Is This Really Living?

[The ATX]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I don't really see how this is any different than white Americans fleeing central cities for suburban cul-de-sacs. Gated houses and buildings in Latin American cities are probably less a necessity than they are a sign of affluence.

There is a big difference between living on a cul-de-sac in a low crime area and living behind a big wall with razor wire in a high crime area.

[Reverberation]

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

I haven't seen that there, but I certainly haven't been in every neighborhood. Is that near Gulfton, by any chance?

I haven't seen walled off homes them here in Austin (unless just for privacy) but maybe we should have them considering the home invasions going on here, including one recently on the street behind me. And about a mile from here, and elderly couple was recently murdered in a home invasion. They had lived in their home for about 50 years.

Those type of developments are peppered across southwest and north Houston.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7334...!3m1!1e3?hl=en

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7139...!3m1!1e3?hl=en

I think the problem is part crime, part decaying C class apartments with lousy owners and part the fact that superblock complexes (my biggest pet peeve about Houston) are extremely difficult to police.

[DatFiyah]

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

I haven't seen that there, but I certainly haven't been in every neighborhood. Is that near Gulfton, by any chance?

I haven't seen walled off homes them here in Austin (unless just for privacy) but maybe we should have them considering the home invasions going on here, including one recently on the street behind me. And about a mile from here, and elderly couple was recently murdered in a home invasion. They had lived in their home for about 50 years.

I'm not sure I've seen them around Gulfton. SW Houston is where I'm most familiar with them but this is pretty much how they look all around the city and they are still building them. The walls go completely around the development. These two developments have tons of low cost apartments all around them on Hayes Road and Wilcrest.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.7210...!7i3328!8i1664

[ssiguy]

It's not an ideal living situation but that's easy for me to say living in a lofty Vancouver suburb. If I felt threatened or lived in a dangerous country I would probably do the same.

[austlar1]

edit

[miketoronto]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

It's not an ideal living situation but that's easy for me to say living in a lofty Vancouver suburb. If I felt threatened or lived in a dangerous country I would probably do the same.

But would it not be better for these countries to address these crime problems, then just accept that you have to live behind a concrete wall with electric fences on top of it?

[mhays]

I'm guessing you don't mean to do those things in sequence, but it's not 100% clear given your typical spelling issues!

[StethJeff]

Some of the comparisons here are a little silly. Most of the affluent areas of LA that have homes with walls and gates - Hollywood Hills, Malibu, Newport, etc. - have them for the simple sake of privacy and exclusivity. My guess is the same goes for other similar equivalent neighborhoods in the U.S. The constant threat of armed goons holding your entire family at knifepoint isn't exactly a day-to-day concern in American suburbs. Any moron can jump over the well-manicured landscaping serving as a barrier to many of these homes.

Armed robbery is no joke in South African cities. Johannesburg suburb walled defenses are basically the norm out of necessity because of the high degree of violent crime that they are possibly exposed to. Walls are usually topped with shards of broken beer bottles or go straight to razor wire.

[plinko]

I once designed a house in Beverly Hills for a woman from Jerusalem (it never got built). It's staggering how much different some people from outside the US view security.

This particular road doesn't look much different from countless affluent areas in California.

[McBane]

Originally Posted by StethJeff

Some of the comparisons here are a little silly. Most of the affluent areas of LA that have homes with walls and gates - Hollywood Hills, Malibu, Newport, etc. - have them for the simple sake of privacy and exclusivity. My guess is the same goes for other similar equivalent neighborhoods in the U.S. The constant threat of armed goons holding your entire family at knifepoint isn't exactly a day-to-day concern in American suburbs. Any moron can jump over the well-manicured landscaping serving as a barrier to many of these homes.

Armed robbery is no joke in South African cities. Johannesburg suburb walled defenses are basically the norm out of necessity because of the high degree of violent crime that they are possibly exposed to. Walls are usually topped with shards of broken beer bottles or go straight to razor wire.

I wanted to say the same thing after reading some of the posts about "similar" setups in the US. It's totally not the same. For the most part, violent crime in the US can be avoided with a little common sense (like staying out of bad neighborhoods). But in certain other countries, violent criminals specifically target wealthier neighborhoods; it's a real threat and, unlike in the US, retreating to your nice suburb doesn't make you any safer.

[brickell]

There's probably a pretty high correlation between segregation, income inequality and these types of security measures. So of course a Canadian would have a hard time understanding it.

You see it most in Miami when very poor neighborhoods abut very rich ones... which is not uncommon closer in. But even then, not to the extent I saw in the link posted.

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by The ATX

There is a big difference between living on a cul-de-sac in a low crime area and living behind a big wall with razor wire in a high crime area.

What would be the difference? In both, families choose to separate themselves from everyone else. It's just that in Latin America there are no real suburbs to move to, because services are horrible outside of city centers, so the wealthy stay in the core.

[ssiguy]

Originally Posted by miketoronto

But would it not be better for these countries to address these crime problems, then just accept that you have to live behind a concrete wall with electric fences on top of it?

Of course it would be but people don't live in the uncertain future but in the now.

You can't expect people to let their security and piece of wind to be sacrificed waiting decades for the crime rate to come down.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by destroycreate

After being a victim of crime a number of times, nothing is more valuable to me anymore than safety - especially after experiencing a home invasion. There really is nothing more disturbing than strangers being in your home, or threatening your loved ones with violence.

If I were affluent and lived in a very violent country like Brazil, Mexico, or South Africa, absolutely I would choose to live in this type of environment. It's not ideal, but for those that have no choice but to live in that country, it is as ideal as it will get. I'm pretty sure they're not thinking about "walkability" as much as they are "will I get mugged today while walking?".

Basically. Lima (Peru) is such a city. All the wealthy and middle class live behind two/three (sometimes more) storey cages and/or bars on all breakable surfaces.