Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad9
The entire notion of ranking schools by number is a little ridiculous (yes, I know I initially mentioned “top 50”). . I think of them more as tiers. You have the truly elite schools like the Ivies, Stanford, Chicago, MIT, etc. Then you have the “near” elite schools (let’s be honest, these are still elite to 99% of the US population) like Vandy, WashU, Rice, etc. Then there’s a broad category of very good schools like the ones you mentioned. Most Big 10 schools, the Villanovas and Pepperdines of the world, UGA and UF...the list goes on for a while. Most of these schools won’t wow people by name prestige, but are nonetheless respected institutions that will vary widely on which is “better” depending on a student’s goals. It doesn’t (or shouldn’t) really matter whether that school is ranked 41 or 73.
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Right, the ranking #s are ridiculous and just gives people something to shout about being "top 10" or "top whatever". The tier approach is certainly more valid, if only based on the perception of prestige/history. It's just that within the really broad tiers of the "near elite" and "very good" schools, there exists so much variation in mission, scope, output, and "reputation" of the institutions.
I guess when I see state universities like Georgia, Florida, and Florida State now considered on the same level or superior to Washington, Penn State, Texas, Cal campuses, Illinois, and Wisconsin... it just gives me pause.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SIGSEGV
I don't disagree, I was just trying to list the "best" schools in each metro, not the set of schools that are elite in each Metro (that's why Houston and FIU were listed). I'm not implying that all the schools I listed are elite. But you're right, I forgot about the elite liberal arts colleges along the main line (Bryn Mawr, Haverford), although those don't have the same impact as a major university. And of course whether Villanova is actually better than Drexel or Temple is unclear (the latter two are more research-oriented) and I don't really know. Anecdotally, I personally know researches at Drexel and Penn but not the other schools in Philly, but of course I only have a narrow view of a tiny slice of the academic world.
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Yeah, I get what you were getting at. And you're right that the really big southern metros of DFW, Houston, and Miami/South Florida are certainly not considered to be major academic centers like other peer metros are. DFW area's most prestigious universities are SMU and TCU... which are definitely good schools with comprehensive offerings, but are far from being considered among the more selective national universities. DFW has two good schools that have transcended their Christian underpinnings, but are just really not in that higher tier. The Houston and Miami metros are more similar in that they have a single highly-selective top national university (in Rice and Miami, respectively), but then there's a HUGE step down to their next major representative (Houston and FIU, respectively). Not that UH and FIU don't provide quality education, they do. But their mission is to provide a 4-year higher education to the generally local public in a non-selective manner.
Philadelphia is an interesting case, really. Because it has Penn, and then there's also a major drop to the next level of "prestige". It's no Boston in that regard. Philly has tons of highly-regarded schools, but in that group is a ton of "big name" liberal arts colleges, which like you said, are not the same as major universities. After Penn, it's a pretty big drop to Villanova or Temple or Drexel, in terms of prestige. It's certainly not Boston's smaller step down from Harvard and MIT down to Tufts or Brandeis or BU or BC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad9
Really? That’s news to me. When I was in high school in Florida, UCF and USF were pretty well respected. Florida is obviously huge and growing, and the relatively limited number of established universities (UF, Miami, and FSU really) mean that UCF/USF get an overflow of smart students who don’t go to the three primary schools.
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UCF and USF have really come a long way, even the past 10 years. Florida public schools in general have done so, coinciding with the state's boom in population in the past half century or so. Miami has always been the private, more elite school with a national student body and price tag to match. While UF was always the "good" state school and FSU the "place anybody with a pulse could get into".
The state has pumped a lot of $ into UF and FSU over the past decade in particular in hopes of getting them both into the "top tier", which long only had Miami as its state representative. UF has really boosted its quality of offerings and research output with its change in focus from being a "state school" to a national university that attracts academics from all over. FSU still pretty much occupies that 3rd spot as the good, big state school that isn't terribly hard to get into, but still offers a very good education, and has more of a name than a Central Florida or South Florida or Florida Atlantic or Florida Gulf Coast, etc.
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