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  #121  
Old Posted May 1, 2014, 6:49 PM
Prahaboheme Prahaboheme is offline
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SunRail debuted today in Orlando to big crowds!!!

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/...,5552102.story

This is an historic day for Orlando and Central Florida mass transit. The first two weeks will be free of charge to commuters.
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  #122  
Old Posted May 1, 2014, 7:27 PM
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  #123  
Old Posted May 1, 2014, 8:21 PM
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  #124  
Old Posted May 1, 2014, 8:38 PM
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Congrats Orlando!
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  #125  
Old Posted May 2, 2014, 4:35 AM
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Alrighty!!! Just about time! Looking forward to it. Hopefully they will be so successful.
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  #126  
Old Posted May 2, 2014, 5:23 AM
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This is wonderful, and I predict this will be very successful within a few years. The core of the Metro area is doing a lot of things right, and this is going to be a big catalyst to further that.
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  #127  
Old Posted May 4, 2014, 8:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prahaboheme View Post
Phase II is funded and is in pre-construction. This will extend the line to DeLand (Northbound) and Kissimmee / Poinciana (Southbound). The Southbound phase 2 connection will be absolutely critical to the success of the system, as the southern (Osceola County) metro suffers from lack of transportation options the most.

Here is the system map (phase 2 in blue):
Man, that thing's gonna be so close to being able to hit Winter Haven and Lakeland, they gotta find a way to extend it.
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  #128  
Old Posted May 4, 2014, 9:07 PM
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That's a pretty long and impressive line.
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  #129  
Old Posted May 8, 2014, 2:43 PM
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I have a basic question: why, from day 1, have the Sun Rail people, not put in something like California's Baby Bullet? The line is 52km (32 miles) long, and is scheduled to take 1hour and 3 minutes, or a total average speed of approximately 51kmh. For US folks, that's about 32 mph.

If simple express patterns would be put in place, such as color coding stops into say Yellow, Red, and, Blue, and, trains at rush hour stopped at ~1/3 of the stations, average speeds would dramatically increase. Shaving 10 minutes off the trip, for example, would result in an average speed of 38 mph; 20 minutes off the trip would result in average speeds of ~48 mph.

Different express services should be instituted from day one, and, altered to reflect demand. While such services are complex to schedule and demand some of the stations be 3 or 4 tracked the payoffs are huge.

Remember these are diesel locomotive pulled double decker passenger cars which accelerate at a timid pace from dead stop.
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  #130  
Old Posted May 8, 2014, 2:55 PM
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Look at the line, we got a branch North of downtown, and a branch going South. I don't think many folks are riding all the way through. 30-some minute travel time from the furthest station to downtown isn't bad!
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  #131  
Old Posted May 8, 2014, 3:20 PM
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Originally Posted by BrennanW View Post
Look at the line, we got a branch North of downtown, and a branch going South. I don't think many folks are riding all the way through. 30-some minute travel time from the furthest station to downtown isn't bad!
The key, IMO, is the perception of speed. In addition, every incremental decrease in time taken to go from point X to point Y increases ridership.

This is what such trains can do.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HfG1Aupuc0

Oh yes, new commuter train systems have repeatedly botched this up in the US.
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  #132  
Old Posted May 8, 2014, 3:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrennanW View Post
Look at the line, we got a branch North of downtown, and a branch going South. I don't think many folks are riding all the way through. 30-some minute travel time from the furthest station to downtown isn't bad!
To add, average station spacing is relatively far apart to match the type of trains running on the line in suburban areas already, there's no need to bypass any. Station spacing is relatively short only in the urban central core, where being in walking distance is more important than average train speed. They're not going to be bypassing these central core stations anyways.

Now, if station spacing were blocks apart, less than 1,500 feet or 400 meters, like they are in New York's subways, the value of having express trains become more important. But their value dissipates when stations are placed miles apart. With new commuter rail lines, every station exists for a reason, or it wouldn't have been built.

Maybe 25, 50, 75 years from now conditions will change, other stations will be built and some existing stations will be shut down. I don't see the need to accommodate express trains when the ride to central core stations are just a half hour long. But, let's suppose and suggest over the decades they build many more stations along the existing line halving the station spacing, and as a result they change the type of trains running on the corridor to EMUs, they could add passing tracks in at a few of the new stations to accommodate express train services.

So, the fact they aren't now using express trains doesn't mean they can't forever. The rail corridor is 100 feet wide, there's room and space for future changes if and when necessary. Not every transit line in Europe has two, three, or four tracks in the corridor to accommodate more classes of passenger trains, even some of them are single track lines. You build what you project you need, you don't overbuild and waste reams of money unnecessary. Golly, most expressways were built initially with just 4 lanes ( 2 lanes each way), and as years passed and traffic increased, more lanes were added. It's the same principle being applied to trains.

Last edited by electricron; May 8, 2014 at 3:51 PM.
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  #133  
Old Posted May 8, 2014, 3:57 PM
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Originally Posted by electricron View Post
To add, average station spacing is relatively far apart to match the type of trains running on the line in suburban areas already, there's no need to bypass any. Station spacing is relatively short only in the urban central core, where being in walking distance is more important than average train speed. They're not going to be bypassing these central core stations anyways.
Now, if station spacing were blocks apart, less than 1,500 feet or 400 meters, like they are in New York's subways, the value of having express trains become more important. But their value dissipates when stations are placed miles apart. With new commuter rail lines, every station exists for a reason, or it wouldn't have been built. Maybe 25, 50, 75 years from now conditions will change, other stations will be built and some existing stations will be shut down. I don't see the need to accommodate express trains when the ride to central core stations are just a half hour long. But, let's suppose and suggest over the decades they build many more stations along the existing line halving the station spacing, and as a result they change the type of trains running on the corridor to EMUs, they could add passing tracks in at a few of the new stations to accommodate express train services. So, the fact they aren't now using express trains doesn't mean they can't forever.
Part of what US public transit rail systems routinely do wrong is that room to expand for increased infrastructural efficiency too often is not part of the initial package. This greatly increases the costs, if and when, line capacity is expanded. Simple things, like providing room for a 3rd or a 3rd and 4th line at stations are just not done, even in the best designs such as BART.

If provisions for capacity expansion and increased speed were part of initial designs, I would agree with your premise.

IMO, much of the "whys" has to do with the relative lack of exposure that those who make the decisions have to what the rest of the world is doing, or has recently done. I am not talking just about crash standards, but, also about routing, scheduling, station design, switching, curve radii, etc. Even with the behemoths that the US and Canada use for lines with mixed freight and passenger service, significant improvements in capacity, and, speed can be made fairly cheaply if expansion right of way is already owned.

The US continues to build commuter rail systems that are very similar to those that were built early in the 20th century for cities like Chicago and NYC.

In my home town, Denver, we, arguably are building the 2nd best new public transportation system, after Washington, in the US, yet, our designs neither reflect the average speeds, and, nor the passenger friendliness present in NYC in the 1920s.
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Good read on relationship between increasing number of freeway lanes and traffic

http://www.vtpi.org/gentraf.pdf
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  #134  
Old Posted May 8, 2014, 8:28 PM
Prahaboheme Prahaboheme is offline
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Sunrail runs on existing track. Aside from track upgrades and new station construction, this path was already in existence prior to Sunrail. There is really no need for express trains along this line.
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  #135  
Old Posted May 14, 2014, 6:45 PM
Prahaboheme Prahaboheme is offline
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SunRail ridership tops 95,000 during first nine days

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/...0,143813.story

"SunRail has carried more than 95,000 passengers through Metro Orlando during its first nine days of operations.

No one paid for the rides, which remain free through Friday. The base one-way fare of $2 goes into effect Monday.

The $1.2 billion commuter train has averaged more than 10,500 riders a day, more than double the 4,300 SunRail officials had anticipated."
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  #136  
Old Posted May 15, 2014, 3:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Prahaboheme View Post
SunRail ridership tops 95,000 during first nine days

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/...0,143813.story

"SunRail has carried more than 95,000 passengers through Metro Orlando during its first nine days of operations.

No one paid for the rides, which remain free through Friday. The base one-way fare of $2 goes into effect Monday.

The $1.2 billion commuter train has averaged more than 10,500 riders a day, more than double the 4,300 SunRail officials had anticipated."
excellent!!! I'm so extremely happy for it! I'm glad they are doing very well. I'm sure they will be so successful. There will be no more free rides after midnight.
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  #137  
Old Posted May 28, 2014, 7:33 PM
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any news on the new convention center/airport monorail ???
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  #138  
Old Posted May 29, 2014, 1:38 AM
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any news on the new convention center/airport monorail ???
No, not yet. We haven't hear it lately. Probably not for a while.
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  #139  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2014, 2:47 AM
eleven=11 eleven=11 is offline
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No, not yet. We haven't hear it lately. Probably not for a while.
why ? isn't the airport building a new parking garage
next to the new train station?

also about the southern end of sunrail
why don't Disney spend some money and build
a new monorail to Poinciana or something
Disney/ABC/espn I think can not only afford it
but should also be good for business......
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  #140  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2014, 2:56 AM
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^ Disney likes to control their own transportation systems so they aren't going to build a monorail anywhere outside of their own properties. Besides Poinciana will be part of Phase 2 of Sunrail eventually.
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