester balks, other potential projects could be impacted..
If this project fails it will not be due to Manchester "balking." It will have to do with the ineptness of Baby Doug being able to pull off a project of this scope. This is his first major development. Papa Doug has kind of thrown him to the wolves on this one.

Other developers are not sitting around waiting to see what happens to this project. They are out there trying to make their own projects work!

You really don't know the dynamics of commercial real estate development, do you? Go downtown and take a look around...see the cranes? Nobody is sitting around waiting to see if the Fairmont is going (or not going) to break ground.

If anyone is...they are investors who want to sweep-in and grab that site should Manchester fail.
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  #644  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 5:36 PM
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The idea that developers who are working with architects, contractors, and financing are going to quit their development out of nowhere because Manchester couldn't get financing is ludicrous.

I actually talked with one downtown property owner in this area and they indicated that somebody was quietly going around and buying everything they could get their hands on around the waller creek area and anything around I-35. We probably will see some more projects announced once the Waller Creek Tunnel project is officially done.
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  #645  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 5:54 PM
jngreenlee jngreenlee is offline
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...indicated that somebody was quietly going around and buying everything they could get their hands on around the waller creek area and anything around I-35.
That's an exciting rumor...to continue the spurious (but fun) conversation, what's the over/under on getting major Asian investment dollars ahead of Middle-Eastern Oil dollars?
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  #646  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 7:19 PM
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Fairmont Hotels updated the opening date for the Austin hotel to 2017 in their "In Development" list of projects to match the billboards at the site. Maybe they saw the pictures on SSP.

http://www.fairmont.com/destinations/development/
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  #647  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 7:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Spaceman View Post
This project is a barometer of developer confidence in DT Austin..If Manchester balks, other potential projects could be impacted..
It's a only barometer in your mind. The developers of 99 Trinity, Waller Park Place, 5th & West, Aloft/Elemental, Green Water Towers #2, #3 and #4 and the other 30 or so projects are not waiting on Manchester for anything. White Lodging may even be somewhat hopeful that the Fairmont doesn't get built.
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  #648  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 7:33 PM
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Originally Posted by East7thStreet View Post
The idea that developers who are working with architects, contractors, and financing are going to quit their development out of nowhere because Manchester couldn't get financing is ludicrous.

I actually talked with one downtown property owner in this area and they indicated that somebody was quietly going around and buying everything they could get their hands on around the waller creek area and anything around I-35. We probably will see some more projects announced once the Waller Creek Tunnel project is officially done.
Yeah, that will be a hot area in the coming years, in no small part thanks to the Waller Creek project. I think we'll see an explosion of development there. It's one of the few remaining undeveloped parts of downtown Austin and it's due for a metamorphosis. Lot's of opportunity and potential.
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  #649  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 7:51 PM
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Originally Posted by GoldenBoot View Post
If this project fails it will not be due to Manchester "balking." It will have to do with the ineptness of Baby Doug being able to pull off a project of this scope. This is his first major development.
By "first major development" do you mean in Austin or just in general?

In San Diego, he developed the First National Bank Center - a 27-story office tower.

He also developed the San Diego Marriott Marquis & Marina (1,362 rooms) and the Manchester Grand Hyatt Hotel (1,628 rooms)

If we're going to consider a 1,054 room Fairmont Hotel to be a major development, I would think both of those San Diego hotels would qualify as major developments as well.
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  #650  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 9:13 PM
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Originally Posted by LoneStarMike View Post
By "first major development" do you mean in Austin or just in general?

In San Diego, he developed the First National Bank Center - a 27-story office tower.

He also developed the San Diego Marriott Marquis & Marina (1,362 rooms) and the Manchester Grand Hyatt Hotel (1,628 rooms)

If we're going to consider a 1,054 room Fairmont Hotel to be a major development, I would think both of those San Diego hotels would qualify as major developments as well.
If you read my comment closer, you may realize Baby Doug is a different person than Papa Doug. Baby Doug was in school when his father, Papa Doug, developed the aforementioned properties in San Diego.

This (The Fairmont-Austin) is Baby Doug's first major project in which he is the lead. I would hope that if Baby couldn't handle it, Papa would step in and complete the project. Who knows how much of a hand Papa currently has in this development?!?
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  #651  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2014, 9:40 PM
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^^My bad. I missed the "baby" part.
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  #652  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 3:18 PM
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OMG and LOL. The San Diego Union which is obsessed with hating on the Manchester family has another slam piece. They quote one of Spaceman's SSP posts as evidence of their doubt about the Austin's Fairmont's viability.

From the "article":
Meanwhile, back in sweaty Austin, conversation about the hotel's ultimate fate continues to rage on in a forum on a website called SkyscraperPage.com, whose online denizens have been vigorously debating the project's future in an often contentious thread going back to June 2011.

"You are treading on dangerous ground by doubting this project," wrote Spaceman on May 16. "The optimists that populate this board will attack you for not buying into anything being built in [Downtown] Austin. Nothing wrong with optimism but realism has to carry some weight. I hope this hotel is built, but anything planned in that southeast part of DT seems iffy at best."

The entire "article":

http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2...plan/#comments
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  #653  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 4:04 PM
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That's pretty funny actually. The article is one of the worst pieces of journalism I have read in a long time and I read a lot of sports journalism.
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  #654  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 4:28 PM
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I wonder if they'll quote us about how awful their journalism is...
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  #655  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 6:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Hill Country View Post
OMG and LOL. The San Diego Union which is obsessed with hating on the Manchester family has another slam piece. They quote one of Spaceman's SSP posts as evidence of their doubt about the Austin's Fairmont's viability.

From the "article":
Meanwhile, back in sweaty Austin, conversation about the hotel's ultimate fate continues to rage on in a forum on a website called SkyscraperPage.com, whose online denizens have been vigorously debating the project's future in an often contentious thread going back to June 2011.

"You are treading on dangerous ground by doubting this project," wrote Spaceman on May 16. "The optimists that populate this board will attack you for not buying into anything being built in [Downtown] Austin. Nothing wrong with optimism but realism has to carry some weight. I hope this hotel is built, but anything planned in that southeast part of DT seems iffy at best."

The entire "article":

http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2...plan/#comments
Hill Country, I think you mean the San Diego Reader hates on the Manchester family. The San Diego Union is owned by the Manchester family and is the daily newspaper out there. The Reader is kind of like the Chronicle. a local weekly with mostly arts and music coverage and some local reporting.

I'm not sure I agree with the comments being made regarding shoddy reporting. It seems newsworthy that the Manchester group may be pitching the project as an investment opportunity to Chinese nationals interested in participating in the visa program (EB-5??) that requires the investment of a substantial amount of money in the US as a prerequisite for obtaining green cards and resident permits. If this information is true, it constitutes a real news scoop regarding the financing for this project.

Last edited by austlar1; Jun 3, 2014 at 6:27 PM.
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  #656  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 6:45 PM
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Thanks for small but significant correction austlar1. The suspect quality of their journalism wasn't my main point so much. The fact that Spaceman's comment was the one they chose was f'ing hilarious.
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  #657  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 7:00 PM
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Do they also quote the times Spaceman doubted projects that eventually broke ground?
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  #658  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 7:56 PM
austlar1 austlar1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Hill Country View Post
Thanks for small but significant correction austlar1. The suspect quality of their journalism wasn't my main point so much. The fact that Spaceman's comment was the one they chose was f'ing hilarious.
Yeah, Spaceman's newsworthiness is pretty suspect, but it gave them something to hang a story on from a local angle. I'm surprised they did not examine the merits of "the fence" from a feng shui perspective. Could it be that the expensive fence was built to persuade Chinese investors?

Before I get labeled a subversive doubter about all of this, let me just say that I love this hotel design and hope that it does get built. I also think that the southeast quadrant of downtown has a very bright future. Just the same, it seems clear to me that the Manchester outfit is pulling out all the stops to sell this project to the public and to investors. They did not have all their ducks (and developers frequently don't have things all figured out when they announce a project) in a row at the outset, and now they are paying a price. Since I don't much care for the Manchester family (their ultra right wing politics are offensive to me), I rather enjoy watching them squirm as they struggle to make this project come to fruition.
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  #659  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 8:14 PM
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Originally Posted by austlar1 View Post
Yeah, Spaceman's newsworthiness is pretty suspect, but it gave them something to hang a story on from a local angle. I'm surprised they did not examine the merits of "the fence" from a feng shui perspective. Could it be that the expensive fence was built to persuade Chinese investors?

Before I get labeled a subversive doubter about all of this, let me just say that I love this hotel design and hope that it does get built. I also think that the southeast quadrant of downtown has a very bright future. Just the same, it seems clear to me that the Manchester outfit is pulling out all the stops to sell this project to the public and to investors. They did not have all their ducks (and developers frequently don't have things all figured out when they announce a project) in a row at the outset, and now they are paying a price. Since I don't much care for the Manchester family (their ultra right wing politics are offensive to me), I rather enjoy watching them squirm as they struggle to make this project come to fruition.
"I'm bad, I'm nation wide".....LMAO
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  #660  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2014, 9:50 PM
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Originally Posted by LoneStarMike View Post
^^My bad. I missed the "baby" part.
No prob!
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AUSTIN (City): 974,447 +1.30% - '20-'22 | AUSTIN MSA (5 counties): 2,421,115 +6.03% - '20-'22
SAN ANTONIO (City): 1,472,909 +2.69% - '20-'22 | SAN ANTONIO MSA (8 counties): 2,655,342 +3.80% - '20-'22
AUS-SAT REGION (MSAs/13 counties): 5,076,457 +4.85% - '20-'22 | *SRC: US Census*
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