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  #41  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2020, 8:59 PM
Docere Docere is offline
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What's also interesting is the absence of Puerto Ricans in Detroit, given that they have sizable numbers in Cleveland, Chicago and Milwaukee.
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  #42  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2020, 9:04 PM
wwmiv wwmiv is offline
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Originally Posted by Capsicum View Post
Does the low-Hispanic population area of Appalachia, western PA, Kentucky, etc. strongly divide the Puerto Rican "east" with the Mexican "west"?

The coastal Southeast or South Atlantic (Virginia, South Carolina etc.) doesn't have as many Mexicans but still seems to be connected to the Puerto Rican "east coast" community between NYC and Florida.

The transition is more gradual in the northeast/Great Lakes, right?
Largely this is the case, it seems, but there’s more nuance. For instance, New Orleans is historically non-Mexican while Atlanta is mostly Mexican. This may be due to the pattern you note in your follow up comment: New Orleans is coastal.

Also: rural N.C has a Mexican population centered around Fayetteville.
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Metropolitan Central Texas 2018: 5,672,404 (+19.98% over 2010):
San Antonio: 1,532,233 (+15.43%) + Metro Suburbs: 985,803 (+20.94%)
Austin: 964,254 (+22.00%) + Metro Suburbs: 1,204,062 (+30.04%)
Killeen/Temple Metro: 451,679 (+11.44%) + Waco Metro: 271,942 (+15.77%) + Bryan/College Station Metro: 262,431 (+14.77%)
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  #43  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2020, 9:09 PM
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Capsicum Capsicum is offline
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
What's also interesting is the absence of Puerto Ricans in Detroit, given that they have sizable numbers in Cleveland, Chicago and Milwaukee.
That's interesting... was there ever a large Puerto Rican population there and they left, or was it just that they never moved there in large numbers to begin with?

Puerto Rican emigration (from the island) was clearly going strong when Detroit was at its peak prosperity so it does raise the issue of why they didn't choose Detroit over the other Midwestern cities like Chicago, alongside the east coast strongholds (like NYC).

There were at least some Mexican workers early in the 20th century so clearly some Hispanics were there for jobs.
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  #44  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2020, 9:46 PM
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Hispanic immigration among the three major groups tends to correlate with economic industry:

Mexicans: manufacturing and farm labor
Puerto Rican: garment, service, and entertainment industries
Cuban: historically wealthy individuals who decamped en masse for more cosmopolitan destinations in wave 1 then very poor individuals in wave 2 who went where the wealthy had previously
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Metropolitan Central Texas 2018: 5,672,404 (+19.98% over 2010):
San Antonio: 1,532,233 (+15.43%) + Metro Suburbs: 985,803 (+20.94%)
Austin: 964,254 (+22.00%) + Metro Suburbs: 1,204,062 (+30.04%)
Killeen/Temple Metro: 451,679 (+11.44%) + Waco Metro: 271,942 (+15.77%) + Bryan/College Station Metro: 262,431 (+14.77%)
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  #45  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2020, 1:22 AM
Crawford Crawford is offline
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
What's also interesting is the absence of Puerto Ricans in Detroit, given that they have sizable numbers in Cleveland, Chicago and Milwaukee.
There's a tiny Carribean Hispanic (DR and PR) community in Detroit, located along Michigan Ave., basically populating a zone that becomes AA to the north, Mexican to the south, and Appalachian white/Arab to the west (east is downtown). There are a couple of restaurants and markets.
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  #46  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2020, 1:26 AM
Crawford Crawford is offline
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
To answer my own question:

Cleveland city

Puerto Rican 31,000 8.1%
Mexican 4,500 1.1%
Cleveland (city proper) might actually surpass NYC (city proper) in % PR. I find that amazing. NYC was 8.8% PR in 2010, but that % has probably dropped.
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  #47  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2020, 1:38 AM
Docere Docere is offline
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Originally Posted by Capsicum View Post
Does the Mexican/Puerto Rican line also reflect their relative share of immigration history by land vs. by sea?

The Southwestern Mexican communities and those of the Texas, Great Plains, Chicago I think had a land route (Chicago's early Mexican community in the 1910s came up from the southwest), whereas the Hispanics (including Puerto Ricans and others, both islanders and Central/South Americans) crossed the sea, naturally.

I'm also curious as to if Mexican communities in the East tend to be those who internally migrated from Mexican communities in the West/Southwest rather than independently moved from Mexico directly, by plane or sea.
I suppose one can speak of a "Caribbean Hispanic east" that's comprised of the Northeast, Cleveland and Florida. Dominicans seem to be in places where the PR population was significant already but are far more limited to a few places.

PRs and Dominicans live alongside more with Blacks (many do have African ancestry), much more than Mexicans do in US cities. Cubans are mostly white and accepted as such, and have a higher socioeconomic status.

In the South outside Florida Hispanics are very recent (it was pretty much Black and White until 1990 or so) and mostly Mexican.

In the DC/Baltimore area Salvadorans are the largest group by far.
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  #48  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2020, 3:44 PM
Emprise du Lion Emprise du Lion is offline
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Originally Posted by Obadno View Post
I dont think anyone would say Chicago is a hub for mexican peoples and culture, they would for say Polish or Italian, or Irish (and long long ago French). Even if their are more Mexicans in Chicago by absolute numbers than those other groups these days.

Thats my take anyway
Meanwhile, 26th St in Little Village (one of Chicago's predominantly Mexican neighborhoods) is the second highest grossing shopping and tax revenue district in the city after only Michigan Ave itself. The stores there are almost exclusively catering to Chicago's Mexican community.

Something to think about.
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  #49  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 2:47 PM
dave8721 dave8721 is offline
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post


Anyone know what Tampa’s large Hispanic community consists of?
Hillsborough County, FL per the Census:
Puerto Rican: 91,476
Mexican: 65,578
Cuban: 65,451
Colombian: 14,926
Dominican: 13,112
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  #50  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 2:56 PM
dave8721 dave8721 is offline
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
For Latino/Hispanic populations in cities and states, everywhere but the eastern seaboard is mostly Mexican with the occasional smaller group thrown in (Hispanos in Santa Fe and Albuquerque, Tejanos in Corpus Christi and San Antonio, Central Americans in Los Angeles and Houston, a rich tapestry of ethnicities in New Orleans, Puerto Ricans in Chicago, San Antonio was founded by the Spanish crown but originally settled by afrohispanic Canary Islanders, etc.).

Along the eastern seaboard, however, cities and states all lack the same large Mexican American populations present west of I-95 yet are still known for specific particular communities: Brazilians (Boston, Jersey, Chicago), Cubans (Miami, Jersey, NYC), Puerto Ricans (Orlando), Hondurans, Costa Ricans, and other Central Americans (Miami, NYC, Boston), Haitians and other (NYC), Dominicans (NYC), Colombians (NYC), Venezuelans (NYC), etc. EXCEPT rural North Carolina. Economic pressures there have resulted in decent rural pockets of Mexican American farm labor.

My question is this: why doesn’t the United States have any city to speak of with a large immigrant population from Chile, Argentina, Peru, Bolivia, The Guyanas, Paraguay, or Uruguay? Or do we and I just don’t know?
Miami-Dade County does have over 40k Peruvians and 29k Argentinians (compared to 856k Cubans).
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  #51  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 3:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave8721 View Post
Hillsborough County, FL per the Census:
Puerto Rican: 91,476
Mexican: 65,578
Cuban: 65,451
Colombian: 14,926
Dominican: 13,112
Fits my theory: not on I-95=has Mexican Americans as a large share of the Latino population
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Metropolitan Central Texas 2018: 5,672,404 (+19.98% over 2010):
San Antonio: 1,532,233 (+15.43%) + Metro Suburbs: 985,803 (+20.94%)
Austin: 964,254 (+22.00%) + Metro Suburbs: 1,204,062 (+30.04%)
Killeen/Temple Metro: 451,679 (+11.44%) + Waco Metro: 271,942 (+15.77%) + Bryan/College Station Metro: 262,431 (+14.77%)
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  #52  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 7:01 PM
dave8721 dave8721 is offline
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
Fits my theory: not on I-95=has Mexican Americans as a large share of the Latino population
But also not the overwhelming majority like cities further west. More like a mix.
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  #53  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 9:17 PM
Docere Docere is offline
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Puerto Ricans are the largest Hispanic group in Flordia outside the Miami area. Orlando is 14% Puerto Rican.
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  #54  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 9:23 PM
dave8721 dave8721 is offline
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
Puerto Ricans are the largest Hispanic group in Flordia outside the Miami area. Orlando is 14% Puerto Rican.
Overall State of Florida numbers for Hispanics:
Cuban: 1,213,438 (~850k are in Miami-Dade, ~1 million in Miami metro)
Puerto Rican: 847,550
Mexican: 629,718
Colombian: 300,414
Nicaraguan: 135,143
Honduran: 107,302
Venezuelan: 102,116
Peruvian: 100,965

Compared to a Western state. here is California. Much more monolithic:
Mexican: 11,423,146
Salvadoran: 573,956
Guatemalan: 332,737
Puerto Rican: 189,945
Nicaraguan: 100,790
(Spaniard: 142,194)
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  #55  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
^ That's my point. The Hispanic population in Cleveland is mostly Puerto Rican.
yes, that is who was recruited for factory work. in fact as a group they may have been the last of that historic heavy industrial era, along with appalachians.

currently, for latinos cle proper still sees more from pr, and lately central america, than mexico.

otoh, columbus is very funny to me. when i lived there, not 'that' long ago, you could literally count the mexicans who lived there on one hand. nowadays of course, columbus is a-booming and gets most of the immigration in the state, pathetic as that is overall.

the largest mex population in the state is in nw ohio in the summer when the seasonal farm workers come. i have no idea how much trump has blown up that up these days. some of those folks ended up staying around in toledo, becoming legal citizens and working at the jeep factory and the like. i used to know a few people.
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  #56  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2020, 11:00 PM
wwmiv wwmiv is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave8721 View Post
But also not the overwhelming majority like cities further west. More like a mix.
Yes.
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Metropolitan Central Texas 2018: 5,672,404 (+19.98% over 2010):
San Antonio: 1,532,233 (+15.43%) + Metro Suburbs: 985,803 (+20.94%)
Austin: 964,254 (+22.00%) + Metro Suburbs: 1,204,062 (+30.04%)
Killeen/Temple Metro: 451,679 (+11.44%) + Waco Metro: 271,942 (+15.77%) + Bryan/College Station Metro: 262,431 (+14.77%)
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  #57  
Old Posted Jan 28, 2020, 12:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obadno View Post
I dont think anyone would say Chicago is a hub for mexican peoples and culture, they would for say Polish or Italian, or Irish (and long long ago French). Even if their are more Mexicans in Chicago by absolute numbers than those other groups these days.

Thats my take anyway
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
your take is radically outdated.

that's my take anyway.
I think that his ignorance is just like so many other coastal persons' ignorance - they think because Chicago is in the center of the country it couldn't possibly actually have anything to offer the rest of the country, let alone the world. But I mean, come on, there's even a Latino and Chicago-specific nickname: Chicaganos.

Chicago is home to people like Sandra Cisneros, has a high school named after Benito Juarez, has the National Museum of Mexican Art (which, according to Wikipedia, is the only Latino museum accredited by the American Alliance of Museums) - and at nearly 40 years old has lasted longer than most other Mexican or Mexican-American museums in the United States. Mexican culture here has also corrupted hot dogs with a so-called "mother-in-law" that is like creating a chili-dog out of a tamale in place of a frank.

Speaking of food, Chicago doesn't just offer "Mexican restaurants," but restaurants specializing in distinctly regional Mexican cuisines. One the food manufacturing side of things, La Preferida and Milagros started in Chicago and are now national brands.

There's no denying that the Southwest has a greater influence on Mexican-American culture both by virtue of being adjacent to the motherland, and by having had either completely dominant or strong plurality of Mexican and Mexican-American populations for centuries. But as far as contemporary influences go, Chicago holds its own and has a lot to offer to both Latin Americans specifically of Mexican heritage and other Latin Americans, too.
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  #58  
Old Posted Jan 28, 2020, 2:46 AM
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I think a lot of people underestimate Chicago’s diversity. It may not be at the level of NYC or LA, but it’s there, and is in the top 5 at least.
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  #59  
Old Posted Jan 28, 2020, 2:58 AM
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Houston is by far the most diverse: even-ish split between whites, blacks, Latinos, and Asians, with great diversity within the Latino and Asian populations.

Beneath that, NYC, LA, the Bay Area, and Chicago are all clearly above every other city in the United States on the diversity front.

Philadelphia, Miami, Atlanta, Detroit, Phoenix, Boston, D.C., Denver and others - while still being relatively diverse - are all noticeably less diverse with notable specific minority group absences.
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Metropolitan Central Texas 2018: 5,672,404 (+19.98% over 2010):
San Antonio: 1,532,233 (+15.43%) + Metro Suburbs: 985,803 (+20.94%)
Austin: 964,254 (+22.00%) + Metro Suburbs: 1,204,062 (+30.04%)
Killeen/Temple Metro: 451,679 (+11.44%) + Waco Metro: 271,942 (+15.77%) + Bryan/College Station Metro: 262,431 (+14.77%)
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  #60  
Old Posted Jan 28, 2020, 3:15 AM
Docere Docere is offline
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Houston is not more diverse than NYC or L.A.
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