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  #35001  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 2:48 AM
John Maddox Roberts John Maddox Roberts is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityBoyDoug View Post
Very good point Martin. I had not thought of that angle. Yes, the Canteen could well have been a stags-only venue. That would make sense to me.
It was not really designed as a place for "Service Men" to look for female dates.

The WACS, the WAVES and the Lady Marines were on their own to find entertainment... elsewhere.

It was a different culture in those days...more respectful and innocent.



CD file - Hollywood

A popular song of that era. It still rocks...click link:

https://youtu.be/NqAmrUEnc1g
What a great picture. It's just been raining - puddles about, and some of the guys have their raincoats over their arms. that sort of detail makes these photos have an immediacy more formal pictures would lack. Incidentally, does anyone know if the Canteen had any sort of separate facilities for officers and enlisted men? The services of the day really frowned on fraternizing,though the Hollywood facility would probably have emphasized all-American egalitarianism.
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  #35002  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 3:23 AM
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Update on Los Angeles Transit Line Streetcar 1435

Quote:
Originally Posted by broadwy_central_bldg View Post
I'm not sure if it's been discussed recently; I tried searching and this was the best post I could find.

Does anyone know where they moved this old LARY car? Until a few weeks ago it was still here in the old garage adjacent to the Subway Terminal Building near 5th and Hill-- I walked by it every weekend morning. But it was moved away, presumably while they begin work on the new mall that's going in on this site, and in advance of the Park Fifth development that is supposedly finally happening...

I'm hoping someone on this thread knows what happened to car 1435-- maybe it ended up at a museum? Does anyone have any clues?
See: http://www.atrrm.org/blog/2016/03/th...-of-latl-1435/

Cheers,
Jack
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  #35003  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 3:29 AM
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Update on Los Angeles Transit Line Streetcar 1435

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/sho...spx?id=2001002

Quote:
Originally Posted by broadwy_central_bldg View Post
I'm not sure if it's been discussed recently; I tried searching and this was the best post I could find.

Does anyone know where they moved this old LARY car? Until a few weeks ago it was still here in the old garage adjacent to the Subway Terminal Building near 5th and Hill-- I walked by it every weekend morning. But it was moved away, presumably while they begin work on the new mall that's going in on this site, and in advance of the Park Fifth development that is supposedly finally happening...

I'm hoping someone on this thread knows what happened to car 1435-- maybe it ended up at a museum? Does anyone have any clues?
See: http://www.atrrm.org/blog/2016/03/th...-of-latl-1435/

Cheers,
Jack
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  #35004  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 3:32 AM
BDiH BDiH is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Maddox Roberts View Post
What a great picture. It's just been raining - puddles about, and some of the guys have their raincoats over their arms. that sort of detail makes these photos have an immediacy more formal pictures would lack. Incidentally, does anyone know if the Canteen had any sort of separate facilities for officers and enlisted men? The services of the day really frowned on fraternizing,though the Hollywood facility would probably have emphasized all-American egalitarianism.
The Pep Boys in the distance (on Sunset, between Wilcox & Cahuenga) closed in the 1960s and moved to the current location on Hollywood Boulevard, near Gower.
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  #35005  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 3:57 AM
BDiH BDiH is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Pal View Post
A great related photo: Here's Carmen Miranda dancing on a car at Hollywood & Vine during the VJ Day celebration in 1945.

(Melody Lane in the background.)



This was on gsjansen's Flickr account, a frequent poster on NLA at one time, but he had never posted it here before.

P.S.: If the police want to arrest you in West Hollywood, they don't read you your Miranda rights...they read you your Carmen Miranda rights.
Poor Carmen. As Cesar Romero said, "Towards the end, Carmen had trouble, because she never changed. After a few years of that, there was no novelty anymore."
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  #35006  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 4:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Maddox Roberts View Post
What a great picture. It's just been raining - puddles about, and some of the guys have their raincoats over their arms. that sort of detail makes these photos have an immediacy more formal pictures would lack. Incidentally, does anyone know if the Canteen had any sort of separate facilities for officers and enlisted men? The services of the day really frowned on fraternizing,though the Hollywood facility would probably have emphasized all-American egalitarianism.
Hollywood Canteen

I know that officers would not attend this sort of venue....for many reasons.

First off, their mere presence there would be awkward and they would, by military tradition, always go to the front of the waiting line.

Plus, the entire theme was an enlisted men's club anyway. Officers would never be inside such a raunchy place as the Canteen. Its just too low-class for their supposed high status.

Finally, officers would know better than to go to the Canteen. Officer's Regulations & Rules strictly forbid such fraternization.

Want to find military officers in the Hollywood area....we might try the Cocoanut Grove at the Ambassador Hotel.

Oh, incidentally, officers do 'fraternize' with enlisted types but that's another story for another day.

Last edited by CityBoyDoug; May 14, 2016 at 4:43 AM.
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  #35007  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 5:00 PM
Ed Workman Ed Workman is offline
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[QUOTE=ethereal_reality;7440019]I realize this is Long Beach, but I'm not sure of the exact location.

below: Is this a sailor leaving the premises?

Why not Long Beach - Ocean Ave?
The dash sign a problem?
Should be okay as the last stop before the yards next to the river channel
The PE depot may even be behind the Blimp
Anyways, if the buildings are on O Ave that's the best place to start
Too 'nice' for San Pedro ST
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  #35008  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 7:16 PM
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This Julius Shulman photoset contains 60 images. About 3/4 of them show the building's construction, but I've chosen a dozen photos of the finished structure. It's "Job 1445: Sidney Eisenshtat and Sam Reisbord, Jewish Community Center (Los Angeles, Calif.),1953".



Here's the main entrance of the Westside Jewish Community Center.



The parking lot and basketball courts at the rear.



A closer view of the building.



I'm not sure what the raised levels and curved walls in this area were used for.



A last view of the exterior.



The curves continue inside. Is it just me, or are those exposed bricks quite large.



The small portion of bookshelf that's visible on the left makes me think that we're looking at a library/reading area.



The cafeteria/restaurant.



The facility also includes a gym...



... a swimming pool...



... and a theater.



All from Getty Research Institute

The center is still standing at 5870 W Olympic Boulevard. This GSV image is actually from 2014 because there are far less trees blocking the view.


GSV
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  #35009  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 10:09 PM
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Fantastic pics and conversation on the Hollywood Canteen folks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Pal View Post

Hostesses Olivia DeHavilland and Joan Fontaine.

Getty Images

Notice their official arm bands.
M P, this is actually Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley.

"Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley at the Hollywood Canteen, c. 1943. Senior hosts/hostesses at the Canteen wore cloth armbands of red and white stripewith a blue star
and the initials 'HC' in white so the servicemen could distinguish them. (Junior hosts/hostesses wore solid red cloth armbands with a blue star and the 'HC' initials in white."


I certainly didn't know about the hierarchy of the armbands.

I'm curious, did you have to flip the Getty image M P? I noticed it's wrong on the Getty_images web site.
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/ne...hoto/491440242
___
excerpt from:
http://www.imgrum.net/media/96329559...586_1601928153





I happened upon this photograph earlier this evening.


http://moviestarmakeover.com/categor...ywood-canteen/


This is the first I've heard of a 'Hollywood Canteen Convoy Car'. So how did this work....did it deliver servicemen from nearby hotels?

(also,the lovely ladies in this photograph aren't named...does anyone recognize them)
_

Last edited by ethereal_reality; May 15, 2016 at 2:31 AM.
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  #35010  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 10:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
Fantastic pics and conversation on the Hollywood Canteen folks.


M P, this is actually Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley.

"Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley at the Hollywood Canteen, c. 1943. Senior hosts/hostesses at the Canteen wore cloth armbands of red and white stripewith a blue star
and the initials 'HC' in white so the servicemen could distinguish them. (Junior hosts/hostesses wore solid red cloth armbands with a blue star and the 'HC' initials in white."


I certainly didn't know about the hierarchy of the armbands.

I'm curious, did you have to flip the Getty image M P? I noticed it's wrong on the Getty_images web site.
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/ne...hoto/491440242
___
excerpt from:
http://www.imgrum.net/media/96329559...586_1601928153





I just happened upon this photograph.


http://moviestarmakeover.com/categor...ywood-canteen/


This is the first I've heard of a 'Hollywood Canteen Convoy Car'. So how did this work....did it deliver servicemen from nearby hotels?

(also,the lovely ladies in this photograph aren't named...does anyone recognize them)
_
I haven't a clue as to who they are but they've sure got nice gams!

Cheers,
Jack
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  #35011  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 11:13 PM
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Nice gams indeed Jack.




ebay

Quote:
Originally Posted by HossC View Post
The yard where the buses were parked (between Maple Avenue and Wall Street) appears to have been an extension of the bus terminal behind the Pacific Electric Building. I've arrowed the T-shaped building with the roof-top parking. The 640 S Wall Street address would have been on the other side of Wall Street. The image below on the left is from 1952, and shows the elevated streetcar lines at the back of the Pacific Electric Building. The advertising for Downtown Ford was probably designed to be read by the streetcar passengers. By 1964 (below, right), the elevated tracks have gone, although the buses are still parked in the same area. The T-shaped building was gone by 1972.


Historic Aerials
Thanks for the aerials Hoss!



Here are a few more pics I recently found on eBay that show the elevated streetcar lines behind the Pacific Electric Terminal (and the terminal building itself).

We've seen the elevated lines before on NLA, but I believe these images are new (to NLA)


eBay







eBay






eBay

note the bright red Mobilgas pumps...over there------->


and finally, a couple views of the inside of one of the buses.


eBay



ebay

__

Last edited by ethereal_reality; May 15, 2016 at 2:32 AM.
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  #35012  
Old Posted May 14, 2016, 11:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odinthor View Post
And here's Ocean east from Pine in an earlier era . . .


odinthor collection
Thanks for locating the 'mystery' photograph odinthor.

This sepia photograph is great! I see a person could buy cigars and shells.
__
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  #35013  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 12:17 AM
Martin Pal Martin Pal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityBoyDoug View Post
Hollywood Canteen

I know that officers would not attend this sort of venue....for many reasons.
First off, their mere presence there would be awkward and they would, by military tradition, always go to the front of the waiting line.
Plus, the entire theme was an enlisted men's club anyway. Officers would never be inside such a raunchy place as the Canteen. Its just too low-class for their supposed high status.
Finally, officers would know better than to go to the Canteen. Officer's Regulations & Rules strictly forbid such fraternization.
Want to find military officers in the Hollywood area....we might try the Cocoanut Grove at the Ambassador Hotel.

Oh, incidentally, officers do 'fraternize' with enlisted types but that's another story for another day.
The Ambassador...or the Biltmore Bar, perhaps?

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Maddox Roberts View Post
Incidentally, does anyone know if the Canteen had any sort of separate facilities for officers and enlisted men? The services of the day really frowned on fraternizing,though the Hollywood facility would probably have emphasized all-American egalitarianism.
A quote from a soldier reminiscing about visiting the Canteen:

"It was the only good place in the country where the boys could go but the officers couldn't.
They could go anywhere. The GI's didn't have money to go anywhere."
___

The Canteen was to be used exclusively by enlisted servicemen of the United States and Allied Nations.
No military officers would be permitted on the floor at any time; civilians who were not connected with
the entertainment business would also be prohibited.
___

"The Canteen cost a great deal to run since everything was free to the guests, but not everything
the Canteen needed was donated and to gain some income for their needs the "Angel's Table" was born,
at which four people each paid $25 for the privilege to sit and watch the goings on inside the Canteen.

Located on a raised dais in the southeast corner in the back of the main room, and covered with a
gold-fringed cloth,the table was sold out every night for weeks in advance.

The idea was so popular that a second table was added. On average, these tables brought in $6,000 a
month, and was one of the best sources of revenue for meeting the Canteen's operating expenses."
___

Here's a photo showing the two tables on the raised dais in the corner:




I guess they used it for other occasion's, too. Here's Joan Leslie passing out pieces of her birthday cake to the servicemen
from this, according to the wall sign, "Reserved for Special Guests" area. The cake says: "Joan, from the Boys of the
Hollywood Canteen."


___

SIDEBAR: In reading about the Canteen's expenses, one of these expenses was "a single-page, legal sized mimeographed sheet titled "Chatter"
and was created soon after it opened. It was handed out to servicemen as they walked through the doors. It covered entertainment highlights,
the following week's schedule of band's [yay, look what'll be here when we're shipped out!] and tid-bits of information about Hollywood."

I found this surprising as I've never seen any photos of the servicemen holding these sheets; there are no photographs of any of them in the
sources. They don't do it in the film, either. Wonder if they kept these while they were doing it?
___

It appears, though, some officers were allowed into the Canteen, per this: "Besides the 'Angel's Tables', the only other accommodations for special
guests -- but was not income-producing -- was a small room on the second floor where officers and their female companions could look through a
window to watch the night's entertainment. Because the Canteen was for the exclusive use of enlisted men, and no officers were permitted on the first
floor, the second floor arrangement was a comfortable solution all around."

If they weren't allowed, I don't know why they needed a solution, but anyway.


Here's a photo of that room:



Doesn't look that comfortable to sit around and peer through a small window. Also, it looks like the windows could open. I can't totally read that sign on the
wall, but it re-inforces that enlisted men ONLY are allowed on the first floor.


This photo shows the window they're peering through at the center top. (You can see the rocking chair back.) The window to the left of it and under the
clock and Tag Dance sign, is a control room for the stage. (What's a tag dance?)




I believe that this room is also where they sent servicewomen who came to the canteen. They seemed to have been tolerated more than welcomed. If
they wanted to they could go to this room. Most servicewomen seem disappointed that they could go here, but could only observe and not
participate in the activities. It wasn't until mid-1944 that they got some better treatment and were able to go to a more open mezzanine area.


I believe we see that area in this photo in the upper right hand corner:



By the way, the dancing couple are Veloz & Yolanda!
They were previously mentioned in some earlier posts:

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...ostcount=25429
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...ostcount=30816
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...ostcount=30858

The Canteen photos and information are form these two sources:
"The Hollywood Canteen" by Mitchell and Torrence
"Dance Floor Democracy" by Sherie Tucker

Last edited by Martin Pal; May 15, 2016 at 5:56 AM. Reason: spelling
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  #35014  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 12:27 AM
Martin Pal Martin Pal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
M P, this is actually Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley.

"Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley at the Hollywood Canteen, c. 1943. Senior hosts/hostesses at the Canteen wore cloth armbands of red and white stripewith a blue star
and the initials 'HC' in white so the servicemen could distinguish them. (Junior hosts/hostesses wore solid red cloth armbands with a blue star and the 'HC' initials in white."


I certainly didn't know about the hierarchy of the armbands.

I'm curious, did you have to flip the Getty image M P? I noticed it's wrong on the Getty_images web site.
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/ne...hoto/491440242
__
excerpt from:
http://www.imgrum.net/media/96329559...586_1601928153
_

E_R, you know what? I wasn't convinced that this photo was Joan, either. I even looked up photos of Joan.
Still wasn't completely convinced, but I didn't think "Getty Images" would be wrong.

But look: The link I gave for the photo is also Getty:

http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/ne...hoto/103135609

...and it has it labeled as Olivia and Joan! And reversed. (I wonder which one is correct?
The reversing, I mean, the photo has to be Anne Shirley. I met her once!)
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  #35015  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 1:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Pal View Post
...but I didn't think "Getty Images" would be wrong.

But look: The link I gave for the photo is also Getty:

http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/ne...hoto/103135609

...and it has it labeled as Olivia and Joan! And reversed. (I wonder which one is correct?
The reversing, I mean, the photo has to be Anne Shirley. I met her once!)
That's really odd that there are two separate, and nearly identical, Gettyimages web sites.

In terms of the 'reversed' photo; you can tell which one is correct by looking at the initials (H C for Hollywood Canteen) on the arm bands.
So the correct photo, is the one that's mislabeled. (go figure )


You met Anne Shirley M P? Do tell.
__

Last edited by ethereal_reality; May 15, 2016 at 2:28 AM.
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  #35016  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 5:51 AM
Martin Pal Martin Pal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
That's really odd that there are two separate, and nearly identical, Gettyimages web sites.

In terms of the 'reversed' photo; you can tell which one is correct by looking at the initials (H C for Hollywood Canteen) on the arm bands.
So the correct photo, is the one that's mislabeled. (go figure )
___

Duh! I had figured that out before I posted it already
and then asked! I must be confused today! Oh, well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
You met Anne Shirley M P? Do tell.
__
___

Not a really great story, but I was a buyer for a small video store chain in the '80's and the store I worked out of was frequented by her son.
One day he brought in his mother and introduced us! We didn't know this was his mother before that. It's registered more as something fascinating
later on than it did at the time, as things sometimes do!
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  #35017  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 6:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Pal View Post
The Ambassador...or the Biltmore Bar, perhaps?




Here's a photo of that room:



Doesn't look that comfortable to sit around and peer through a small window. Also, it looks like the windows could open. I can't totally read that sign on the
wall, but it re-inforces that enlisted men ONLY are allowed on the first floor.

Great post Martin. Interesting information.

But the idea that officers could sit behind a window and peer down at the enlisted men in the club is creepy in the extreme. But then many of the officers I knew
in my military days were creepy unpleasant people.
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  #35018  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 6:24 AM
Tourmaline Tourmaline is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
Fantastic pics and conversation on the Hollywood Canteen folks.


M P, this is actually Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley.

"Olivia de Havilland and Anne Shirley at the Hollywood Canteen, c. 1943. Senior hosts/hostesses at the Canteen wore cloth armbands of red and white stripewith a blue star
and the initials 'HC' in white so the servicemen could distinguish them. (Junior hosts/hostesses wore solid red cloth armbands with a blue star and the 'HC' initials in white."


I certainly didn't know about the hierarchy of the armbands.

I'm curious, did you have to flip the Getty image M P? I noticed it's wrong on the Getty_images web site.
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/ne...hoto/491440242
___
excerpt from:
http://www.imgrum.net/media/96329559...586_1601928153


I happened upon this photograph earlier this evening.


http://moviestarmakeover.com/categor...ywood-canteen/


This is the first I've heard of a 'Hollywood Canteen Convoy Car'. So how did this work....did it deliver servicemen from nearby hotels?

(also,the lovely ladies in this photograph aren't named...does anyone recognize them)
_



There are quite a number of Canteen-related photos out there. A few can be found on this nice blog: http://moviestarmakeover.com/category/world-war-ii/, along with some of the back story regarding the Canteen's genesis and the undertakings of John Garfield and Bette Davis, among others. And another: http://evilbloggerlady.blogspot.com/...en-rule-5.html

Although I had not attached any significance to the armbands representing Canteen hostess rankings, I wonder what the Senior and Junior rankings really meant and, for that matter, whether most visiting soldiers, sailors and marines would have recognized any distinctions when it came to popular celebrities.


http://www.soldiersmuseum.com/pages/...od-canteen.jpg



http://assets.site-static.com/userFi...age/HC-022.jpg



Bud and Lou entertain at the opening.
https://onceuponascreen.files.wordpr...en-opening.jpg





Marlene and Rita
http://moviestarmakeover.com/wp-cont...e-and-rita.jpg



Mislabeling celebrities is common. Here the source identifies the Santa Claus as Al Jolson, even though St. Nick seems far more like Eddie Cantor.





Joseph Yule, a.k.a. Mickey Rooney plays the pagan skins.
http://moviestarmakeover.com/wp-cont...uso-mickey.jpg

http://www.seeing-stars.com/Images/S...ney-5(Ron).jpg



http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-mwMjEoKvLZ...dmd4u290io.jpg


Paulette Goddard(?)
http://assets.site-static.com/userFi...age/HC-003.jpg


FWIW, there was a "Stage Door Canteen" located in New York that was featured in a movie by the same name. Pictures of celebrities and service personnel that visited both the Hollywood Canteen and the Stage Door Canteen undoubtedly are confused. Not surprisingly, the Stage Door Canteen Film made use of studio sets in both the Fox Movietone Studio in New York and at RKO Pathé Studios in Los Angeles. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stage_...een_%28film%29



http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/thed...anteen_idb.jpg



http://tribute11.net/Williams/Hollywood_canteen.JPG



https://jnpickens.files.wordpress.co...od-canteen.jpg
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  #35019  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 8:30 AM
Martin Pal Martin Pal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
I happened upon this photograph earlier this evening.


http://moviestarmakeover.com/categor...ywood-canteen/

This is the first I've heard of a 'Hollywood Canteen Convoy Car'. So how did this work....did it deliver servicemen from nearby hotels?

(also,the lovely ladies in this photograph aren't named...does anyone recognize them)
_
Is this the same car?



This was captioned Hollywood Canteen Taxi/Limo parked in front of the Canteen. (It's name is on the driver side door.)

Someone named Jamie on MT's Garden of Allah site suggests:
"They staged regular convoys of cars from the training camps and bases to the canteen. These were usually driven by young women and chaperones not the “stars”. This wasn’t just in Hollywood but anywhere there was a base to bring guys on leave to entertainment and hospitality sites. This was an era with few cars and lots of hitchhiking. The signs indicated safe rides and/or destinations."

Makes sense with gas rationing. I have read that the Canteen brought soldiers and sailors recuperating from war injuries to the canteen, perhaps they used the car for that, or any number of other things.
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  #35020  
Old Posted May 15, 2016, 1:47 PM
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The girls are sitting on a '39 or '40 Packard; the woodie is a '41 Chrysler Town & Country
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