Let's talk about one-way streets

[TheHonestMaple]

Originally Posted by ShavedParmesanCheese

Hamilton was first settled about 1816.

For 82 years it grew as the industrial centre of the province before the first car was brought into town by John Moodie Jr. In 1898. Short line railways supplied those industries with networks all over downtown, as well as the harbourfront. Electric streetcars moved the masses and 3 railway stations - 2 on mainlines - connected the city to the rest of the world. Not to mention the incline railways.

In the 1890s, Hamilton was the 4th largest city in the country, larger than Winnipeg, Halifax, Ottawa, Vancouver, and anything else out west.

Not every city in Canada is Mississauga. We have history, and even the younger cities across the country have decades of it before the car was even invented. Just because it's comfortable to drive, doesn't mean it was always that way.

I get that. But Hamilton was much much much smaller back in 1816. Choose to face the reality or not, Canada is a car centric country and society. And it pretty much always will be because of how sprawling our cities are (that can't really be changed, they're simply not dense cities). Sure, the downtown centre may become more pedestrian friendly. But bottom line, if you live in Ancaster in work somewhere in the lower city, you're going to be driving.

[ScreamingViking]

Driving will remain as the dominant mode, likely for a long long time.

I think the issue is getting muddied here. It's not about the driving, it's how we approach the design and operation of the roads we drive on especially how other uses are integrated with and into them. And we (society, at many levels) can do a far, far better job of making them safer, both by design and by behaviour.

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by ScreamingViking

Driving will remain as the dominant mode, likely for a long long time.

I think the issue is getting muddied here. It's not about the driving, it's how we approach the design and operation of the roads we drive on especially how other uses are integrated with and into them. And we (society, at many levels) can do a far, far better job of making them safer, both by design and by behaviour.

Precisely. This has nothing to do with how we get around, and all to do with how we design the infrastructure we use to get around. Dismissing the danger of the designed environment on the fact that car culture is ingrained into our society is irrelevant. My point is that car culture, something that has be denied that exists despite the fact that the main mode of transportation is by car, is causing bad road design in Hamilton. You can hear it in the way our councillors discuss the road design. If we fix our roads it will cause delays to car drivers. My point about car culture is that it is overrunning all other priorities. Endangering students? Who cars because drive fast down roads. We need to stop thinking about only moving automobiles as quickly as possible and think about other road users. Downtown needs that if it wants to continue it's upward trajectory and it will regardless because urbanites are moving to the lower city and their voice is very clearly becoming louder against these dangerous roads.

[TheHonestMaple]

Originally Posted by TheRitsman

Precisely. This has nothing to do with how we get around, and all to do with how we design the infrastructure we use to get around. Dismissing the danger of the designed environment on the fact that car culture is ingrained into our society is irrelevant. My point is that car culture, something that has be denied that exists despite the fact that the main mode of transportation is by car, is causing bad road design in Hamilton. You can hear it in the way our councillors discuss the road design. If we fix our roads it will cause delays to car drivers. My point about car culture is that it is overrunning all other priorities. Endangering students? Who cars because drive fast down roads. We need to stop thinking about only moving automobiles as quickly as possible and think about other road users. Downtown needs that if it wants to continue it's upward trajectory and it will regardless because urbanites are moving to the lower city and their voice is very clearly becoming louder against these dangerous roads.

I'm not dismissing the danger by saying we're a car centric society. I just think some people have some sort of romantic idea of removing cars from Canadian cities that simply is NEVER going to happen because of how or cities are designed - sprawling sprawling suburbia.

I stated clearly above that I think Main needs a redesign. I've always been in favour of converting it to a two direction street with a central landscaped median. I also think there should be more lights that are not synchronized and probably even speed traps. I walk that intersection (Main and Dundurn) almost daily, it's dangerous and needs to be fixed.

I totally agree that we can do better engineering to make these roads safer, especially Main and King. I'm also shocked that City Hall has not made this a priority.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by TheHonestMaple

I'm also shocked that City Hall has not made this a priority.

As a whole, I think citizens have not pressed city council enough to make it one. And the ones who have raised the issues get sloughed off as "activists" or some such label.

Street safety is an issue in every single neighbourhood.

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by TheHonestMaple

I'm not dismissing the danger by saying we're a car centric society. I just think some people have some sort of romantic idea of removing cars from Canadian cities that simply is NEVER going to happen because of how or cities are designed - sprawling sprawling suburbia.

I stated clearly above that I think Main needs a redesign. I've always been in favour of converting it to a two direction street with a central landscaped median. I also think there should be more lights that are not synchronized and probably even speed traps. I walk that intersection (Main and Dundurn) almost daily, it's dangerous and needs to be fixed.

I totally agree that we can do better engineering to make these roads safer, especially Main and King. I'm also shocked that City Hall has not made this a priority.

I haven't heard anyone seriously suggesting removing cars from Canadian cities. Anyone who actually knows places like Netherlands knows there are many, many, many cars there too. It's about picking a choosing which streets get cars, opening more space to pedestrians and offering alternative options. The current status quo is dangerous and means for many people they have one realistic choice to get around; a car.

Look at Bloor in Toronto. I think we can all agree the juggernaut that Toronto is compared to hilariously not huge Hamilton is, and yet Bloor is a 2 way, single automobile lane in each direction street with bicycle lanes and larger sidewalks. This all despite the fact that I'm pretty sure Bloor is a larger ROW than Main St is.

The fact that Hamilton gives 90% of road space to cars in 2022 while it's rivals of Toronto, KW, London and Guelph are all quickly recognizing that's a bad plan, is scary, tiresome and just overall bad. If Hamilton wants to invite and encourage new residents to come here and start things like businesses, it needs to be more than skyscraper city #2. It needs to built livable and enjoyable communities and spaces. Hamilton has a very well designed ring road. Much better than Toronto, and this is confirmed by the ability to move trucks out of downtown. Now we just need to remove a single lane from Main St, make it two way, and widen the sidewalk, which in conjunction with LRT will significantly change the feel and safety of downtown Hamilton and it will quickly change the culture of the city as there are fewer options to park in downtown, and better transit coming.

[SteelTown]

Councillors call for Main Street to be converted to two-way traffic after pedestrian deaths
12 traffic fatalities in Hamilton so far this year, 11 involving pedestrians

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...swqZfLn5O2jnmE

Hamilton councillor Maureen Wilson has shared a copy of a motion calling for Main Street West to be converted to two-way traffic as a safety measure, following a series of crashes that have killed and injured pedestrians.

The motion, which Wilson said she and Ward 3 Councillor Nrinder Nann will bring before council Wednesday, references the fact that 10 pedestrians had been killed in Hamilton this year.

An 11th incident was reported Tuesday morning after a 64-year-old man died after being hit by a transport truck at a business in Flamborough.

Wilson and Nann's motion points to the city's annual collision report, stating it reveals an "overrepresentation of fatal and injury collisions" along Main and King Streets — both multi-lane, one-way roads through the city's core.

"The number of collision deaths/injuries along Main & King is reported annually," Wilson posted on Twitter, along with screenshots of her motion. "These outcomes would not be accepted on any other city road."

The councillor pointed to the Red Hill Valley Parkway Inquiry that's currently underway, saying the number of collision-related deaths and injuries along Main and King streets is already reported annually.

"More study? Time to act," she wrote.

The motion also calls for staff to find ways to immediately improve safety along the two streets, suggesting more pedestrian space, temporary lane reductions, a reduced speed limit and looking at the synchronized traffic lights on Main Street.

Wilson writes that staff should report back early next year with an implementation plan for making Main two-way, including costs and a construction timeline.

Ward 8 Councillor John-Paul Danko shared Wilson's post about the motion, adding comments of his own.

"Council knows the problem: the one way configuration of Main is inherently dangerous and killing people," he tweeted.

"Council knows the solution: immediate safety improvements & two way reversion."

In a follow-up post, Danko said anything less than immediate action was "unacceptable."

"There is no excuse, no rationalization, no dithering," he added.






https://twitter.com/ward1wilson/

[TheHonestMaple]

I'll be watching council tomorrow for sure. What's the odds Main gets converted to two-way in the next 5 years?

[matt602]

It'll definitely see pushback from the usual suspects but it'll be harder for them to justify it given the amount of deaths in the past few months. Either way a decision on whether to actually do it or not will get punted to the next council so we'll have to see who gets elected.

[SteelTown]

I'd rather have a road diet for Main St than two-way (at least for the short-term).

I prefer city staff to have a proper long-term review and plans for Main St, then do a quick band-aid solution where we may have to change everything once LRT is up and running.

[Innsertnamehere]

yup. I would cut a lane immediately across the entire corridor and turn it over for pedestrian improvements (perhaps half a lane on each side), then work on a 2-way conversion for when the LRT construction starts in earnest in 2024 to help handle some of that traffic.

Main St as a 5-lane one way into the core never made sense post-LRT anyway as the capacity going the other way is completely removed.

Generally I think we should cut it by a lane across the entire corridor for pedestrian improvements, then convert the remaining parts as 2-3 lanes one way and 1 lane the opposite, perhaps with select turn lanes in key locations, and off-peak parking on the 3-lane parts in the eastward direction.

One thing I'm not sure of the utility of is reducing the speed limit across the corridor - the signal timing right now does an excellent job of generally keeping people at the speed limit, Main St has pretty good speed limit adherence compared to most streets. The only problem spot is the downhill part between Queen and Bay St, and dropping the limit isn't going to really change that part..

[matt602]

I agree with the last 2 posts. I'm not entirely opposed to the idea of Main Street being one-way but I agree it absolutely needs to be slowed down by removing lanes, widening sidewalks and removing the synchronized traffic light system. Removing the sychronized lights alone would insantly make a difference since the traffic would no longer be moving in high speed platoons, racing from light to light across the entire lower city. This could be done literally overnight too.

[TheHonestMaple]

I can't believe Lloyd Ferguson's senseless rambling about this Main Street conversion. I'm not even sure what his point was. The motion is to investigate the conversion, exactly what he's asking for. Seems like he's just trying to appeal to his suburban base.

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by TheHonestMaple

I can't believe Lloyd Ferguson's senseless rambling about this Main Street conversion. I'm not even sure what his point was. The motion is to investigate the conversion, exactly what he's asking for. Seems like he's just trying to appeal to his suburban base.

You're talking about the guy who after hearing about a teenager nearly being killed at Main and Dundurn was tone deaf enough to point out that card rivers are people too. So I'm not too surprised.

[TheHonestMaple]

What a buffoon.

Well i'm really glad they've approved the motion, including (b) the conversion of Main to two way. Maybe we'll finally see some real change here.

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by TheHonestMaple

What a buffoon.

Well i'm really glad they've approved the motion, including (b) the conversion of Main to two way. Maybe we'll finally see some real change here.

Same here. I'm hopeful that our demonstration today had an impact on council, and shows that residents won't accept their streets being unsafe. This doesn't just mean Main St. Unlike many suburban drivers, I actually have empathy and give a shit about the lives of people living in all of Hamilton. People shouldn't die for the convenience of drivers in Hamilton, Ancaster, Stoney Creek, Waterdown, or Dundas. It's just not acceptable in the 21st century.

[TheHonestMaple]

What does the election mean for this though? Will it have to go back for another vote in the fall?

[Innsertnamehere]

The interim improvements can likely be made this summer prior to the election (hopefully), but the final plan for Main would likely need a full council vote, which means after the election.

Given that this was approved 13-1 though, I suspect it would pass even on the new council.

[TheHonestMaple]

I just noticed that the motion actually says that the city won't even come back to council with a conversion plan until January 2023.

[Doady]

The issue was never about one-way vs. two-way. After all, Toronto is full of one-way streets, and Rue Ste-Catherine in Montreal is one-way too. The real issue is the width of roads, the narrow sidewalks, the lack of parallel parking to calm traffic and provide a buffer between cars and pedestrians, that sort of thing. Going on and on about one-way vs. two-way obscures the real issues.

All this ranting about "suburbanites" and Canada's "car culture" doesn't make sense either. Suburbanization or Canada being a "car culture" doesn't explain Hamilton Street Railway's significantly lower ridership per capita compared to Mississauga's MiWay, Winnipeg Transit, London Transit Commission, why the ridership of Hamilton declined while the rest of Ontario and Canada saw their transit ridership grow from 2003 to 2019. Are suburbanites in Etobicoke, North York, and Scarborough making the streets of downtown Toronto unsafe too? Is Montreal-Nord killing the ridership of STM? Stop whining about the "suburban" parts of Hamilton, seriously.

Transit ridership per capita:

Municipality  2003  2008  2013  2018
Hamilton      47    45    45    41
London        50    63    63    61
Waterloo      29    33    50    45
Mississauga   38    44    47    53
Brampton      22    27    35    50