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  #21  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2023, 8:33 PM
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I like how they are trying in many ways in the images to make it look much less taller than it is.
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  #22  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2023, 1:39 AM
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Why are people upset at the NIMBYS?? They don't want their city to be another New York.. oh wait.
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  #23  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2023, 1:44 AM
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This sums them up:

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“To even be considering 900 feet — I can’t believe it has gotten to this place,” said CB1 member and Tribecan Tricia Joyce. “We are not against development. There is logical development, and then there is this…It is completely out of context for this neighborhood. Whether or not you are allowed to build it should not be part of our discussion. This is not the right development in this place.”

How dare they even discuss such things, in Manhattan of all places.
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  #24  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2023, 9:24 PM
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http://www.tribecatrib.com/content/i...oot-tower-plan

'I Still Can't Believe It.' Tribecans Meet Developers Over 940-Foot Tower Plan.




Benjamin Rubenstein of Stellar Management tells a meeting of Community Board 1's Land Use, Zoning and Economic Development Committee that a skinnier, taller tower means "more benefits at ground level, from casting a thinner shadow to keeping the distance between the buildings greater." Photo: Linda Buongermino





John Scott, advisory board president of the Independence Plaza Senior Center, located a short distance from the proposed construction, rejected claims by the developers that the center can remain open during the noisy construction. “It’s going to hurt their health,” he said. ”They ned to have socialization, they need these programs, and your building is going to kill seniors.



By CARL GLASSMAN
Dec. 14, 2023


Quote:
Developers of a newly proposed 940-foot residential tower in Tribeca’s Independence Plaza faced their project’s irate neighbors for the first time on Monday.

Appearing before Community Board 1’s Land Use, Zoning and Economic Development Committee and a roomful of local residents (plus more than 100 others viewing remotely), representatives for Independence Plaza owners Vornado Realty Trust and Stellar Management introduced their plans for the tower and two adjacent 8-story buildings on Greenwich Street, near Jay. There were no tower renderings to share and not much in the way of specifics about the massive project or its construction. What they pitched were the claimed benefits of their project: an improved streetscape along Greenwich Street; new housing for Lower Manhattan (including some as-yet-unknown number of “affordable” units); and, as one developer representative put it, a tower that would “enhance the skyline of Lower Manhattan.”

They also, to the mystification of many of the project’s critics, offered a legal rationale for why the skyscraper—to be the tallest building in the neighborhood—can skirt the city’s rigorous land use review process, known as ULURP. That review would require key support by the district’s City Councilman, Christopher Marte, who says he opposes the project as proposed.
Quote:
According to the developers, the southern parcel of Independence Plaza (south of Harrison Street) was not fully developed to its zoning maximum. So that additional square footage plus a “voluntary inclusionary zoning bonus” for providing some permanently affordable housing accounts for the square footage that the current zoning now allows. And because there is no zoning change request or new waivers needed, a ULURP is not required, the developers say.

(Marte, at a town hall with residents the week before, said he is “looking at every piece of zoning document that ever had to do with this lot, this tax lot, this zoning lot, to figure out strategies for my office to advocate” for a ULURP. That decision rests with the Department of City Planning. Ezra Moser, a City Planning official at the community board meeting, declined to comment on the project.)

But for some critics of the plan, the technical legality of the project is beside the point.

“To come to us with something of this scale after walking these streets, I still can’t quite believe it. It is completely out of context for this part of the neighborhood,” said CB1 member Tricia Joyce.

“We do need affordable housing,” she added. “We do not need one more minute of luxury housing down here.”
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  #25  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2023, 9:29 PM
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  #26  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2023, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by chris08876 View Post
They probally don't like it because they don't want to look out their window and see a taller tower and know they they can't afford those units. Its all the who has the largest tower concept. Clearly 940 ft hurts their old egos... and they complain!

Yeah this will go through the motions, courts will rule for it... and it will rise. Same sort of BS with the LES towers. After hurdles and hurdles, lawsuits being shot down... eventually, reason will prevail. On a side note, I hope those LES towers (Cherry/Clinton streets) start soon.

hear! hear! i want muh green tile tower!
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  #27  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2023, 8:54 PM
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https://tribecacitizen.com/2023/12/1...eet-look-like/

What does 900 feet look like?


December 18, 2023


Quote:
I wanted to get a reference for other 900-foot-tall residential buildings in the neighborhood and Fidi, and there are not many. For comparison on the commercial side, One World Trade is 1776. 4 World Trade is 978. 7 World Trade Center is 741.

The proposal for the new tower for Independence Plaza has it clocking in at 940 feet, with 100 x 100-foot floors in the tower, which would be set on a wider base at the street level. Here are the heights of the other buildings on the Washington Market Urban Renewal Area in descending order:

111 Murray — 792 feet
Citi — 496 feet
101 Warren — 428 feet
Bank of New York Mellon — 361
Independence Plaza — 356 feet
200 Chambers — 301 feet

And some more residential buildings in the neighborhood and in Fidi for reference. Only 125 Greenwich, the Rafael Viñoly-designed residential tower just south of the World Trade Center, crosses the 900-foot line. (That building is 455,815 square feet and will have 243 units.)

56 Leonard — 796 feet
Woolworth Building — 792 feet
One Wall Street – 654 feet
45 Park Place (stalled out) — 667 feet
125 Greenwich (under construction still) — 912 feet
One Manhattan Square — 847 feet
8 Spruce Street — 827 feet
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  #28  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2023, 1:17 AM
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Alright, lets get real with it.
From my 3D model since they're being shy with theirs:









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  #29  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2023, 1:35 AM
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^ Great. That's exactly what they need to show at those community discussions. This tower is in no way out of context for that area. That they could even suggest it is shows just how out of touch with reality they are.
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  #30  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2024, 7:26 PM
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This was shared in the SkyscraperCity thread (from a presentation apparently)

Source: https://www.skyscrapercity.com/threa...l-pro.2413139/


I'm liking it


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  #31  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2024, 9:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Zapatan View Post
This was shared in the SkyscraperCity thread (from a presentation apparently)

Source: https://www.skyscrapercity.com/threa...l-pro.2413139/

Also posted on the previous page, and yes it was from a CB presentation.
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  #32  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2024, 11:32 PM
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Looks like a mini og WTC if it actually has a gray facade. Great view from the Brooklyn Bridge
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  #33  
Old Posted Jan 6, 2024, 11:36 PM
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Looks pretty good. And yeah, this will look fantastic from the Brooklyn Bridge.

Hopefully the wealthy Tribeca NIMBYs won't be too much of a hindrance.
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  #34  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 3:59 PM
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I’m shocked NIMBYs would try to block this…


https://tribecacitizen.com/2024/03/2...o-fight-tower/

Independence Plaza neighbors gearing up to fight tower





March 26, 2024


Quote:
A small group of Independence Plaza residents are organizing against the proposed tower for Independence Plaza, and they are looking for volunteers with time, expertise and funding. They held their first group community meeting last night, attracting a substantial crowd, nearly all of whom — there was a show of hands — are opposed to *any* construction on the site.

So far the core group includes Diane Lapson, the longtime IPN Tenant Association president; Richard Corman, the president of the Downtown Independent Democrats political club; Stuart Gold, a retired litigator who lives in Tribeca; and Stephanie Kelemen, a Greenwich Street resident and a commercial litigator. Councilman Chris Marte organized and led the meeting, his second on the proposed tower.
Quote:
The initial plan — and it was vague but this is what I gleaned — is to create a non-profit that can raise money to hire a zoning expert who can keep pace with Vornado Realty Trust and Stellar Management — the owners of IPN and the developers of the tower. Organizers already know they need more expertise to understand the zoning regulations for the building, which developers have said can be 900 feet tall as-of-right, and the covenants established in the 1970s, when Independence Plaza was created.

“Nobody in Tribeca likes this project,” Kelemen said. “New York City is now the ‘City of Yes’ — the city of anything goes. Our sunlight and our open spaces are all up for grabs unless we fight. This is our time as a community to come together and see if it’s something that we want to fight for.”

I heard from a press representative for Stellar before the meeting and asked if there was any schedule for filings with the city, and so far, no. “Stellar is engaged in ongoing discussions with the Department of City Planning,” he said. “We are still too early in the process to provide a specific timeline for permitting or any updated renderings.”
Quote:
He noted that the project will go through the full CEQR — City Environmental Quality Review — which would identify adverse environmental effects, assesses their significance, and propose measures to eliminate or mitigate significant impacts through an Environmental Impact Statement. (I didn’t think that was true of proposed buildings that fell within the zoning code, aka as-of-right, but always learning…) That review process includes opportunities for public presentations and comments.

I also asked what was happening to the current residents in the IPN townhouses that will be razed to make room for the tower, and he said that no residents will be displaced from Independence Plaza as a result of the project. “Stellar and Vornado are working with all existing residents who want to remain part of the IP community to relocate them to similar or better units,” he said.
Quote:
In a series of questions, neighbors in the audience listed some of their reasons why they were against the tower: noise and dust during construction, the mountains of trash created by big buildings; the potential damage to the historic townhouses on Harrison; the fact that the building (along with the other Independence Plaza buildings) will be in a flood zone and — some seemed to think — is already built on top of sinking ground (of course that would be true of the three existing IPN buildings as well). There was also opposition to the idea of luxury development — an apartment building for only the wealthy.

Few comments were made about the ridiculous height, which would be my #1 objection. (And while we are on that topic, why doesn’t Vornado buy 45 Park Place and finish that monstrosity?)

“This is the wrong place for a tower,” said Diane Lapson, who then referenced the neighborhood’s experience on 9/11. “We paid our dues already. Enough. We are a special needs community. Many of us have PTSD from 9/11.”

Councilman Marte emphasized his experience with the Two Bridges tower development (which will go forward) and noted that the failings there were largely that the community was not monolithic in its approach. Some thought the towers should be smaller; some thought they should not be built at all. It undermined their negotiating power, he said.

“Too much division allowed developers to have their way,” he said.

The group does not have a plan yet, but thinks it is early enough in the process to be effective, Richard Corman said. “We have to minimize the worst and maximize the benefit for people in the community,” he added.


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  #35  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 4:02 PM
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Because some people will grab onto anything to give their life meaning.
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  #36  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 4:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Busy Bee View Post
Because some people will grab onto anything to give their life meaning.
“You live for the fight when that’s all you’ve got…”
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  #37  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 5:56 PM
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When a NIMBY sees their shadow, 6 more weeks of community input meetings.
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  #38  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 6:47 PM
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^ Exactly.


Quote:

“This is the wrong place for a tower,” said Diane Lapson, who then referenced the neighborhood’s experience on 9/11. “We paid our dues already. Enough. We are a special needs community. Many of us have PTSD from 9/11.”

Diane has suffered so much stress from 9/11 that she simply refuses to leave the area. Special needs indeed.
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  #39  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 7:02 PM
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  #40  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2024, 7:15 PM
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I hate these insufferable people, its really a f'ing joke that they are even allowed to hold this up.
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