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  #1  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 4:37 PM
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Why You Shouldn't Mock Suburbanites Who Say They're From the City

Why You Shouldn't Mock Suburbanites Who Say They're From the City



Don't even think about saying you're from Boston.


Quote:
The stereotypes of the suburban/urban dichotomy no longer hold true.

It's a social practice as common as air: using a major city as a proxy when telling a stranger where you're from. At simplest, it's a matter of convenience; it can indeed be easier, and faster, to tell someone whom you assume does not know the intricacies of New England that you're from Boston, when in fact you're from Cumberland, Maine, 109 miles northeast of the city. Or, more often, an adjoining suburb or exurb.

But upon discovering that someone is not in fact from exactly where they claim, those of us on the receiving end may very well enjoy calling them out on it. We might laugh at the Mainer in the London bar, or remind the New Jersey resident who says she's from New York City that she's not from New York City at all. We're especially ready to reject these kinds of claim if we're from the city in question, in which case we might feel the need to protect our turf, and the values we associate with it.

"Growing up in the actual city of Boston gives you a sense of pride and you feel as though your experiences with the city differ from those in the suburbs," says Robyn Casper, 23. Casper is a product of Dorchester, a predominantly black, historically Irish working-class neighborhood in southeast Boston.

"The diversity of people you encounter each day, the school settings you experience, us who grew up in the city face stereotypes of our neighborhood and the issues of city life that those on the outskirts don’t have to deal with," Casper says. "So they shouldn't be able to say they live here when their lives were probably very different from ours."

Casper would no doubt seethe at the thought of someone from a different state entirely saying they were from Boston. And she'd be a little bit right about that. But even in extreme cases like this one, we need to allow for more wiggle room.

Why? First, it no longer makes sense to generalize the experience of the "actual city" as radically more heterogeneous than, or separate from, life in a suburb or exurb. In a study in The Journal of Urban History, urban historians and sociologists Matthew D. Lassiter* and Christopher Niedt write of suburbs' countless modes of diversity:

The 2008 U.S. Census update revealed that racial and ethnic minorities now make up one-third of the total suburban population in the nation’s one hundred largest metropolitan regions… [There are] residential patterns that include affluent single-family neighborhoods, high-poverty inner-ring suburbs… and exurban developments hit hard by predatory subprime lending and the ongoing foreclosure crisis. The U.S. suburban population now includes a majority of both first-generation immigrants and poor residents of metropolitan areas, and nearly half of all renters. Despite the persistence of the traditional nuclear family ideal, only about one-fourth of today's suburban households consist of heterosexual married couples with children under the age of eighteen.

A large and growing percentage of the national population live in extraordinarily diverse outer city rings, whose growth has been anchored by a metropolitan core. The stereotypes of the suburban/urban dichotomy in most cases no longer hold true. So why insist on cordoning off a city name from a sub/exurbanite who wants to use it? Very possibly, they've chosen to use that city name in order to avoid the outdated assumptions that may fuel our rejection of it.

Indeed, many city leaders say it no longer makes sense to think of cities and their suburbs as detached economic units. They argue it's logical—and fair—to think of these places as a network of villages, unified by a larger metropolitan area. That way, property taxes and city services could be more equitably shared and distributed. Excluding those who live outside a city center from identifying with its name only serves to reinforce divisions that just aren't socially or economically helpful.

And there are different kinds of stigmas that might be attached to places just outside the city—places with high crime rates, or unglamorous forms of industry. What if you're from Camden, New Jersey? Or Gary, Indiana? Or Compton, California? You might have good reasons to choose to identify with a city-name that carries more positive associations, so that the person you're conversing with doesn't jump to conclusions about what your life might be like.

Consider what it's like for someone to express their racial identity, and then be told that they're wrong.

If someone opts to use a proxy for their hometown, it's very possible she has a rationale that goes beyond mere convenience. So let's not tell her she's wrong. Researchers who study place and identity agree. "When you try to force things to be transparent and simple, you simplify the other person's experiences," says Diana Negrin, a professor of geography at UC Berkeley.

The nuances of where, inside or outside a city, we’re from should enrich, not stifle, a conversation. "There's an opportunity for dialogue about what being from somewhere means," says geographer John Stehlin, also of UC Berkeley. So rather than jump at the chance to tease the Mainer in the bar, we could ask instead what it's like to be from Maine, or what it is about Boston he connects to most (could be it's baseball), or how it is that being in London makes all those places seem less important, or maybe more.

If this all sounds a little overly P.C., consider what it's like for someone to express their racial identity, and then be told that they're wrong. "It's a pretty common experience for someone who has mixed ethnicity to be told, 'oh, but you don’t look blank," says Negrin. "And then that person has to break things down and educate their audience."

Which can be an exhausting, frustrating task. And while the stress of having to explain where one is "really" from may seem benign compared to that of ethnicity, the comparison at least gets us thinking twice about mockery being a first response when things don't immediately align.

Also helpful to remember is that the way a person describes where she's from can be a reflection of what she assumes about us: our geographic knowledge, our biases, our curiosity, our motives. What's the best way to be seen as open-minded and intellectually curious? Be open-minded and intellectually curious.
====================================
LAURA BLISS and SAM STURGIS
Jul 25, 2014
http://www.citylab.com/navigator/201...sfp=3290374959
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  #2  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 4:54 PM
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chicago does this simply and correctly:

- if you live within the 227 incorporated sq. miles of the city of chicago, then you're from "Chicago".

- if you live in one of the 8 billion little suburbs that surround the city, then you're from "Chicagoland".

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Last edited by Steely Dan; Jul 27, 2014 at 12:21 AM.
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  #3  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 5:24 PM
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If it's part of the continuous urban zone (aka a suburb) then you can say you're from that city. If it's a small town mostly dependent upon the larger city, but still somewhat separate, you say you're from somewhere near the larger city.
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Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 5:55 PM
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Locals in the Tampa Bay region certainly have no qualms about getting specific about where they're from. Of course that's why it's also basically the most splintered metro population in the US.
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  #5  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 6:00 PM
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Ottawa, where I live, is a pretty small city..1.5 million may be pushing it.
There are dozens of small hamlets, towns, and villages surrounding it though..Borderline exhurbs...I know that in my travels, I met a few people not knowing that I live here, who stated that they live in Ottawa, when in reality they are from one of these communities..I guess it's easier that way.

Bigger centres like Boston would have waay more for sure, but I have seen people use that tag-line here as well.
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  #6  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 6:37 PM
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People that live in suburbs of Memphis are quick and proud to let it be known that they live in that suburb, or more specifically not in Memphis.
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  #7  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 6:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arkitekte View Post
People that live in suburbs of Memphis are quick and proud to let it be known that they live in that suburb, or more specifically not in Memphis.
I'd say that's the racial division that still exists. I lived in Memphis from 2001/2002, and noticed that people would emphasize they are from Germantown or Cordova or DeSoto Co/Southaven, it was obvious why they didn't want to be associated with the city. But in a metro that has no racial majority its kind of odd. Memphis and Houston (and maybe another metro I can't think of) are one of the few regions where there's no racial majority. I think both white and black populations are under 50%.
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  #8  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 7:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Nevergold View Post
I'd say that's the racial division that still exists. I lived in Memphis from 2001/2002, and noticed that people would emphasize they are from Germantown or Cordova or DeSoto Co/Southaven, it was obvious why they didn't want to be associated with the city. But in a metro that has no racial majority its kind of odd. Memphis and Houston (and maybe another metro I can't think of) are one of the few regions where there's no racial majority. I think both white and black populations are under 50%.
That's all true for the most part. The Memphis Metro area over all is somewhere around 46 % white and 45% black, but Shelby county is 52% black and 40% white and Memphis itself is 62% black and 31% white. Even within the city limits of Memphis there's clear racial segregation other than some small parts of Midtown and East Memphis.
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  #9  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 9:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razor View Post
Ottawa, where I live, is a pretty small city..1.5 million may be pushing it.
There are dozens of small hamlets, towns, and villages surrounding it though..Borderline exhurbs...I know that in my travels, I met a few people not knowing that I live here, who stated that they live in Ottawa, when in reality they are from one of these communities..I guess it's easier that way.

Bigger centres like Boston would have waay more for sure, but I have seen people use that tag-line here as well.
Yeah, but those towns aren't well known, and the counties aren't that well known either. Either you say you live in/near Ottawa, or maybe you can say Eastern Ontario. If you're from Cumberland, Maine though, it makes more sense to just say you're from Maine, at least if you're talking to an American or Canadian. Cumberland isn't even an exurb, it's a suburb of Portland. It would be like someone from Bancroft or Petawawa saying they're from Ottawa.
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  #10  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 10:51 PM
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Gotcha..Ya Petawawa and Bancroft can't even be associated with Ottawa..Bancroft = nice country btw.
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  #11  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 11:18 PM
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We don't split it up very well.

In terms of what you are, there are three options:

I'm a Downtownie = From the Old Town core of the City of St. John's.

I'm a Townie = From anywhere in the adjacent cities of St. John's and Mount Pearl east of the intersection of Kenmount and Topsail roads. These days it can be used for all suburbs if a person chooses, but most are loathe to do so (and often ridiculed when they try).

I'm a Bayman/Baygirl = From anywhere else on the island of Newfoundland, including the rest of suburban St. John's.

In saying where you're from, locally you have three main options.

I'm from Town = from the City of St. John's or its suburbs.

I'm from The Bay = from anywhere else.

Then you have a mixed bag for the third option, with the most common being "the Capital", "the Northeast Avalon", or the actual municipality name of the suburb.

I wish we had something like Chicago/Chicagoland.

Northeast Avalon fits the bill perfectly, is commonly used, but is not universally accepted as the proper term.
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  #12  
Old Posted Jul 26, 2014, 11:42 PM
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If they're talking to an out-of-towner, of course it's easier to use the place with name recognition. And obviously the center city is a proxy for the whole metro.

If they're talking to a local, then the specific location is more pertinent.
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  #13  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 12:00 AM
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It depends on where you are and how far away you are from your locality. However, people from Brooklyn will distinguish between it and Staten Island because they are quite different places. I subscribe also to the Google maps "view"; if you are so far away from your city that you have to "zoom out" to see it, people will recognize only the place name of the larger city. You won't see "Burnaby BC" (by Canadian standards a mid sized city of about 230,000) on the map until you zoom in to the local Vancouver area.
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  #14  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 2:45 AM
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I think this def. holds true for the major Texas cities. Coherent blobs of sprawl that have the same vibe.
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  #15  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 3:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
chicago does this simply and correctly:

- if you live within the 227 incorporated sq. miles of the city of chicago, then you're from "Chicago".

- if you live in one of the 8 billion little suburbs that surround the city, then you're from "Chicagoland".

I say Chicagoland, when speaking of the suburbs, but it will always sound like a theme park to me.

I say I'm from East St Louis, because despite being from the town next-door, no one has heard of it. I'm not from Missouri, or from St Louis. If I say I'm from Southern Illinois people think I'm a redneck. I'd rather have people think I'm from the hood than anything my other options.
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Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 6:23 AM
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I don't know anyone from Cumberland or frankly anywhere other thank York County in Maine who would say they are from Boston, even to non-New Englanders or non-Americans.

I have found the general "I'm from Boston" boundary to roughly match that of the Census' CSA. My cousins from outside Manchester NH tell people from their adopted state of NY that they are from Boston. One cousin lives in NYC, one lives in Rochester.

I went to uni in Tokyo with some other New Englanders: one from Bristol RI, one from Middleton RI, one from Burlington VT, and one from Exeter NH. Only the Vermonter wouldn't just say "Boston" to anyone who asked (he would say Vermont, not Burlington though).

Take this for what you will, but I also find a correlation between how much an individual follows a pro sport and how much that individual identifies with the pro sport's home city. The cousin who lives in NYC is a die-hard Sox and Pats fan, and I know she is one of those Boston fans who loves rubbing it in New Yorkers' faces. Her sister in Rochester doesn't care about Boston sports and is a lot less likely to self identify with Boston. The three uni friends who called themselves Bostonians are also big Sox fans.
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Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 8:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn View Post
I don't know anyone from Cumberland or frankly anywhere other thank York County in Maine who would say they are from Boston, even to non-New Englanders or non-Americans.

I have found the general "I'm from Boston" boundary to roughly match that of the Census' CSA.
You beat me to it. When abroad, "I'm from Boston" means anywhere within the CSA--eastern Massachusetts, Worcester and environs, southern New Hampshire, the Rhode Island line. Outside the CSA--no way.

Ex-urban New England differs from Boston in every meaningful way. People who want to claim the mantle of literally being a Bostonian--but who actually live in quiet, small, low-density, rural and homogenous communities far from Boston proper--are either pretentious or delusional. I don't know if "mockery" is called for, but skepticism certainly is. This essay's argument is not compelling, not in the least because the example they're giving undermines the entire premise. Cumberland, Maine is two states north of--and nothing like--Boston.
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Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 12:33 PM
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this article was a pretty hamfisted affair, and its introduction of race-related matters was just embarrassing. first of all, ethnic or racial diversity was never the only thing that differentiated a city from its suburbs; if laval had the exact same demogaphics as montreal, it would still not be montreal. why do articles exist that can be rebutted by such immediately obvious truisms? it's absurd.

secondly, the introduction (and repetition) of this phrase:

"Consider what it's like for someone to express their racial identity, and then be told that they're wrong."

represents just the crudest attempt to attach some sort of civil rights/social justice-derived moral force to the article's thesis. what, exactly, is going on here? are we creating a new movement hashtag? #suburbshaming? are we implying that disallowing a maine resident from calling themselves a bostonian is bigoted, or akin to racism? people do that sort of thing in the canada forum sometimes, and it's always so lame. obviously, racism is a significant moral offense in our current society, but that does not mean every issue of identity contains the same sort of ethical gravity. if this were the 17th century, this person would attempting to link the rejection of their thesis to heresy; they're just trying to get the culture on their side.

such poor form.
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  #19  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 1:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
chicago does this simply and correctly:

- if you live within the 227 incorporated sq. miles of the city of chicago, then you're from "Chicago".

- if you live in one of the 8 billion little suburbs that surround the city, then you're from "Chicagoland".

Well put. I used to be critical of the term but now it has grown on me. Perhaps the CNN series made a difference. It's a fitting term, is there another metro that does the same? Ironically, btw, "Chicagoland" the TV series was entirely about the city of Chicago
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  #20  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2014, 7:47 PM
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The best saying is, "Living in Vancouver means never having to say you're Surrey."
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