Your city's multiracial population/mixed unions

[ChrisLA]

Originally Posted by Acajack

And what about this guy?

I thought for sure he was bi-racial but apparently he isn't. At least he isn't Euro-Afro bi-racial.

https://www.google.ca/search?hl=fr&t...4dUDCAU&uact=5

He looks Jewish to me, but I will add that he has features like my childhood best friend. Although he was also black and Mexican, mom was Mexican and dad was black.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Acajack

And what about this guy?

I thought for sure he was bi-racial but apparently he isn't. At least he isn't Euro-Afro bi-racial.

https://www.google.ca/search?hl=fr&t...4dUDCAU&uact=5

Pete Davidson is half Jewish, with a little Sicilian from his mom's side, so nothing that "exotic."

There are lots of people of Jewish and/or South Euro descent who overlap pretty heavy on middle easterners. Look at the Atlanta rapper Russ for example. He's 100% Italian, but he looks like this:

[dave8721]

Most people would assume Rashida Jones (The Office, Muppets...etc) is white but she is the daughter of Quincy Jones and was a member of Harvard's Black Student Association..

[ChrisLA]

Maya Rudolph, some people don’t realize she’s black. Her mother is the singer Minnie Riperton who died of breast cancer when Maya was a little girl. Her mom had voice which I believe could hit those high notes higher and much longer than Mariah Cary can.

[yaletown_fella]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Pete Davidson is half Jewish, with a little Sicilian from his mom's side, so nothing that "exotic."

There are lots of people of Jewish and/or South Euro descent who overlap pretty heavy on middle easterners. Look at the Atlanta rapper Russ for example. He's 100% Italian, but he looks like this:

Sicily is generally much more mixed than the mainland. I believe, however, it's more mixed with North Africa/Magrehb (particularly on the eastern end of the Island) than it is mixed with Levantine or Gulf conquestors. You will also find a lot of Western European ancestry in Sicily as well, particularly the western side.

It's similar to how Greek Cypriots (and *some* islanders) cluster closer to Levantine people than Greek Mainlanders who are much closer to Serbians and Albanians. The culture however overwhelmingly unifies all contemporary Hellenic peoples.

Whats even more interesting to me are the pockets of the black Sea Coast of Turkey where you will find pale, sometimes blue/green eyed Romeyka speaking muslims. Romeyka is the closest surviving language that's rooted in ancient Greek.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcAYP4irSyQ

[Ant131531]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Congressman G. K. Butterfield (D-NC-01) is one of the best examples of a "white black man" I've ever seen.



This is a black man. Both of his parents were mixed race as well. The few pictures online suggest that they were both darker than he was, and he just by chance ended up with the "white genes."

That's not a black man. Nothing suggest he's black. It really doesn't matter what DNA or genes say. It's matter what you look like to people. People are going to discrimination and treat you a certai way based on how you appear to them.

Race is a socio-biological construct which means it's both social and biological.

[wwmiv]

Who are you to choose for someone else how they’ve experienced the world? He could very well have experienced racial discrimination.

[muppet]

Originally Posted by Shawn

I went to a university in Tokyo with a high amount (for Japan) of foreign and mixed students. Maybe half of my friends were half Japanese, half somewhere else. One of my best friends to this day from that time is half Japanese, half white American of German and Spanish descent. When my wife and I go out with her, we’ve had Japanese people ask my full-blooded wife if she’s half and assume she needs English menus, while our half friend who cannot read kanji well is always assumed to be full Japanese.

I didn’t find out one of my other friends was half Japanese until half a year into knowing him: he was 6 foot 3, 250 pounds of muscle, flaming red full beard and mustache, and green eyes. He looked as Irish as they come, super thick Boston accent. But he loved natto and could put back package after package of that hideousness and one day I asked, “How can you possibly eat that shit?” and he said “Dude, I’ve been eating it since I was 3. My mom’s Japanese.” Suddenly his perfect Japanese fluency made sense.

Point is, phenotypes are a total crapshoot. Especially when it comes to diverse admixtures.

I have about 3 friends who I've known for years - then discovered only recently they were mixed. They were of course very anglo looking, but then found out one of their parents were Indian, or Egyptian. Another guy I once met- proper Swedish looking, pale skin, blonde hair, blue eyes turns out to Iraqi (both parents).

Likewise some of my friends look 100% South Asian, but will have say a White or Black parent. A lot of people also assume I'm mixed race though I'm not; it kinda irks me.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by muppet

A lot of people also assume I'm mixed race though I'm not; it kinda irks me.

I'm a pretty white-looking person I think - of mostly Northern Euro extraction aside from 1/16th Sephardic ancestry. Dark hair and eyes though, and I tan reasonably well. When I was younger - particularly when I had a buzzcut and facial hair - I was pretty routinely confused for being Latino, which surprised the hell out of me.

[SignalHillHiker]

We're still very far behind in this regard, but it has dramatically improved in a single generation. My parents used to be considered mixed here - my father is an English Protestant, mother an Irish Catholic. She was beaten up by fellow Catholics for dating him in the early 1970s in Newfoundland and Labrador, Canada. Blows my mind.

It lingered a bit. When I was bullied in elementary school, they called me a halfbreed. So it was still around JUST enough then that they knew that word. But it quickly changed to f** by junior high. And today it's gone. Whatever is left, people don't even know the reason - it's just friendly geographic rivalry, not deeply rooted religious hatred. Now that I'm old enough to understand what it was, I cannot believe how completely and quickly it ended. Bravo to my parents' generation.

1.2% of couples in St. John's are in mixed relationships. That seems small, but it's about 50% of our non-white population. So, you know... it's doing well here, proportionately.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

We're still very far behind in this regard, but it has dramatically improved in a single generation. My parents used to be considered mixed here - my father is an English Protestant, mother an Irish Catholic. She was beaten up by fellow Catholics for dating him in the early 1970s in Newfoundland and Labrador, Canada. Blows my mind.

So were mine when they married in the late 60's. My mom's side is English and German Protestant, father's side is Italian Catholic. No one thinks anything of it today but it raised a few eyebrows back then.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

We're still very far behind in this regard, but it has dramatically improved in a single generation. My parents used to be considered mixed here - my father is an English Protestant, mother an Irish Catholic. She was beaten up by fellow Catholics for dating him in the early 1970s in Newfoundland and Labrador, Canada. Blows my mind.

It lingered a bit. When I was bullied in elementary school, they called me a halfbreed. So it was still around JUST enough then that they knew that word. But it quickly changed to f** by junior high. And today it's gone. Whatever is left, people don't even know the reason - it's just friendly geographic rivalry, not deeply rooted religious hatred. Now that I'm old enough to understand what it was, I cannot believe how completely and quickly it ended. Bravo to my parents' generation.

1.2% of couples in St. John's are in mixed relationships. That seems small, but it's about 50% of our non-white population. So, you know... it's doing well here, proportionately.

St. John's is probably the most "Irish" place outside of Ireland, by descent at least. But very different from Boston's Yankee-Irish rivalry. In Boston the Yankees had been there 200 years before and the Irish were the first "immigrants." Newfoundland's Irish date back to the pre-Famine era.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by ChrisLA

He looks Jewish to me, but I will add that he has features like my childhood best friend. Although he was also black and Mexican, mom was Mexican and dad was black.

He doesn't look Jewish at all to me. (At least, not what I typically think of when I have Jewish facial features in mind. Of course, Jews are a diverse group and have lots of different "looks".)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Pete Davidson is half Jewish, with a little Sicilian from his mom's side, so nothing that "exotic."

There are lots of people of Jewish and/or South Euro descent who overlap pretty heavy on middle easterners.

Yeah the NYC area (and even the BosNYWash corridor in general) has a lot of "swarthy" looking people I find.

Where I live in Quebec you have this as well because a significant percentage of the population is at least lightly métis (French word for mestizo) descended from mixing between settlers from France and indigenous people. My wife and one my kids are actually like this - they're clearly "white" but look like white people with year-round suntans.

As a result I tend to have a more elastic conception of who's white than many other people.

Like for example hispanics like Eva Longoria look "white" to me because so many people I've always lived around who are considered white have the same skin tone as her.

[Shawn]

Originally Posted by Docere

St. John's is probably the most "Irish" place outside of Ireland, by descent at least. But very different from Boston's Yankee-Irish rivalry. In Boston the Yankees had been there 200 years before and the Irish were the first "immigrants." Newfoundland's Irish date back to the pre-Famine era.

The mixing thing between whites is one of those funny head scratchers you hear your grandparents talk about. When they were kids in Boston, the big no-no was basically anyone not English marrying someone English. If you’re white and from Massachusetts or Rhode Island, you’re Irish, Italian, Portuguese, French Canadian, or English. Four of those five were traditionally super Catholic, while the English were traditionally Anglican. You could marry outside your ethnicity, but it had to be to another Catholic group. That actually meant it was preferable for Catholic whites to marry Catholic non-whites over marrying an English white person who wasn’t Catholic. So by the time my cohort was born, you had so so so many Irish-Italian, Irish-Portuguese, and Italian-Portuguese mixed families. And a surprisingly high number of mixed Irish/Italian/Portuguese and Haitian/Dominican/Puerto Rican/Vietnamese. Everyone’s at least nominally Catholic.

Which means kids with Irish last names who can somehow still get nice tans. I got stuck with Catholic Ukrainian genes instead of some nice melanin-gifted Italian or Portuguese ones for my non-Irish bit. Booooo.

[liat91]

Originally Posted by PFloyd

Well, in general one doesn't have to be 'blond, blue eyed' to be considered white - most North Americans from European descend would not even qualify then. I guess that term is loosely used to describe 'white', as opposed to 'mixed white'.

Regardless of the nuances or inaccuracies of that term, yes, in Latin America there was far more mixing than in North America. I suspect one of the reasons was that in the 1500's, the 'conquistadors' from the Iberian peninsula were men who came alone. While in North America, mass immigration from Europe occured centuries later consisting of men and women, families with children, etc.

In addition, in Latin America there were far more indigenous people than in North America. For instance, the Inca empire in South America was thought to have had at its peak 12 million people. Those were highly sophisticated cultures, that have left a huge architectural and historical legacy. By comparison, the mostly nomadic indigenous tribes in North America did not have the same 'presence' in population and cultural legacy. Mixing with Europeans was more of a sporadic than a common occurrence.

You likely don't know it, but Latin American societies are also very segregated, racially and economically. The part of the population with the highest level of European ancestry are always the wealthy elite. The only exception is probably Argentina, which was after the US and Canada the country in the Americas that received the largest levels of European immigration. So there you would find mostly 'whites' in all levels of society. Take a trip to Buenos Aires - you would think you have landed somewhere in Europe.

So, just because your day-to-day contact in the US is with the poorer immigrants (or their descendants) from Latin America, doesn't mean that is the whole picture. It just shows you that the lack of knowledge and a global view (including international travel) gives you a very limited understanding of reality.

Latin America is a land of varying degrees of mixing of the geographic groups of America’s, Africa and Europe, who in turn descend from peoples of further geographic mixing. The physical attribute that involves the lack of melanin in either the eyes, hair and skin (or any combination thereof) does not exist in Latin America in any meaningful statistical proportion. These traits may exist more heavily in Latin America than Burma or Uganda (where they do exist), but not enough for any reasonable person to conclude that; “wow, I’m going to start thinking of Brazilian people and blonde hair because 5% of the population has blonde hair. That’s a decent amount of people, but give it a rest.

I have been to countries on every continent and have dated and had friends from every continent. Blonde people are unique globally, and I really do appreciate the noticeably more shiny attributes they bare, I really do. My mother is one of them. Anyway, soon you’ll be able to choose these attributes for your kids (actually it was available in the 2010’s) and subsequently for your self via crispr technology.

[bossabreezes]

^^ This is an overly simplified view of things.

Latin America is much more highly regionalized than the US, for example. I'm from Brazil and there are places where you will only find black people, only find mixed-race people, and where you will only find blond haired, blued eyed whites. This is very, very much a reality in Brazil especially. Blond haired, blue/green eyed Brazilians are not rare in the slightest sense of the word. Same goes for asians, whites of mediterranean ethnicity, African dependents, and mixed race descendants.

Most large metropolises in Brazil are very ethnically heterogenous. It's when you get to the countryside when you see these things more blatantly depending on region. The north has largely Native, African and Japanese genes. Northeast has just about everything (with lots of mixture between African, Portuguese and Native genes.) The Southeast is mainly Italian, African, Portuguese, Lebanese/Syrian .The south is majority German, Northern Italian and Slavic. The Mid-West is Native, German and Italian as a majority.

Brazil received the second largest European immigration in the world, in sheer numbers, behind the United States. The United States has at least 130 million more inhabitants than Brazil.

To be honest, your post shows a bit of ignorance and lack of understanding of immigration and genetics in general. It doesn't matter if you were born in Antartica to Chinese parents- you're still going to appear as your parents do.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by Shawn

The mixing thing between whites is one of those funny head scratchers you hear your grandparents talk about. When they were kids in Boston, the big no-no was basically anyone not English marrying someone English. If you’re white and from Massachusetts or Rhode Island, you’re Irish, Italian, Portuguese, French Canadian, or English. Four of those five were traditionally super Catholic, while the English were traditionally Anglican. You could marry outside your ethnicity, but it had to be to another Catholic group. That actually meant it was preferable for Catholic whites to marry Catholic non-whites over marrying an English white person who wasn’t Catholic. So by the time my cohort was born, you had so so so many Irish-Italian, Irish-Portuguese, and Italian-Portuguese mixed families. And a surprisingly high number of mixed Irish/Italian/Portuguese and Haitian/Dominican/Puerto Rican/Vietnamese. Everyone’s at least nominally Catholic.

Which means kids with Irish last names who can somehow still get nice tans. I got stuck with Catholic Ukrainian genes instead of some nice melanin-gifted Italian or Portuguese ones for my non-Irish bit. Booooo.

What's remarkable too is the proportion of single ancestry reporting Irish Americans in Massachusetts. I suspect there's a big generational difference there, but even the Boomers would be 4th and 5th generation Americans mostly.

[yaletown_fella]

Originally Posted by Docere

Canadian stats (kind of?) overcome this issue by counting those who identify as White and Arab or West Asian not a visible minorities, but those who just tick off "Arab" or "West Asian" on the Census are classified as VMs.

Muslims from the region are more "racialized." Lebanese Christians, Armenians and Moroccan Jews tend to identify as white.

One of my buddies is Moroccan jewish and yes, lighter features tend to prevail
more in the jewish communities than in middle eastern gentile communities.

One of the most overlooked reasons is because cousin marriage was (this was of course, up until making aliyah or moving to US/Canada/Europe etc) was seen as a means of survival in a society where you simply couldn't trust or were unsure of the motives of outsiders. Morocco was becoming increasingly anti semitic up to and peaking after independence from the French Empire.

It's also the primary reason why a lot of Ashkenazi (especially Russian, Lithuanian , Estonian) are oftentimes lighter (for lack of a better word) than our southern Italian counterparts. A culture of cousin marriage tends to increase the prevalence of recessive features over the years.

This is also evident in the indigenous population of the Solomon Islands who have brown skin, soft african-like features but often a thick head of curly platinum blond hair.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by yaletown_fella

One of my buddies is Moroccan jewish and yes, lighter features tend to prevail
more in the jewish communities than in middle eastern gentile communities.

One of the most overlooked reasons is because cousin marriage was (this was of course, up until making aliyah or moving to US/Canada/Europe etc) was seen as a means of survival in a society where you simply couldn't trust or were unsure of the motives of outsiders. Morocco was becoming increasingly anti semitic up to and peaking after independence from the French Empire.

It's also the primary reason why a lot of Ashkenazi (especially Russian, Lithuanian , Estonian) are oftentimes lighter (for lack of a better word) than our southern Italian counterparts. A culture of cousin marriage tends to increase the prevalence of recessive features over the years.

This is also evident in the indigenous population of the Solomon Islands who have brown skin, soft african-like features but often a thick head of curly platinum blond hair.

One of the biggest reasons that Jews (and Christians) in the Middle East tend to be lighter than Muslims is the Arab slave trade.

In the Islamic world, slavery worked a bit differently than in America, insofar as any mixed-race offspring they fathered upon their female slaves would be given freedom - and more or less treated as any other Arab. As a result, much of the black DNA blended into the Muslim Arab population over time. In most cases outside of North Africa this isn't more than 10%, but it's enough to give them a distinct "look" compared to the non-Muslims of the area.