Electric Scooters

[OTownandDown]

Just took a look at my Bird App. There's a few hundred scooters deployed.

Typical Ottawa bureaucracy, the map is so insanely granular with rules that it's going to be super frustrating to be riding along and have the bird shut down unexpectedly. Most Cities have maybe two or three 'zones' for no-go, or at least automatic speed restrictions in 'go slow' zones where pedestrian density requires more caution. Bird is great for restricting speeds to just above walking in these zones, and it actually is a welcome restriction, fostering better control of the scoots.

In Ottawa you've got like three dozen zones in the downtown, small strips, single blocks, and etc. where its a no-go (bird shuts off) or no-park (can't disengage with Bird), or both. The 'slow' zones are restricted to very very small areas, single intersections, etc. in places that kind of make sense.

I appreciate, (perhaps, but not really) that Birds aren't allowed on NCC Pathways, and so the map was updated with these super granular little access strips at the cross-canal bridges. Guaranteed my GPS will read outside of these areas while traversing a bridge, and the bird will shut down, causing lots of swearing... Although the canal pathway, river pathway, sparks street (go slow zone is best) is probably the BEST place to use one of these things.

I can get behind perhaps Sparks, where technically riding a bike is not allowed. But all bike paths, NCC or no, should be fair game. I can perhaps understand 'no parking' in zones where Bird delivery/pickup vehicles can't access, like the far reaches of the river pathway. But if I can bike on a pathway and kill a pedestrian, surely to god I can scoot on a pathway and also kill people.

Its like an old grandpa made these rules.

Originally Posted by rocketphish

[B]First shared e-scooters roll out in Ottawa

[eltodesukane]

How to find a scooter if you want one?
Is it free?

[rocketphish]

E-scooter education could take time as Ottawans figure out where to park them

Jon Willing, Ottawa Citizen
Publishing date: Jul 17, 2020 • Last Updated 4 hours ago • 3 minute read



It might take a couple of weeks before people renting electronic kick scooters fully understand where they should park the devices.

Ottawa residents, particularly those who live in downtown neighbourhoods, are seeing what a dockless e-scooter program will look like for the summer and fall.

The rental e-scooters don’t return to depots when people are done with them. A cornerstone of the business model is that customers can conveniently drop them off near their destinations.

Bird Canada on Thursday was the first to sprinkle its e-scooters around downtown neighbourhoods and there were a handful of reports of e-scooters ending up parked in improper locations.

Stewart Lyons of Bird Canada said the company had a “strong first day” in Ottawa, despite the few hiccups with scooters left in wrong places.

“It takes a couple of weeks to know what to do,” Lyons said Friday, calling the Thursday launch “a good first day.”

E-scooters must be parked in the furniture zones of the sidewalk where benches and trees are usually located. The devices must be out of the way of people using the sidewalk. The city is also eying on-street parking spaces to turn into e-scooter corrals.

Bird is one of three companies approved by the city to run e-scooter rental services. The other companies are Lime and Roll.

The city, for now, has capped the total number of rental e-scooters available at 600.

Each of the three companies have identified initial central-area deployment zones west of the Rideau River.

Lyons said Bird has deployed 260 e-scooters in an area generally between Parkdale Avenue and King Edward Avenue.

Bird’s deployment area involved some guesswork since the company doesn’t know yet where the demand will be for rented e-scooters, Lyons said.

“Over time we’ll adjust,” Lyons said.

Complicating the matter is the National Capital Commission not allowing e-scooters on its pathways. The City of Gatineau also isn’t a permitted area for Ottawa-based rented e-scooters. E-scooters will stop working if they touch NCC or City of Gatineau land, thanks to geofencing technology.

Coun. Tim Tierney, chair of Ottawa city council’s transportation committee, agreed that it will take time for people who rent e-scooters to understand the rules for parking the devices.

“I’m very impressed with what I’m seeing so far with the companies reacting to the situations,” Tierney said, noting that Bird staff on Day 1 quickly responded to reports of improper e-scooter parking.

Vivi Chi, director of transportation planning, said the city received only one service request Thursday regarding e-scooters, though she noted that people can also contact the e-scooter rental companies directly about improperly parked e-scooters.

Rental companies have one hour to collect an improperly parked e-scooter before a city crew might be dispatched to impound the devices.

Shawn Barber, president of the Centretown Citizens Community Association, said Friday morning that he hadn’t heard of any concerns from residents in the downtown neighbourhood about rogue e-scooters.

“I think generally if people are going to use them there’s going to have to be a learning process,” Barber said.

The community association is in favour of encouraging modes of transportation that don’t emit carbon pollution, Barber said, and he believes the battery-powered e-scooters are good for Ottawa.

While e-scooter rental companies have expressed interest in expanding the available number of devices beyond 600, Tierney advocated for a wait-and-see approach to gauge the results over the course of the first deployment period, which ends Oct. 31.

”We want to wait and hold tight and make sure we have complete success,” Tierney said.

jwilling@postmedia.com
twitter.com/JonathanWilling

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...-b6795abb503b/

[SidetrackedSue]

First one was dumped in the Canal on Thursday night/Friday morning.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ottawa/comm...ef_source=link

[SidetrackedSue]

Originally Posted by OTownandDown

all bike paths, NCC or no, should be fair game....if I can bike on a pathway and kill a pedestrian, surely to god I can scoot on a pathway and also kill people.

Following on... if you can scoot on a pathway and also kill people, you should be allowed to scoot on a sidewalk and kill people.

Currently, places where I am to walk are scooter free zones.

We can debate why we don't have segregated bike/walk paths here (which I would prefer, I hate the MUPs since I have PTSD after being injured by a bike on a sidewalk) but for now, I'm 'protected' from scooters on the path system.

[zzptichka]

Can you kick-scoot in no-go zones?

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by OTownandDown

Its like an old grandpa made these rules.

No, it's like an Interdepartmental and Interagency Steering Committee of Old Grandpas made these rules.

[mykl]

Originally Posted by zzptichka

Can you kick-scoot in no-go zones?

Yes, but they're heavy scooters so kick scooting sucks.

I decided to try a Bird scooter today and in 12 minutes I went from thinking they're ridiculous to thinking I may want to buy an electric scooter in the future. As a single guy who lives at the south end of downtown (Nature Museum) and walks everywhere, a scooter could really speed up my travel much of the year. They seem to run about $1000. It could be a really nice solution to not having a car, and not becoming sweaty due to biking in the heat.

I found the scooter went at a great speed. Only had to walk 1.5 blocks to get a scooter. Paid 6 bucks for 12 minutes. Loved just leaving it wherever I wanted (tucked out of the way of course). Its the same level of convenience of getting in and out of an uber without the awkward chitchat.

[SidetrackedSue]

Originally Posted by mykl

in 12 minutes I went from thinking they're ridiculous to thinking I may want to buy an electric scooter in the future.

Jeff Leiper bought one when they were legalized and seems to love the convenience. His use case is almost perfect although biking has been working for him. Your 'sweaty' argument makes a lot of sense, as well as being able to bring your scooter inside with you instead of hoping it will be there when you finish your meeting up with people (it would have to be locked, I guess, if you are shopping.)

In my case, I find the time to get my bike out of my parking spot, gear up (helmet, reflectors), bike to the errand, lock up, then have to carry my purchases with me as I run more errands, plus locking up at each stop, makes the bike slower than walking. A scooter is almost the convenience of walking with the speed of a bike.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by SidetrackedSue

Following on... if you can scoot on a pathway and also kill people, you should be allowed to scoot on a sidewalk and kill people.

It is a grey area, but bicycles are generally not allowed on sidewalks, so also banning scooters on them makes sense. Having them banned on MUPs, where bicycles are permitted (and encouraged) doesn't make sense to me. I don't see how a scooter, with a speed limit of 20 km/h, is any more dangerous to pedestrians than bicycles, which are heavier and can travel much faster.

We can debate why we don't have segregated bike/walk paths here (which I would prefer, I hate the MUPs since I have PTSD after being injured by a bike on a sidewalk) but for now, I'm 'protected' from scooters on the path system.

Ottawa's MUPs are frequently referred to as "bike paths" by people. It would be a tough sell to ban bicycles from them, and building separate walking and cycling paths would be expensive.

I remember when the SJAM Parkway was repaved about 20-25 years ago, there was a push to have wide curb lanes installed to make it safer for cyclists, but the NCC said no because they wanted all cyclists to use the paths. IMHO, the paths are fine for people going out for leisurely bike ride, but commuter cyclists (who are typically riding much faster) are better on the road (at least for urban paths).

[JayBuoy]

Originally Posted by roger1818

I remember when the SJAM Parkway was repaved about 20-25 years ago, there was a push to have wide curb lanes installed to make it safer for cyclists, but the NCC said no because they wanted all cyclists to use the paths. IMHO, the paths are fine for people going out for leisurely bike ride, but commuter cyclists (who are typically riding much faster) are better on the road (at least for urban paths).

I would actually go further and say that a lack of dedicated cycling infrastructure makes SJAM Parkway (more) unpleasant: noisy cars plus dodging cyclists is kind of stressful for me.
Also a factor along the canal, which I find quite sad since its so widely associated with the city. Whenever I have guests we walk past the canal once just to see, and then go to a more pleasant place where we can hear and pay attention to each other.

[Dengler Avenue]

I saw this thread first.
On Friday evening, as I was grabbing dinner in Chinatown, I saw a scooter lying on the south sidewalk of Somerset Street.
Then I saw this thread again.
Now I finally put 2 and 2 together.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by JayBuoy

I would actually go further and say that a lack of dedicated cycling infrastructure makes SJAM Parkway (more) unpleasant: noisy cars plus dodging cyclists is kind of stressful for me.

I know I've said this a million times, but we should look to Vancouver as an example of the right way to segregate bikes from pedestrians, at least for the long distances like along the canal and parkways, along with new complete neighborhoods (LeBreton Flats).

Drove by Elgin and Laurier the other day, and a Bird Scooter was parked pretty much at the crosswalk. I don't know if this is a regular occurrence, but it could be (a very predictable) issue.

I'm also disappointed in the branding. Plain black scooters with a plain white sticker that says "BIRD". Doesn't really stand out.

[eltodesukane]

I walked Strathcona Park, Riverain Park, and the Rideau River Eastern Pathway.
Very narrow pathway with pedestrians, dogs, bicycles, e-bikes, scooters and motorcycles going both ways, often quite silently. Not such a pleasant walk really.

[And also, no toilet. Is it so impossible to have some portable toilets at the very least?]

[SidetrackedSue]

I was driving along the Sir George-Étienne Cartier Parkway on Friday and my daughter commented/whined about all the bikes on the road. She said "There's a bike path" (no one calls them multi-use paths...) and implied they should be on it.

I pointed out that not one looked like anything other than a serious cyclist and was willing to bet most were close to or over the 20kph speed limit so they all belonged on the road. There's a reasonable space for cyclists on the road and they were all single file, and it was mid-day on a weekday so sharing the road meant little lost time to me and I was glad they weren't on the path terrorizing someone like me who walks on the paths.

I live across from the SirJAM MUPs and don't walk them at all if possible (there's a tiny stretch between the bridge and a no-bike walking path that I have to use and the I dodge the rest of them on sidewalk along the bridge, although I'm hoping with the bollards up, people will stay on the road more now.)

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by SidetrackedSue

I was driving along the Sir George-Étienne Cartier Parkway on Friday and my daughter commented/whined about all the bikes on the road. She said "There's a bike path" (no one calls them multi-use paths...) and implied they should be on it.

I pointed out that not one looked like anything other than a serious cyclist and was willing to bet most were close to or over the 20kph speed limit so they all belonged on the road. There's a reasonable space for cyclists on the road and they were all single file, and it was mid-day on a weekday so sharing the road meant little lost time to me and I was glad they weren't on the path terrorizing someone like me who walks on the paths.

I live across from the SirJAM MUPs and don't walk them at all if possible (there's a tiny stretch between the bridge and a no-bike walking path that I have to use and the I dodge the rest of them on sidewalk along the bridge, although I'm hoping with the bollards up, people will stay on the road more now.)

Thanks for sharing. Unfortunately your daughter's comment is a way too prevalent an attitude among adults. If the SJAM parkway had bike lanes (especially ones with some type of physical separation from the road), it would encourage more of the faster cyclists onto it and increase acceptance of their presence by motorists.

[OTownandDown]

I would never, ever, bike on SJAM in it's current condition unless it's closed to cars. It is way too dangerous with the small lanes and curves on hills. And even when it IS closed to cars, it's in such poor condition that biking on it is a real pain in the ass (literally).

That having been said, I bike close to the speed limit (on average). So I should be on the street. But it seems like a deathtrap to me.

I would REALLY not want to be on a scooter on the SJAM.

Anyways, separation of bike paths from pedestrian paths is becoming increasingly necessary, especially with Covid, people are out on the pathways in droves compared to before, and you can tell pedestrians who are getting fed up and paranoid as they walk. Personally, I also run on 'bike paths' occasionally, but I stick to the grass just because of all the traffic lately.

Most cities have a 'bell' rule, where you ring your bell regardless if pedestrians are in the way, just to let them know you're coming past (kind of like honking in some cultures, or grunting 'on your left'). In Ottawa if you ring your bell, 75% pedestrians seize up, get spooked, look all around, and run to the grass beside the trail. There's no happy medium.

The NCC announced their pathways would become wider to accommodate all users, and I was expecting the new path in front of parliament, and opposite at the Museum of History down on the river would get the special treatment, but alas it's still just a 'bike path' with a couple feet extra width. Why couldn't it have been painted with THREE lanes, two for bikes and one for pedestrians?

Going back to scooters, parking on the middle of the sidewalk is NOT allowed by the City, or by Bird. The app requires a photo of your final parking space, in order to lock the scooter and stop your time-based payments. More care needs to be taken by Bird to fine those users parking in inappropriate spots, to make sure the general public doesn't become pissed off by Bird clutter.

[Catenary]

Originally Posted by roger1818

It is a grey area, but bicycles are generally not allowed on sidewalks, so also banning scooters on them makes sense. Having them banned on MUPs, where bicycles are permitted (and encouraged) doesn't make sense to me. I don't see how a scooter, with a speed limit of 20 km/h, is any more dangerous to pedestrians than bicycles, which are heavier and can travel much faster.



Ottawa's MUPs are frequently referred to as "bike paths" by people. It would be a tough sell to ban bicycles from them, and building separate walking and cycling paths would be expensive.

I remember when the SJAM Parkway was repaved about 20-25 years ago, there was a push to have wide curb lanes installed to make it safer for cyclists, but the NCC said no because they wanted all cyclists to use the paths. IMHO, the paths are fine for people going out for leisurely bike ride, but commuter cyclists (who are typically riding much faster) are better on the road (at least for urban paths).

The real issue is that a 3m MUP is acceptable for a winding route through some suburban SWM pond, but no longer cuts it on a route into downtown. The NCC has totally dropped the ball on widening the MUPs along the canal as part of the canal wall reconstruction projects, and even installs benches right up against them. The city has one segregated sidewalk/MUP, on the Trillium Line MUP between Carling and Beech, and it's a good example of what to do in high pedestrian areas. Where there might be more cyclists than walkers/runners, such as along the canal, a 4m or 5m MUP would provide safe passing room.

[jleiper]

http://kitchissippiward.ca/content/scooters

Originally Posted by SidetrackedSue

Jeff Leiper bought one when they were legalized and seems to love the convenience. His use case is almost perfect although biking has been working for him. Your 'sweaty' argument makes a lot of sense, as well as being able to bring your scooter inside with you instead of hoping it will be there when you finish your meeting up with people (it would have to be locked, I guess, if you are shopping.)

In my case, I find the time to get my bike out of my parking spot, gear up (helmet, reflectors), bike to the errand, lock up, then have to carry my purchases with me as I run more errands, plus locking up at each stop, makes the bike slower than walking. A scooter is almost the convenience of walking with the speed of a bike.

[nredding]

I was walking along Patterson creek this morning when I came across 3 Bird employees fishing from a bridge with a rope with a hook at the end. Someone had dumped a scooter in the creek. I couldn’t see the scooter but I guess the electronics are waterproof so they could track it.