Tucson Development Thread

[Locofresh55]

Originally Posted by andrewsaturn

Looks like things are finally moving forward with the Mosaic Quarter which will have several athletic venues including UofA's men's ice hockey arena.

Besides Mosaic quarter, they would be wise to spruce up Benson hwy from Kino to Irvington. I mean the Owl's lodge, dispensary and the RV dealer are find and dandy, but I would look at a prime opportunity to make that a mini-entertainment district. At the least, look at the entrance to Kino South from Benson and put some restaurants/pubs there and keep folks around especially during the regional tournaments like they are hoping for.

[Eapiwo]

I couldn't agree more. I think the developer understands the significance of this site too, as they aptly named it the Gateway Project. This portion of downtown needs people. With the HSL's hotel sitting empty and the surrounding buildings being government 9-5s, this area is quite devoid of life outside of weekdays at lunch. I think this project will really help extend the "living" part of downtown to the western most extent it can be. I don't know that the side of this lot that abuts the frontage road will ever have life, but it will definitely help Congress feel more vibrant.

I agree with AZ71 that the overpass pedestrians would have to walk under to get to the Mercado District is still going to be a big divider between the districts. Strangely, I feel the Cushing Street Overpass is friendlier to walk under.

I'm excited to see this part of downtown in 2 years when 500+ more residents are putting some life into it between this project and the Bautista!

Skylines and skyscrapers are dope, but a healthy city center is too!

Originally Posted by Sonoran Swami

First, thanks very much Andrew Saturn for posting the updated renderings and information on this project. Very interesting.

Reading through the comments on this post there's some disappointment and frustration expressed that a taller structure won't be built. I get it. Afterall, this is the SkyscraperPage.com forum and the desire to improve a city's skyline is completely understandable.

I view this project a little differently. This may be an unpopular opinion but I am more concerned about how this development helps make the area work on the street level rather judging it with a heavy emphasis on zoning envelope maximizing building height.

On the other side of I-10 is the burgeoning Mercado District. How does this development help connect the Mercado District and downtown along Congress? That's my question. Of course and very thankfully there's the streetcar that connects the two via Cushing/Granada.

IMHO the I-10/Congress interchange with I-10 and its phalanx of attendant frontage roads is a hot bike/ped mess. The fact that Congress goes under I-10 makes the street connection a dark and uninviting place. Then there's motor vehicle traffic enhancing Circle K on the northeast corner and also a Carl's Junior on the southwest corner. Ugh.

So I see this development on the southeast corner as a positive. First, it is not a convenience store nor a fast food joint. In my view the site design helps create a sense of place for something other than motor vehicles. This development is not a cure all, but definitely a big move in the right direction with respect to walkability/bikeability/livability.

Having more people living in the area IMHO is a fantastic thing. The density spread across the building site for me makes it more desirable than a taller building on a squat parking podium. Retail fronting Congrees in my view is a huge positive as well. So is the street art component.

This site definitely has sone programming challenges. Only so much can be done on the side facing the I-10 frontage road.

Unfortunately, the U.S. is replete with cities that have great skylines but are complete car-centric abominations to live in because of terrible qualities at the human/street level. I never want Tucson to become one of those.

Lastly, thanks for lending your eyes to my mini-rant.

[southtucsonboy77]

It was stated in the Daily Star that the West Point Apartments II will be breaking ground this upcoming month. It's a positive infill project on a parking lot for much needed low-income housing.

Here are the most recent renderings of the 7-story structure (off of their Construction Plans):

[southtucsonboy77]

For Pueblo Vida fans (and brewery fans in general), they're working really hard in getting the necessary approvals to convert the vacant liquor store off of the SW corner of Congress and Grande into a 2nd site w/food options. This will be great for the Menlo Park community...and a good business combo and corner synergy with La Chaiteria across the street.

[andrewsaturn]

A permit was recently issued to Empire Pizza on Congress to expand it's kitchen and for tenant improvement. This could be pertaining to it's expansion into the old Hydra store next door. So hopefully we hear more about this project soon.

[CactusCat]

Foothills Mall's 'Uptown' makeover is moving forward

https://www.kgun9.com/news/community...moving-forward

[Sonoran Swami]

American Battery Factory lines up equipment partner for Tucson 'gigafactory'

The company, a spinoff of Utah-based battery pack maker Lion Energy, plans to invest $1.2 billion in capital investment and hire about 1,000 new jobs at full buildout of its Tucson factory complex at the research campus, where it broke ground on the first-phase factory in October.

https://tucson.com/news/local/busine...21709ac4e.html

https://americanbatteryfactory.com/

[Sonoran Swami]

Originally Posted by andrewsaturn

Looks like things are finally moving forward with the Mosaic Quarter which will have several athletic venues including UofA's men's ice hockey arena.

Thank you Andrew Saturn for the Mosaic Quarter update. As excited as I have been about this proposed development, I had almost forgotten about it. IMHO Mosaic Quarter is such a unique and cool project that will benefit Tucson in so many ways.

On the subject of recreation and athletic facilities, there's also the Tucson Velodrome to be built near the Pima County Fairgrounds. There was a ceremonial groundbreaking for this held in September of last year:

https://tucsonvelodrome.com/

As I'm sure many know, Tucson is the training base for many professional and serious amateur cyclists in every discipline. Having a velodrome is a critical piece of infrastructure in strengthening Tucson's position in this regard. Tucson's will be the only velodrome in the southwest and the only velodrome between Colorado and southern California. Map:

https://tedbike.wordpress.com/2012/0...north-america/

[Sonoran Swami]

As I read the below article, the debate on the BRT northern leg alignment between Oracle Road and Stone Avenue appears to decided in favor of Stone Avenue. I wasn't aware that this selection had been made, but apparently so. Thoughts?

The City of Tucson plans to construct its first Bus Rapid Transit system

https://wildcat.arizona.edu/153807/n...ransit-system/


This map on the Tucson BRT site seems to confirm Stone as the preferred alignment:

[AZ71]

Originally Posted by Sonoran Swami

As I read the below article, the debate on the BRT northern leg alignment between Oracle Road and Stone Avenue appears to decided in favor of Stone Avenue. I wasn't aware that this selection had been made, but apparently so. Thoughts?

The City of Tucson plans to construct its first Bus Rapid Transit system

https://wildcat.arizona.edu/153807/n...ransit-system/


This map on the Tucson BRT site seems to confirm Stone as the preferred alignment:

I think Stone Ave is a complete waste of money. There are few businesses along the route. First off it should have been the streetcar along Oracle. But even choosing the BRT, it needs to pass businesses and places people go. Does the city think people at Tucson Mall are in a rush to get downtown or vice versa? For what? Is their other possible idea is they think people from downtown wanting to go to Target on Roger Rd are gonna get off at Roger and Stone and walk 2-3 blocks west in the middle of summer in 110 weather? Tucson officials' concept of transportation is ridiculous.

[combusean]

Oracle, being a state route, is a non starter for any sort of HCT in the legislature's current political climate.

I rarely advocate for no-builds when it comes to transit but that northern leg should be put aside until the winds shift and sanity prevails.

Alternatively, the RTA could band together and ask Arizona to delete SR 77 south of whatever point, but the county alone would be responsible for its maintenance.

[AZ71]

Originally Posted by combusean

Oracle, being a state route, is a non starter for any sort of HCT in the legislature's current political climate.

I rarely advocate for no-builds when it comes to transit but that northern leg should be put aside until the winds shift and sanity prevails.

Alternatively, the RTA could band together and ask Arizona to delete SR 77 south of whatever point, but the county alone would be responsible for its maintenance.

I agree with you. I think they should take this north sector off the table. It's really a waste of money at this point. Even 1st Ave would be a better option...which they've been arguing for years with RTA on its widening? Consolidate and make 1st Ave a BRT with better bikable lanes and sidewalks. But really save the money and put it in our plethora of potholes sprouting up like I've never seen before.

[combusean]

I created the General Tucson Discussion Thread for a reason Swami. Please post this sort of thing there.

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=258459

[Eapiwo]

This is a few months late to the discussion, but TUSD will be selling their headquarters at 1010 e 10th st to a private student housing developer and moving to the University's Science Annex Downtown. The lot is directly across from the Mark student housing and across from the Welcome Diner.

https://news.azpm.org/s/98006-tusd-p...-new-building/

[combusean]

Looking at that lot I really have to wonder how The Mark nearby passed design review. That fence surrounding it with bizarre ramps, exposed unscreened garages, and essentially zero pedestrian friendliness replacing streetside commercial and unique local architecture is pretty much the exact opposite direction Tucson should be growing, and that's not an isolated example.

[AZ71]

Originally Posted by combusean

Looking at that lot I really have to wonder how The Mark nearby passed design review. That fence surrounding it with bizarre ramps, exposed unscreened garages, and essentially zero pedestrian friendliness replacing streetside commercial and unique local architecture is pretty much the exact opposite direction Tucson should be growing, and that's not an isolated example.

I disagree. The Mark was one of the most scrutinized developments by local neighborhoods to get the exact perfect set back, step downs and still reach a height of 8 stories. It also suffered a fire from arson in which they quickly rebounded. It's exactly the kind of development that Tucson needs. But nothing like it will ever be built again because neighborhoods has banned anything above 4 stories or something absurd. This is the reason why we have a housing crisis. What is unique local architecture? Tucson started out with Barrio design. Then in the 20s moved to Spanish Revival. Then in the 50s moved to mid-century modern. We have 70s/80s era skyscrapers downtown. We need to lift height restrictions and zoning codes and build like crazy. I will agree some retail would be nice in future developments on ground level, but The Mark is one of the most ingenious designs to me just to meet the developers needs and the communities lengthy requirement list.

[combusean]

I have no idea how you could consider a fenced off fortress "ingenious." The neighborhood might not be used to actual quality projects that know how to address a local street.

This is one that was heavily scrutinized and still got built and has an approach that is two orders of magnitude better than The Mark.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/5Vdp2oUMGtoKicwi6

[Eapiwo]

Originally Posted by AZ71

I disagree. The Mark was one of the most scrutinized developments by local neighborhoods to get the exact perfect set back, step downs and still reach a height of 8 stories. It also suffered a fire from arson in which they quickly rebounded. It's exactly the kind of development that Tucson needs. But nothing like it will ever be built again because neighborhoods has banned anything above 4 stories or something absurd. This is the reason why we have a housing crisis. What is unique local architecture? Tucson started out with Barrio design. Then in the 20s moved to Spanish Revival. Then in the 50s moved to mid-century modern. We have 70s/80s era skyscrapers downtown. We need to lift height restrictions and zoning codes and build like crazy. I will agree some retail would be nice in future developments on ground level, but The Mark is one of the most ingenious designs to me just to meet the developers needs and the communities lengthy requirement list.

I appreciate your thoughts on how architecture changes over time. I always think it'll be ironic if the architecture from this era becomes revered in 50, 60 years and we were here fighting to make buildings look like they're from a past era. I think it's okay for buildings from our time to have their own look. The uniqueness in this current era of architecture can't be seen until it's over.

That said, the Mark is okay. I'm not sure that every building needs multi-uses, though generally multi-use is a good thing. With the context of the current housing crisis, I appreciate that these student housing buildings are juggernauts that provide homes for 500 people in the blink of an eye. I'm still impressed that there's demand for new student housing as UofA attendance on its main campus has been holding steady at about 30-33k for the last decade since these buildings started popping up. If they keep popping up and selling out, then clearly there's demand for them. I suspect that the Gateway Diner apartments will be student oriented as well.

I'd love to see some apartments downtown come up that are marketed for the non-student market. I think we are still comically low in supply for that market.

[AZ71]

Originally Posted by combusean

I have no idea how you could consider a fenced off fortress "ingenious." The neighborhood might not be used to actual quality projects that know how to address a local street.

This is one that was heavily scrutinized and still got built and has an approach that is two orders of magnitude better than The Mark.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/5Vdp2oUMGtoKicwi6

Well linking to a complex in Glendale isn't fair. You're tapping the expertise of Phx developers. And that complex seems to fit in fine in the neighborhood environment. But The Mark is on the biggest east/west corridor in Tucson. And despite a black fence (which with our increasing crime I cant blame them for safety)...I still think they did an amazing job at making this building look like it's only 4 stories from the neighborhood behind it. Only 5-6 stories from the view of the street. And with 8 stories internally. And they all did it without making it look as awful as The Flin downtown. I think they should be commended.

https://imgur.com/a/LxfPlFV

[combusean]

I wasn't trying to be unfair with the above comparison, I was just giving an example of a project that integrates well.

But if the black fence was done for safety that's a different matter entirely. That excuses a lot, especially when the neighbors want a desert setback which seems to happen with every new build, even downtown.