Philadelphia Transportation Thread

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by josef

I'm definitely not up on my numbers anywhere near as you are, but it's stange as hell to me to hear that people in the Midwest wholeheartedly embrace rail of any kind. I thought the Midwest was where senators and representatives who voted againt all kinds of important infrastructure that wasn't road-related came from.

Yeah, that's because most of the Midwest is far-right conservative country, except for perhaps Detroit and Chicago... It's slowly but surely coming along tho.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by josef

I'm definitely not up on my numbers anywhere near as you are, but it's stange as hell to me to hear that people in the Midwest wholeheartedly embrace rail of any kind. I thought the Midwest was where senators and representatives who voted againt all kinds of important infrastructure that wasn't road-related came from.

When you think about it , Rail is engraved in their culture. The Midwestern Network is 3x the size of the Northeastern network. When Ohio and Wisconsin cancelled their HSR people were very angry , of course that wasn't enough for them to thrown them out of office but it left a sting in their mouths... Minnesota , Illinois are pretty Rail progressive , the communities in those states are open to anything.... Michigan and Indiana are trying.... Philly and Boston have become strained in recent years for some reasons , some due Septa and MBTA stupidity others due to bloggers such as Alon Levy suggesting things that wouldn't make sense to someone in the Rail community or were tried and failed or deemed to expensive.

[hammersklavier]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

When you think about it , Rail is engraved in their culture. The Midwestern Network is 3x the size of the Northeastern network. When Ohio and Wisconsin cancelled their HSR people were very angry , of course that wasn't enough for them to thrown them out of office but it left a sting in their mouths... Minnesota , Illinois are pretty Rail progressive , the communities in those states are open to anything.... Michigan and Indiana are trying.... Philly and Boston have become strained in recent years for some reasons , some due Septa and MBTA stupidity others due to bloggers such as Alon Levy suggesting things that wouldn't make sense to someone in the Rail community or were tried and failed or deemed to expensive.

You're getting dangerously close to trolling there...especially since Alon Levy is the single most dedicated technical activist out there...

Remember, not every proposal is a good proposal. That applies everywhere in public works. The Market East HSR proposal falls on the far side of "bad idea" (especially with the deliberately deceptive price tag). Think on that before mudslinging.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by hammersklavier

You're getting dangerously close to trolling there...especially since Alon Levy is the single most dedicated technical activist out there...

Remember, not every proposal is a good proposal. That applies everywhere in public works. The Market East HSR proposal falls on the far side of "bad idea" (especially with the deliberately deceptive price tag). Think on that before mudslinging.

I think i'll take a break from this thread for a while....sorry if crossed the line....

[josef]

This makes me happy to read. I had actually emailed them a few days ago to ask what was new with the initiative, and they said they were preparing a site update. I assume its this. It's a small step, but it shows it's still going on. And I find the list of groups included in the advisory committee encouraging, because it looks to me like it's made up of people who absolutely want this to succeed as best it can.

Advisory Committee Meets as SEPTA Opens NPT Dialogue
Andrew Busch
SEPTA Press Officer

SEPTA has opened a dialogue with riders and the public about the New Payment Technologies (NPT) initiative, a project that will result in a customer-friendly, modernized fare system.

In August, SEPTA officials met with the newly formed NPT Advisory Committee, a stakeholder group that will offer guidance to the SEPTA Board and staff as the Authority moves closer to the implementation of an electronic fare system.

This initial meeting provided an opportunity for SEPTA to share information about NPT, and answer questions from committee members.

"SEPTA wants this process to be responsive, accurate and transparent," said SEPTA General Manager Joseph M. Casey. "We welcome the opportunity to get feedback from riders and other stakeholders as we move forward."

Members of the NPT Advisory Committee represent stakeholders throughout SEPTA's 2,200-square mile service region. There are members from government entities, such as the city of Philadelphia and the counties in the SEPTA service region; rider advocacy groups, such as the Delaware Valley Association of Rail Passengers and the SEPTA Citizen Advisory Committee; local universities and hospitals; chambers of commerce and local businesses; and community and neighborhood associations. SEPTA expects additional members to join the committee before the next meeting in the fall.

The committee will have a critical role in the NPT process, acting as a public sounding board and providing valuable feedback. The committee will also help ensure that SEPTA is providing riders and the public with information about the new fare system. SEPTA Board members and staff will meet quarterly with the committee, and additional sessions could be scheduled as SEPTA moves closer to the launch of NPT.

SEPTA's new fare system will be based on contactless computer chip technology - often referred to as "smart cards". This will give customers a variety of choices in how they pay to ride SEPTA's trains, buses and trolleys. Credit cards, cell phones and other devices equipped with smart technology will be able to be used to pay for rides. There will also be SEPTA cards available at station vending machines. Riders will be able to use cash as well as debit or credit cards to buy the SEPTA cards. From there, riders will simply wave their payment device at station turnstiles and readers on buses and trolleys, and continue on their trip. NPT will also mean the end of outdated payment methods, such as tokens, paper transfers and tickets.

SEPTA is implementing NPT in three phases over a three-year period. The first phase - design - is currently underway. Installation and implementation will begin on transit modes, including buses, trolleys and the Market-Frankford and Broad Street Lines, during the second half of 2013. By late 2014, SEPTA expects to extend the system to Regional Rail lines. CCT Paratransit and SEPTA parking lots will also be equipped with this electronic payment technology.

SEPTA will launch a number of customer-focused communication initiatives prior to the launch of the new fare system, with the goal of educating riders and making the transition smooth. In the coming months, riders will begin to see information displayed at stations and other customer areas.

Project updates and details about the new fare system will also be posted on SEPTA's Website. For more information, click here.

http://www.septa.org/media/short/2012/08-20.html

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by josef

This makes me happy to read. I had actually emailed them a few days ago to ask what was new with the initiative, and they said they were preparing a site update. I assume its this. It's a small step, but it shows it's still going on. And I find the list of groups included in the advisory committee encouraging, because it looks to me like it's made up of people who absolutely want this to succeed as best it can.



http://www.septa.org/media/short/2012/08-20.html

Wow, I had no idea SEPTA didn't have the smart card yet. I can't wait for them to have the electronic payments available at the parking lots. It's a pain putting those damned quarters into those infernal pay slots!

[Phil_North]

http://www.wfmj.com/story/19997496/s...-to-nj-transit

[Phil_North]

http://articles.philly.com/2012-10-2...ffrey-knueppel

[Jonboy1983]

SEPTA should consider doing something else to raise money for projects like these. Maybe I mentioned this before, but what about corporate advertisements on the trains? I know there are "bilboards" at the station sites as well as on the interiors of the rolling stock. What about public-private partnerships?

[electricron]

Originally Posted by Jonboy1983

SEPTA should consider doing something else to raise money for projects like these. Maybe I mentioned this before, but what about corporate advertisements on the trains? I know there are "bilboards" at the station sites as well as on the interiors of the rolling stock. What about public-private partnerships?

What they need is a dedicated source of revenues, like a sales tax, that they could use to finance operations and bonds. It doesn't have to be a sales tax, but it needs to be more reliable than allocations from the city's or county's general funds, which can be reallocated for other purposes every year. Then they wouldn't have to go begging other government bodies every year for funds.

[EastSideHBG]

SEPTA takes step toward extending rail service in Delaware County

Paul Nussbaum, Inquirer Staff Writer
Posted: Friday, November 16, 2012, 3:01 AM

SEPTA took a modest step forward Thursday on its long-delayed plan to restore Regional Rail service to Wawa, Delaware County.

The SEPTA board voted to acquire about five acres by the former Franklin Mint headquarters along Route 1 in Middletown Township to build a parking garage and access road for a new passenger station.

But a lack of money is holding up construction of the garage, station, and the three-mile extension of the rail line from Elwyn to Wawa. The project is estimated to cost about $90 million.

A growing population in western Delaware County and southern Chester County and a shortage of parking for passengers on the Media-Elwyn Line has spurred SEPTA's desire to extend the line to Wawa.

Service was "temporarily suspended" in 1986 when SEPTA truncated the old Pennsylvania Railroad route that used to go as far as West Chester.

On Thursday, the SEPTA board approved spending up to $282,788 for 4.86 acres owned by developer Wolfson Verrichia Group Inc. of Plymouth Meeting. The deal is still in negotiation, and the board on Thursday authorized SEPTA officials to acquire the property rights by condemnation if the developer declines to sell.

"We've had numerous discussions, and it's our intention to amicably acquire it," SEPTA real estate director Gerald M. Maier said.

About 3.5 acres would be used to build a 600-space parking garage, and 1.3 acres would be used for an access road to connect with Route 1, Maier said.

Read more: http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...#ixzz2COtHk4TE

[Jonboy1983]

This has been talked about for some time. I did my masters research paper on extending this line all the way to West Chester (I got my masters from West Chester University). I basically found that the population increase from 1990 to the 2004 estimates (2010 data was not available yet) was statistically significant and that the distribution of land uses along the abandoned West Chester line and active Thorndale line were similar. Also, the traffic patterns along both lines were similar...

Now, I've said this over and over. If Port Authority can net $528 million of public money for a 1.2 mile extension of its LRT system, why can't SEPTA try to net half of that for a much bigger project, in termins of overall size and its impacts on transportation and possible development in both Delaware and Chester Counties...

Considering this line will pass right buy Cheney an West Chester Univesities, why can't they pony up some cash? I know the university is screaming for commuter rail service...

And drat... A post prior to this that I haven't seen before actually provided an answer to one of the questions. The latter one is still valid tho. Why don't the universities supply some funds. Ever hear of a public-private partnership?

[volguus zildrohar]

If I'm not mistaken, there's some type of proviso from Harrisburg that precludes SEPTA from entering into public-private partnerships for capital projects. The concept has been brought up before as a permanent funding solution, usually by Philadelphia-hating loons in the capital.

However for projects like this it looks like an avenue with potential.

[EastSideHBG]

SEPTA board approves land purchase in Middletown, eyes parking garage

Published: Sunday, November 18, 2012

The extension of SEPTA’s Media-Elwyn Regional Rail line to Wawa took another baby step forward Thursday night when its board approved $282,788 for the purchase of 4.86 acres next to the former Franklin Mint site in Middletown.

SEPTA’s plan is to use the land to build a 600-car parking garage, rail station and access road from Route 1. However, don’t expect to see any kind of construction activity in that immediate area anytime in the near future.

“We’re waiting for some kind of action from both Harrisburg and Washington,” SEPTA Public Affairs Director Richard Maloney said. “At the moment, we don’t have a dime to put into any major capital projects.”

Maloney said if some federal or state funds were to come SEPTA’s way, the Wawa station is probably No. 2 on the list of projects to be funded, behind the extension of the Norristown High Speed Line.

“It’s up there pretty high,” he said of the priority of getting the station built at Wawa. “One, we’ve got the ridership out there and we have the basic right of way. You’ve got the existing infrastructure out there, too, and getting that parking garage built would significantly help.”

Maloney says the hope is the new parking garage would help ease parking issues at some of the stations in the western part of Delaware County, such as Elwyn.

“With Elwyn, we expanded that parking area a little bit with the stimulus money a couple of years ago,” Maloney said. “Parking is the No. 1 hold up for us and that’s true throughout the entire area, finding parking.”

The Wawa project would cost about $90 million and would include building an access road from Route 1 to the station. SEPTA had what it called a temporary shutdown of the rail line to Wawa in 1986 as it had been using the old Pennsylvania Railroad route that went to West Chester.

http://delcotimes.com/articles/2012/...a466535166.txt

[Jonboy1983]

Originally Posted by volguus zildrohar

If I'm not mistaken, there's some type of proviso from Harrisburg that precludes SEPTA from entering into public-private partnerships for capital projects. The concept has been brought up before as a permanent funding solution, usually by Philadelphia-hating loons in the capital.

However for projects like this it looks like an avenue with potential.

Is is possible for this state to get any more ass-backwards? What the hell?!!

This state sucks! I've actually been considering running for state rep, and now I'm closer... I see that provisio as a hurdle that needs to go away...

Where is the Norristown High Speed Line extension going to go? I saw that referenced in the article above.

[Muji]

The Norristown High Speed Line is supposed to be extended to King of Prussia.

[Phil_North]

Originally Posted by Muji

The Norristown High Speed Line is supposed to be extended to King of Prussia.

That would be awesome.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by Phil_North

That would be awesome.

If I'm not mistaken, the extension of the Norristown HSR to KOP is supposed to run directly into the KOP mall expansion that is currently under construction.


...and yes it would be awesome.

[summersm343]

SEPTA considers BRT in the City Branch sunken section of the Reading Viaduct.

BRT would run from the Zoo to Penn's Landing

http://hiddencityphila.org/2012/11/s...n-city-branch/

[summersm343]

My SEPTA Transit Line Wish List Map

http://goo.gl/maps/GAVTj

What do you think?