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View Poll Results: Should there be a HSR rail link from Calgary to Edmonton?
Yes, even if it takes government money. 229 59.17%
Only if it's fully privately funded. 72 18.60%
No, it'll never survive either way. 86 22.22%
Voters: 387. You may not vote on this poll

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  #81  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 6:00 AM
JerryK
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This is the dumbest topic I have ever reread, save the type. Why would anybody who could drive Edmonton to calgary in 2.5 hours, then, have there vehicle to drive or fly in 45 min want a train????? I do alot of business all over north america, and can say, If you think this is the way the tax payers of Alberta should spend there cash
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  #82  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 6:03 AM
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P.S, Why do people Mind F**k things to death...None of this shit is going to happen
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  #83  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 6:39 AM
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^^ Why did Edmonton build an airport in Leduc?
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  #84  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 6:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryK View Post
This is the dumbest topic I have ever reread, save the type. Why would anybody who could drive Edmonton to calgary in 2.5 hours, then, have there vehicle to drive or fly in 45 min want a train????? I do alot of business all over north america, and can say, If you think this is the way the tax payers of Alberta should spend there cash
Flying takes 45 mins? Including getting to the airport, checking in, going through security etc. Oh bad weather, flights delayed, finally get to Edmonton errr Leduc then it's another 40 min drive!

45mins?? Think again!!

Kris
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  #85  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 2:51 PM
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Originally Posted by KrisYYC View Post
Flying takes 45 mins? Including getting to the airport, checking in, going through security etc. Oh bad weather, flights delayed, finally get to Edmonton errr Leduc then it's another 40 min drive!

45mins?? Think again!!

Kris
Im talking airtime 45min Im sure taking any train you willl (Also) have to drive to the station, and put-up with delays of some sort!


Just think!!
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  #86  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 4:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryK View Post
This is the dumbest topic I have ever reread, save the type. Why would anybody who could drive Edmonton to calgary in 2.5 hours, then, have there vehicle to drive or fly in 45 min want a train????? I do alot of business all over north america, and can say, If you think this is the way the tax payers of Alberta should spend there cash
Makes you kinda dumb if you've had to re-read it? I'd certainly take a train to Calgary, and I know alot of people would too. Doesn't make this viable yet, but like its been stated many times, plan for it now, built it a little later. If you've read a thing many people here have said, this would be something SHOULD BE BUILT PRIVATELY. But of course, you've only re-read this twice. Go have another go at it. This is about the dumbest post I've ever read. (and yes, I've re-read it a few times now, just to make sure it is dumb)
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  #87  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 6:41 PM
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How can it take 45 minutes of Airtime to fly to Edmonton when it takes 55 to fly to Vancouver and 35 to fly to Kelowna?
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  #88  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 6:47 PM
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^^ it takes less than 45 minutes, but it is not proportional to a flight to Vancouver as the plane never actually reaches cruising altitude / speed.

That being said, we should not under-estimate the time it takes to clear security, board and taxi. And then double everything to get from Leduc International to Edmonton proper.
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  #89  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 6:50 PM
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Originally Posted by johnnyc View Post
How can it take 45 minutes of Airtime to fly to Edmonton when it takes 55 to fly to Vancouver and 35 to fly to Kelowna?
Every flight I see for YYC->YLW is 62 minutes... and YYC->YVR is 88 minutes. YYC->YEG is only 40 however. (These are all direct flights via Westjet, AC is pretty much the same but their site is acting up right now).
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  #90  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 7:12 PM
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Either way, I think a 45 minute train ride would be much more convenient than either driving or flying.
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  #91  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 7:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryK View Post
Im talking airtime 45min Im sure taking any train you willl (Also) have to drive to the station, and put-up with delays of some sort!


Just think!!
So, somebody works dowtown and needs to be in Edmonton for a meeting. What do you think is quicker? Boarding a high speed train downtown then disembarking in downtown Edmonton? Or taking a taxi for 20 mins (and $35) 90 mins before your flight is even supposed to leave. Check in, go through security, get to gate, board, fly, arrive in Edmonton, disembark. Take 40 minute taxi ride (another $50 at least) to downtown Edmonton. There's no contest man.

Sure, trains can be delayed. But train schedules are nowhere near as fragile as airline schedules are. Weather that would delay a flight 30 mins or more wouldn't even phase a High Speed Train. Also, airline schedules are affected by other cities weather as well. If the plane scheduled to fly your Edmonton flight is delayed in Kelowna because of a storm, well your flight will be delayed too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mersar View Post
Every flight I see for YYC->YLW is 62 minutes... and YYC->YVR is 88 minutes. YYC->YEG is only 40 however. (These are all direct flights via Westjet, AC is pretty much the same but their site is acting up right now).
Those are gate to gate times and not actual air times. Air times are always fluid with a million variables.

Kris

Last edited by KrisYYC; Apr 7, 2007 at 7:19 PM. Reason: typo
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  #92  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 7:20 PM
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Even a 4 hour conventional train ride would be more convenient than driving or flying in many situations, wouldn't you say?
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  #93  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 9:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Nutterbug View Post
Even a 4 hour conventional train ride would be more convenient than driving or flying in many situations, wouldn't you say?
no. You need to make it 2 hours or under for sure. If you drive the unwritten speed limit when going down on the queen, you can easily make it downtown to downtown in 2.5 hrs
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  #94  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 10:31 PM
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Fact of the matter is that HSR "IS NOT SUSTAINABLE" in this province. For the love of god Alberta is not a populated province in a sparsely populated country. We have no idea what 'densely populated' areas are.

Enough of the pipe dreams now.
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  #95  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 10:39 PM
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I think we would see a HSR between Toronto and Montreal LONG before we would ever see one here, still, it would be nice and convenient to have.
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  #96  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 10:43 PM
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/\ Yes, absolutely!

For convenience, yes, it would be great. But if the numbers can't work, it doesn't get my support.
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  #97  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 10:45 PM
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Well, since you said it is a fact, would you care to show an opposing study? I mean, something that isn't just the opinion of a National Post or Sun journalist?
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  #98  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 10:54 PM
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/\ Dude, population stats alone should be enough. If HSR was soooo viable, why don't we see trains running between Dallas - Houston, Toronto - Montreal, Philly - NYC, etc. There are maaaaaany, maaaany other higher populated areas in North America that don't have HSR. Think about it.

The rose coloured glasses can come off at anytime now.
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  #99  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2007, 11:29 PM
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Not good enough. I'm just going to dismiss that as your opinion until you can come up with some sort of opposing study, or actually crunch the numbers yourself in whatever creative fashion you need to prove your point. Otherwise you are just a naysayer.

BTW, I'm not seriously waiting for that as I'm fairly sure that no such study exists. In fact the only credible study so far is the VHI Study. Now, obviously I wouldn't want to just go ahead and build the thing with only a single study done about it. We need the issue examined inside and out. And I would welcome some good opposing arguments with a study to back them up, really.

I just spent some time reading the discussions on C2E about the issue, and am fairly surprised by the narrow-minded opposition. One of the big mistakes was that people kept saying that it unfeasible for a route with only 2.5 million or so people in it, as if the project would be done by tomorrow, or even in the next 10 years. Another is the assumption that LRT lines are going to remain stagnant and aren't recieving funding (the real problem there is civic priorities... road vs LRT debate). And a last one is the belief that such infrastructure money would be best spent [wasted] in other areas of provincial jurisdiction (hell, even beyond that, some people have gone off the deep end and started throwing in fire, police, etc.)

But why is it necessary that we wait for an example and be the last to build it? Look at LRT's for example, I don't know if even our CTrain pays for itself. Most systems are dependent on government subsidization, yet we still build them. Notwithstanding that there are factors such as parking which come into play, the time and cost savings, as well as the redevelopment and economic benefits of LRT make it a worthwhile investment and one that benefits our cities as a whole. I look at HSR the same way. Even if the service doesn't pay for itself, the net economic benefits MAY be enough that it is worth it overall.

EDIT: What I think is most essential is that there is real public dialogue and some thoughtful discussion between industry partners, the government, and citizens. Even if it doesn't result in HSR, it could boost support for different alternatives and we could come up with a long-term provincial strategy. It happens far too often that an issue comes up and is just brushed aside without any discussion. The reason this topic keeps coming up is due to various reasons, but the ones that come to mind are that it is something very much desired by at least a large minority of Albertans (read: not just forumers here), and that is just something that is very cool and is fun to think about.

But I would rather not talk about the realism of the concept so much as the potential outcomes if were built in a variety of different ways. If there is a stop at Red Deer, would companies and/or people start flocking there to be in the center of the action? If it has a spur ran to Fort Mac, would people be moving there less quickly and thus there would be less need for expensive infrastructure projects? If it ran to Lethbridge would we have people from Calgary commuting there for school? And suppose it did become popular and the trains were full, how high of a frequency would be feasible and would this demand translate into further growth of transit connections?

So many fun things to discuss!
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Last edited by Boris2k7; Apr 8, 2007 at 12:11 AM.
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  #100  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2007, 12:43 AM
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We don't see HSR in other highly populated corridors in NA because everyone on this side of the pond has a love affair with our cars. Once it happens in one area, and becomes successful, I think you would see it catch on in a lot of other areas. As the environment becomes more and more of a social and political issue, I think people in NA will start looking at HRS lines a lot more seriously. It would be erally cool if Calgary / Edmonton got the first mag-lev train in NA.

EDIT: how fast do the fastest Amtrak trains go?
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