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  #12401  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 2:51 AM
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Wig-Wag Wig-Wag is offline
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LAWC canal turns into the tunnel to Buena Vista Reservoir

Does anyone want to volunteer to wade into that morass of poison oak to see if the tunnel still exists?

Anyone?

Anyone?[/QUOTE]

Procab, you disappoint me. After all that excellent research you're going to wuss out over a little poison oak? ; > )

Our back yard up here in San Luis Obispo County is covered in the stuff and just looking at the picture makes me itch.

Thanks for a job well done!

Cheers,
Jack
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  #12402  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 3:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BifRayRock View Post
1933 - Unknown address (Free consultation with Dr. Wheeler for anyone who correctly guesses the address)
USC Digital

(Could you please give me directions to Dr. Wheeler's office?)

Vogue tires: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...ostcount=10205

The guy in the blazer and Vogue-equivalent shoes does not appear to me to need Wheeler's goat glands....

Last edited by GaylordWilshire; Jun 24, 2014 at 12:44 AM.
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  #12403  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 3:16 AM
Lwize Lwize is offline
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Originally Posted by malumot View Post
Is all that worthy of a paragraph or two? Sure. Two-thirds of the entire story? A bit much.
I thought I copied the full story, not 2/3 of it.
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  #12404  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 3:26 AM
so-cal-bear so-cal-bear is offline
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Last edited by so-cal-bear; Aug 5, 2013 at 1:46 PM.
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  #12405  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 4:15 AM
tovangar2 tovangar2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DouglasUrantia View Post
Does anyone know why Los Angeles was not platted on a strict compass direction? This is very weird. Didn't they have any compasses in those old days?
I dunno what was required by Spain, but according to the map below the old and new Plazas were not identically orientated:

nopalera

The location of the original Pueblo 1781-1815, before it was moved in circa 1815-1835. The original site remains unmemorialized.

P.S. Why did Marchesseault (the mayor) turn into Marchessault (the street)?
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  #12406  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 4:34 AM
tovangar2 tovangar2 is offline
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Originally Posted by GaylordWilshire View Post
The guy in the blazer and Vogue-equivalent shoes does not appear to me to need Wheeler's goat glands....
But if he did:

http://seasweetie.wordpress.com/2010...ravel-channel/

The local butcher when I was a kid used to sell pig ones (that's goats' above) looking like shucked turtles. I don't recall my mother ever buying any. We lived on abalone.
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  #12407  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 6:00 AM
ProphetM ProphetM is offline
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Originally Posted by kznyc2k View Post
One more note on the location of the old Bunker/Court/Fort Moore Hill tunnels:


1936, LAPL
Nice! Both Hill St. tunnels, the Broadway tunnel, the relationship of Sunset Blvd. to the Plaza, important buildings. Great little map. I have half a mind to do an overlay on a modern aerial.
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  #12408  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 6:29 AM
tovangar2 tovangar2 is offline
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Originally Posted by ProphetM View Post
Great little map. I have half a mind to do an overlay on a modern aerial.
I'd love to see that. I don't know how to do them.
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  #12409  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 6:37 AM
BifRayRock BifRayRock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaylordWilshire View Post

Vogue tires: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...ostcount=10205

The guy in the blazer and Vogue-equivalent shoes does not appear to me to need Wheeler's goat glands....


Can you always judge someone by the cut of their blazer or their sidewalls? Could have sworn Merv and Arthur devoted an entire opening monologue to the subject.

1986 - Last year broadcasting.
Lapl

google

ebay

1987 - Beverly Hilton, the year Merv acquired.
lapl

1956 - Beverly Hilton facing N x NE
lapl

1956 - B Hilton from opposite direction
lapl


Last edited by BifRayRock; Feb 10, 2013 at 3:10 PM.
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  #12410  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 7:35 AM
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Originally Posted by tovangar2 View Post
I'd love to see that. I don't know how to do them.
My method, which is probably a little over-complicated, involves importing the two images into CorelDraw (vector-art graphics program like Adobe Illustrator because I don't have Photoshop), and then adjusting the grayscale drawing down to a more starkly black & white image, so I can make the white parts transparent. Then place one on top of the other, line them up and re-export to a new image.

The hardest part for me is getting rid of all the gray in the old drawing without either making the black lines too faint to see, or too thick to be helpful. I meet with varying degrees of success there.

I couldn't resist. Tunnels in red:

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  #12411  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 8:09 AM
DouglasUrantia DouglasUrantia is offline
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Mapping Los Angeles....very challenging

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaylordWilshire View Post


This is an oversimplification, but it has to do with Spain requiring houses in its colonies to be set at a 45-degree angle to true north-south so they would get equal light on all sides....something like that. But it clashed with the Jeffersonian plan (I think it was his idea) to have the whole country gridded true north-south... The city from Hoover Street west was on the "American plan." Actually, I don't think downtown is actually 45 degrees but maybe 35.
Thanks Mr Wilshire and others for your great answers. The 'old' downtown area around the circular Plaza is really a jumble of streets running at all angles imaginable. Its all very quaint.....and of course interesting and noir. I guess as the city grew like Topsy, there were a few city planners with some common sense and a compass. I assume the all-wise city fathers finally hired some planners with a college degree, a sharp pencil and who knew how to draw a straight line.
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  #12412  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 8:39 AM
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LAPD's Traffic Division moves into its new home at 123 South Figueroa, 1942:



And a shot of it undergoing renovation with the 1st Street bridge of Figueroa being erected on March 7th, 1940:



Originally built in 1925 as an office building on the edge of Bunker Hill, according to On Bunker Hill:

Quote:
in 1934 is turned into “one of the largest and most modern” government relief centers in the West. The Federal Transient Service converted the building into its Southern California headquarters, i.e., a shelter for non-resident jobless men, outfitting it with an enormous cafeteria and dormitories that slept 500. It became a veritable city in itself: showers, lockers, hospital, educational and recreational facilities were installed, as were a laundry, shoe repair and tailor shop. It was also a warehouse for materials and supplies used in the camps. Yes, the camps. Itinerant men had forty-eight hours to stay at Figueroa, max, before being assigned out of the city to transient work camps in forest and mountain areas.
Here's a shot of it from the mid-'60s:


On Bunker Hill

And as for its fate:

Quote:
In March of 1964, the Board of Supervisors authorized sale of the county building to the CRA. The CRA said they intended to develop the site into a motel. The garage equipment goes up for auction in April 1971 and the 123 is presumably demolished failry soon thereafterward.
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  #12413  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 8:48 AM
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The fabled Court Circle has been covered plenty of times before on these pages, but I don't remember an instance where anyone pointed out some ruins that still exist of it.

A quick reminder of what once was:



Cropped shot looking east:


1940, USC

The area today:



But here's where things get interesting. The tiny road that once connected Fremont Ave to Court Circle still exists just to the east of the freeway fenced off, and it looks to be reasonably intact. Also, note the stairs that once led to a house (they can be seen in the first shot I posted):



Street view:





Has this been covered before? Has anyone actually snuck a look around? How about photos?? This is a roadbed in the middle of the city that hasn't been touched in 60+ years!
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Last edited by kznyc2k; Feb 10, 2013 at 9:00 AM.
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  #12414  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 2:14 PM
montréaliste montréaliste is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tovangar2 View Post
I dunno what was required by Spain, but according to the map below the old and new Plazas were not identically orientated:

nopalera

The location of the original Pueblo 1781-1815, before it was moved in circa 1815-1835. The original site remains unmemorialized.

P.S. Why did Marchesseault (the mayor) turn into Marchessault (the street)?

I dont know the answer to this question but Marchessault was the first french canadian mayor of Los Angeles, Beaudry; the second.

Did anyone know of L.A. Mayor Prudent Beaudry's interesting connection to Jean-Louis Beaudry, mayor of Montreal?

They were both brothers, and although they didnt serve terms at the same time, they both did a lot to improve their cities' waterworks and of course speculative real estate market. I remember seeing some short documentary pieces about this, but it would be nice to find correspondence between the two. Both were extraordinary businessmen, more so Jean-Louis since Prudent had a few reversals of fortune.

Last edited by montréaliste; Feb 11, 2013 at 12:59 AM.
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  #12415  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 3:27 PM
Lwize Lwize is offline
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(Images: Brian van der Brug / Los Angeles Times )

Quote:
Originally Posted by latimes.com
A dirty job at L.A. County's Hall of Justice
Eighty-eight years of grime will soon be blasted away from the downtown beaux-arts building, reviving the beauty of its once-gleaming Sierra white granite facade.


By Bob Pool, Los Angeles Times

February 9, 2013, 5:35 p.m.

Cops and prosecutors are returning to the scene of the grime.

But things will be brighter when the former occupants of the Hall of Justice move their offices back into the downtown Los Angeles landmark.

Work crews making seismic repairs to the building next month will begin blasting away 88 years' worth of soot, dirt and smog that have turned its exterior a dull, dirty gray color.

When they finish this fall, project managers say the 14-story beaux-arts building will glisten as brightly as the slightly newer Los Angeles City Hall, which is diagonally across the street.

And why shouldn't it? City Hall was built in 1928 from the same Sierra white granite from a quarry north of Fresno that was used in 1925 for construction of the Hall of Justice.

Often used as a backdrop in crime movies and old television series, the hall was home to the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department and the district attorney's office.

It also housed the county coroner's office, where the autopsy of actress Marilyn Monroe in 1962 concluded that she had committed suicide and the examination of presidential candidate Robert F. Kennedy showed he died of bullet wounds after being shot at the Ambassador Hotel the night of the California primary in 1968.

The trial of Kennedy's killer, Sirhan Sirhan, was conducted in one of the hall's 17 courtrooms. So was the trial of serial killer Charles Manson, who was held in one of the hall's 750 tiny cells until he was convicted in 1971 and sent to state prison.

Manson later characterized the hall's lockup as "stone age." The office of his chief prosecutor, Vincent Bugliosi, was a few floors beneath Manson's cell. In his book "Helter Skelter," Bugliosi described its decor as "1930s Chicago."

"The courtrooms in that building looked like old-time courtrooms," recalls Encino criminal defense lawyer Donald Calabria, who worked in the hall as a public defender starting in 1969. "They had real substantial wood walls, not the cheap-looking ones" found across the street in the newer Criminal Courts building.

Construction crews have removed asbestos, lead and other hazardous materials from the hall as part of the $234-million seismic renovation stemming from the 1994 Northridge earthquake.

Most of the jail cells were ripped out and sold to a recycler for $450,000, according to James Kearns, assistant deputy director of the county's Department of Public Works, which is overseeing the repair project.

But Manson's old cellblock was preserved and will be part of an interpretive display that will tell the history of the hall and the project to save it, said Kearns, who stepped into Manson's cell to demonstrate how the lockup's barred doors still slam shut with a rumble and a chilling clank.

The old building has plenty of history, according to Sandi Gibbons, public information officer for the district attorney's office who first went to work there in late 1965 as a courts reporter for City News Service. "I'll tell you what they should put in there: the drinking fountain that a TV cameraman knocked off the hallway wall when they were bringing [Manson family member] Susan Atkins into the grand jury room. There was water everywhere. They put a steel band around it when they bolted it back on the wall," Gibbons said.

Kearns said one of the hall's courtrooms has been preserved as a Sheriff's Department conference room, and a wood-paneled law library will also be turned into a meeting room. The sheriff will share the hall's 400,000 square feet of space with the district attorney when the two departments move back inside after repairs are completed Dec. 31, 2014, Kearns said.

The building's makeover — about 30% completed — includes construction of a parking structure next to the 101 Freeway that will have five levels underground and four above.

The hall's three entrances will lead to a multistory loggia that retains its original marble flooring and staircases, along with a bank of ornate, wood-paneled elevators. They will be re-engineered and automated; in the past, elevator operators were required. In 1990, one of the operators was crushed to death when she was caught between a descending elevator and the 10th floor.

The refurbished building will be air conditioned for the first time. As originally designed by Allied Architects, the hall featured twin 14-story light wells that allowed every office to have an operable window for fresh air. In its new configuration, the bottom of one of the wells will be landscaped and will serve as an eating area for a new cafeteria being built on the ground floor, Kearns said.

But it will be the strikingly bright new granite facade that will be most visible for those working in the downtown area or passing by on the freeway. Diesel soot, dust and automobile exhaust have contributed to the darkening of the Sierra white granite over the decades.

Workers experimented on sections of the hall's Broadway side with chemical dirt removers, high-pressure water cleaning and several micro-abrasive systems before settling on a bead-blasting technique, which relies on a combination of crushed recycled glass and tiny stones and is more gentle to granite, said Jeff Caldwell, an exterior forensics expert with the consulting firm of Wiss, Janney, Elstner Associates.

Because recent rains have washed dust and dirt from the upper levels down to the white test areas, those clean sections are already getting dirtier and darker, Caldwell said. That's why cleaning crews on scaffolding will start at the top and work their way down, he said. There is terra cotta in addition to the granite on upper levels of the hall.

Greg Zinberg, project executive for Clark Construction, the main contractor for the county, said the Hall of Justice will shine bright — but it better last a while.

"This one might not be cleaned for another 50 years," he said.

bob.pool@latimes.com
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la...0,741538.story
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  #12416  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 5:11 PM
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Originally Posted by kznyc2k View Post
Some ruins of the fabled Court Circle still exist.



Has this been covered before? Has anyone actually snuck a look around? How about photos?? This is a roadbed in the middle of the city that hasn't been touched in 60+ years!
I had no idea those steps and the roadway still exists! Great detective work kznyc2k
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  #12417  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 6:27 PM
ProphetM ProphetM is offline
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Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
I had no idea those steps and the roadway still exists! Great detective work kznyc2k
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I looked over the area and saw it during a previous discussion of Court Circle, but I think that was when I was still a lurker - I hadn't registered to post yet at the time. If you go south down the block, there are two more sets of stairs to nowhere, and then there is an unsigned corner which is the stub end of Mignonette Street. Today's Mignonette stops in a cul-de-sac on the other side of the freeway.
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  #12418  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 6:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DouglasUrantia View Post
Does anyone know why Los Angeles was not platted on a strict compass direction? This is very weird. Didn't they have any compasses in those old days?
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/oct...-maps-20101024

Quote:
Downtown Los Angeles is cocked about 36 degrees from the north-south grid that was Thomas Jefferson's dream for filling in the empty places on the blank page of the continent. Jefferson imagined his rational geometry penetrating forests, fording rivers and passing across prairies, leaving behind a national design of townships and sections that extended uniformly from the Alleghenies to the Pacific Ocean. The West's conquest (and its conversion into marketable real estate) began in 1785 when Congress adopted Jefferson's scheme to lay over the disorderly wilderness his rigidly right angle grid, where north is always at the top, south always at the bottom.

The streets of downtown Los Angeles have a different dream. They do not lead to the cardinal points of the compass but to the uncertain spaces in between. Ambiguity is written on our landscape.

You wouldn't know it just by driving downtown's streets. We impose Jefferson's imagination on what we see. But stand in front of the Biltmore Hotel on Pershing Square and look down at the brass compass rose set in the sidewalk. It shows that the streets downtown point to other destinations, that these streets still resist the city's American occupation in 1847.

Within the triumphant American grid is another, four Spanish leagues square, that conforms as best it can to the 16th century Laws of the Indies. These royal ordinances required that the streets and house lots in the cities of New Spain have a 45-degree disorientation from true north and south to provide, it was said, equal light to every side of a small house throughout the day. Given the way Spanish and then Mexican Los Angeles extended along the bank of its uncertain river, only 36 degrees of compliance was possible.

The 1849 Ord and Hutton survey, which produced the first map of the newly American city, left the puzzle of royal versus republican orientation unresolved. The map pictures a longitudinal city and used facts on the ground — the bed of the Los Angeles River — as an organizing principle. Faint, spidery lines intersecting at the town plaza hint at compass points the map otherwise ignores.

As the city began to sell itself into the future in the 1870s, Ord's map was blended with newer real estate surveys. They too show the city within the grid of its founding. House lots and streets continue to replicate its off-kilter orientation, as they will until the boom times that followed the arrival of the transcontinental railroads at the end of the 19th century.

The break from colonial to American city begins there. New streets and avenues far from the plaza point to where they are supposed to. The original grid looks like an aberration when it's shown in the context of the city's vast expansion. The real city is the one that has been routinely gridded over the plains and foothills of the Los Angeles basin, not the cockeyed one on Ord's map.
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  #12419  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 6:43 PM
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Did you guys see the Curbed article on Hall of Justice as well?? Theres a nice little video.

http://la.curbed.com/archives/2013/0...derway_now.php
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  #12420  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2013, 7:25 PM
DouglasUrantia DouglasUrantia is offline
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Let's take a stairway to the stars.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by kznyc2k View Post
The fabled Court Circle has been covered plenty of times before on these pages, but I don't remember an instance where anyone pointed out some ruins that still exist of it.


Has this been covered before? Has anyone actually snuck a look around? How about photos?? This is a roadbed in the middle of the city that hasn't been touched in 60+ years!

What could be more iconic and symbolic of Los Angeles 'City of Dreams' than the photo of these "Stairs to Nowhere".

Someone once lived in the house at the top of those stairs. They had a life, dreams and a history. The house is gone, the dreams have faded and now we're left with only the stairs.
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