The Official Moncton, NB Project Thread

[jonny golden]

Originally Posted by Bishop2047

My understanding is that there is little difference between the two. It's a designation by sq/ft and perhaps some other features like capability to fill third party orders and such. Seems that the lines are a bit blurry, but my family that works there always corrects me.

I'm sure at some point NB will have some sort of Amazon presence. Despite my personal efforts to avoid them at all cost.

Do you think that Moncton would have a large enough population coverage area for an Amazon facility given the warehouse in Halifax?

[MonctonPerson]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Here is the link for the March PAC meeting for the city of Moncton:

https://www5.moncton.ca/docs/pac/PAC...re_du_jour.pdf

The only item of note is this:



Curiously, there is no supporting documentation posted on the PAC website.

Sign of the future now that the city has approved reducing what requires PAC approval.

The Jonathan Park item was discussed at the last city council meeting. Basically, another street with homes close to Rayan, but the developer is proposing to hand over more land to the city as a greenspace buffer to address concerns about the north end smells.

[josh_cat_eyes]

Originally Posted by MonctonPerson

Sign of the future now that the city has approved reducing what requires PAC approval.

The Jonathan Park item was discussed at the last city council meeting. Basically, another street with homes close to Rayan, but the developer is proposing to hand over more land to the city as a greenspace buffer to address concerns about the north end smells.

I’m pretty sure they figured out it was the Transaqua facility where they make mulch that was causing the smell. Speaking of which, if anyone ever needs mulch, I highly recommend this! It’s free unless you need a large amount and require them to load it for you.

[MonctonRad]

Moncton Irving land no longer a factor in city housing plans
City plan adopted in 2017 called for hundreds of homes on area now not expected to be developed
Shane Magee · CBC News · Posted: Mar 21, 2024 6:00 AM ADT | Last Updated: 3 hours ago
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...lans-1.7149491


CBC Photo of the land in question. Robert Irving's home and horse farm is in the upper left of the image. He has purchased the wooded land in the foreground.


CBC photo - This had been the city's plan for the proposed Humphrey Brook neighbourhood (prior to Irving buying the land)

Hundreds of acres in Moncton where the city expected thousands of people to call home are now no longer a factor in its plans after the land was purchased by one of New Brunswick's most powerful families.

It's a change that comes as the city plans to overhaul zoning rules to address what the city's mayor has described as a "crisis situation" for housing.

The properties in the city's east end cover an area comparable in size to Moncton's downtown. They were purchased almost a decade ago by Robert Irving and the company he leads, Cavendish Farms.

Around the time of the purchases, the city spent $150,000 and two years on a plan calling for the area to become home to thousands of people by the 2030s.

[josh_cat_eyes]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Moncton Irving land no longer a factor in city housing plans
City plan adopted in 2017 called for hundreds of homes on area now not expected to be developed
Shane Magee · CBC News · Posted: Mar 21, 2024 6:00 AM ADT | Last Updated: 3 hours ago
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...lans-1.7149491


CBC Photo of the land in question. Robert Irving's home and horse farm is in the upper left of the image. He has purchased the wooded land in the foreground.


CBC photo - This had been the city's plan for the proposed Humphrey Brook neighbourhood (prior to Irving buying the land)

Screw Robert Irving. Billionaires shouldn’t exist and they shouldn’t be holding valuable land hostage like this either. They should make him pay for the the cost of the plan. Or expropriate the land to at least connect the existing area to the industrial park north of the train tracks.

[tmacdougall]

Setting aside personal emotions, this situation epitomizes pure capitalism.

If you're seeking to assign blame for the plan's expenses, perhaps directing your focus towards city officials would be apt. To my knowledge, the city proceeded with the plan despite being aware that the land wouldn't be accessible.

Originally Posted by josh_cat_eyes

Screw Robert Irving. Billionaires shouldn’t exist and they shouldn’t be holding valuable land hostage like this either. They should make him pay for the the cost of the plan. Or expropriate the land to at least connect the existing area to the industrial park north of the train tracks.

[LewisVillis]

Imagine you own a little oasis in the middle of the suburbs, and you've built a beautiful house and stables for your equine-loving equestrian wife, but then dammit, there are rumours, then the city is making actual plans to develop those quiet woods all around you. And wasn't that why you moved out here in the first place? Now your wife is distraught, she wants to move (Florida!), but what if the city and the landowners aren't the same page, and heck, what's a few mill out of the chequing account, and what if her birthday was approaching. Hell of a gift, I tell ya. "All this, Jill-Babe" - he gestures to the forest far and wide - "it's yours now." "W-what?!" She looks her "Bob-cat" fiercely in the eyes, purrs, and...

Anyway! Perhaps there's a familial, human side to this, on top of some daddy-big-bucks taking advantage of a real estate opportunity.

[Sunnybrae]

Originally Posted by josh_cat_eyes

Screw Robert Irving. Billionaires shouldn’t exist and they shouldn’t be holding valuable land hostage like this either. They should make him pay for the the cost of the plan. Or expropriate the land to at least connect the existing area to the industrial park north of the train tracks.

I'm with ya comrade!

[MonctonRad]

I'm in the middle. Did Robert Irving need to buy so much land as to kibosh the entire Humphrey Brook Neighbourhood Plan - probably not, but I could understand he might want to have a substantial treed buffer for privacy purposes. I would have liked it if a compromise could have been reached, and the plan scaled back some, but not completely discarded.

In any event, this is a lost opportunity for the city.

[darkharbour]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I'm in the middle. Did Robert Irving need to buy so much land as to kibosh the entire Humphrey Brook Neighbourhood Plan - probably not, but I could understand he might want to have a substantial treed buffer for privacy purposes. I would have liked it if a compromise could have been reached, and the plan scaled back some, but not completely discarded.

I'm sure everyone knows this in New Brunswick, but having grown up in Rothesay and now living next door to Arthur, the Irving family certainly loves to have large buffers around their homes. This extends to the purchase of neighbouring houses that they then tear down and then re-vegetate the plots to get a bigger buffer (I witnessed this happening next door to me my entire life).

[jnaygull]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I'm in the middle. Did Robert Irving need to buy so much land as to kibosh the entire Humphrey Brook Neighbourhood Plan - probably not, but I could understand he might want to have a substantial treed buffer for privacy purposes. I would have liked it if a compromise could have been reached, and the plan scaled back some, but not completely discarded.

In any event, this is a lost opportunity for the city.

If I were in his shoes, I would have done the same.

Up instead of out. I am glad some greenery was saved.

... now is Mr Irving paying his share of taxes on said land?

[Riberview]

Originally Posted by jnaygull

If I were in his shoes, I would have done the same.

Up instead of out. I am glad some greenery was saved.

... now is Mr Irving paying his share of taxes on said land?

well the giant parcel he purchased for $3.9mil is assessed at $2.6mil. he pays $63,931 this year. up from $63,509 last year.

his mansion is assessed at $5.4mil, and he pays $74k.. and the horse barn is assessed at $825k, and he pays $20k.

those are the bills anyway. whether he pays it is another question

[Ifyoubuildit]

Originally Posted by tmacdougall

Setting aside personal emotions, this situation epitomizes pure capitalism.

If you're seeking to assign blame for the plan's expenses, perhaps directing your focus towards city officials would be apt. To my knowledge, the city proceeded with the plan despite being aware that the land wouldn't be accessible.

What likely happened is the city was forcing the owner to build and pay for ALL of the infra-structure such as new boulevards, traffic circles, sidewalks, public green space, retention ponds, etc which likely made any business plan to monetize their land via development infeasible. This plan likely took years to develop at the developers cost to meet city demands. Then Mr. Irving came along and offered them a decent amount, at least allowing them to recoup some of their money and walk away from all the risk. Just a hypothesis.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Ifyoubuildit

What likely happened is the city was forcing the owner to build and pay for ALL of the infra-structure such as new boulevards, traffic circles, sidewalks, public green space, retention ponds, etc which likely made any business plan to monetize their land via development infeasible. This plan likely took years to develop at the developers cost to meet city demands. Then Mr. Irving came along and offered them a decent amount, at least allowing them to recoup some of their money and walk away from all the risk. Just a hypothesis.

Isn't it typical for developers to pay for new infrastructure anyways?

[josh_cat_eyes]

Originally Posted by OliverD

Isn't it typical for developers to pay for new infrastructure anyways?

Didn’t the city make a policy that they can cover large costs like bridges and stuff like that?

[Ifyoubuildit]

Originally Posted by josh_cat_eyes

Didn’t the city make a policy that they can cover large costs like bridges and stuff like that?

I believe the city only recently came out with a “charge-back” program in which they still charge the developers for infrastructure. But if the infrastructure benefits an adjacent land owner such as building a bridge, the adjacent land owner will be on the hook for part of the bridge. I think under this program the city may also front some infrastructure costs, but the owner will not be granted a development permit until they pay. With the new housing crisis and federal housing money floating around, maybe govt will cover some infrastructure like the recently announced Dieppe Blvd extension.

[AverageMonctonEnjoyr]

I have a general question about our city and it’s development, very sorry if I interrupt any discussion and please delete my message if it’s the case.
Manchester city, in the UK, has had a huge boom in construction of skyscrapers in the last 10 years and it looks totally unrecognizable. This is partially due to the fact that the city generously lends enormous sums to developers to help them with the projects. Are there any incentives here in Moncton for developers to build high rises ? Or are we still very far from that.


https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-manchester-68655999

[MonctonRad]

Incentive programs do exist, but, they are modest, and are for specific purposes (such as the inclusion of non market value rental units for low income people). Nothing like in Manchester.

[AverageMonctonEnjoyr]

Alright thanks man !

[Nashe]

I believe there are significant property tax breaks for developers downtown.