Historical Winnipeg discussion

[esquire]

Originally Posted by BigG

Wonder why they didn't connect Wellington to Cumberland since it seemed like a natural connection. Even at present, there's just a little plot of green space there just south of KFC. Wellington would be very different today if that happened.

I also always thought that was a bit odd. By extending it to Maryland/Sherbrook at one end, and by crossing the CP tracks at the other end, Wellington would effectively become a downtown/airport commuting route and could relieve some of the stress from the other existing routes.

It's such low hanging fruit... I wonder why it hasn't happened?

[TimeFadesAway]

Originally Posted by BigG

Wow! Thanks. I see the old Molson breweries plant and the old Somerset School which is now Shoppers Drug Mart. Wonder why they didn't connect Wellington to Cumberland since it seemed like a natural connection. Even at present, there's just a little plot of green space there just south of KFC. Wellington would be very different today if that happened. I also see my childhood home. Thanks a lot TFA! I really appreciate it.

That surprises me as well, it seems like a natural connection. Not sure why they didn't join them up.

BTW This (really) big map from 1874 illustrates my point about the river lots and the HBC Reserve quite nicely.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/manito...76499/sizes/o/

Wyman Laliberte's stuff on Flickr is gold to a map geek like me!

[esquire]

^ That's a cool map... it's interesting to see how early Winnipeg was very much centred along Main Street, close to the current City Hall. The current downtown grid appears to have been basically just a suburban appendage.

Winnipeg is a bit of a quirky city in that the downtown of 1890 was almost left in state to deteriorate gradually over the years, and a totally new one was built to the southwest. If it weren't for the urban renewal projects along Main in the 60s, our "old downtown" would probably be nearly intact.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by TimeFadesAway

That surprises me as well, it seems like a natural connection. Not sure why they didn't join them up.

BTW This (really) big map from 1874 illustrates my point about the river lots and the HBC Reserve quite nicely.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/manito...76499/sizes/o/

Wyman Laliberte's stuff on Flickr is gold to a map geek like me!

He did quite a job getting all that stuff up there. I have a number of the early maps myself, some of which I put on Flickr under my name of wintorbos. But I don't have a huge scanner like he was using. I have more recently managed to acquire 3 volumes of the 1950s fire insurance street plans - I think there were 7 in total - which are extremely useful for piecing this history together.

[BigG]

Originally Posted by esquire

I also always thought that was a bit odd. By extending it to Maryland/Sherbrook at one end, and by crossing the CP tracks at the other end, Wellington would effectively become a downtown/airport commuting route and could relieve some of the stress from the other existing routes.

It's such low hanging fruit... I wonder why it hasn't happened?

That would be the most direct route from downtown. Imagine that. Is it possible that in the past it was pondered, or perhaps in someone's cross-hairs at present?

[BigG]

What ever happened to Colony Creek? Is it underground now?

[TimeFadesAway]

Originally Posted by Andy6

I have more recently managed to acquire 3 volumes of the 1950s fire insurance street plans - I think there were 7 in total - which are extremely useful for piecing this history together.

I love looking at the ones in the national archive. They have one from the 1880s that has faded to the point of unreadability, but the 1906 and 1914 ones are great. I came across an electronic version of the 1920 one at some point, but have never been able to find it again.

Haven't seen any from the 50s that cover the old city of Winnipeg.

They are incredibly useful for research, probably one of the best resources out there.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by TimeFadesAway

I love looking at the ones in the national archive. They have one from the 1880s that has faded to the point of unreadability, but the 1906 and 1914 ones are great. I came across an electronic version of the 1920 one at some point, but have never been able to find it again.

Haven't seen any from the 50s that cover the old city of Winnipeg.

They are incredibly useful for research, probably one of the best resources out there.

I have Fort Rouge down to River Park, downtown south of Notre Dame and then the North End. Haven't found the Exchange district volume yet. Some were annotated by the original user with notes about when various buildings were torn down, so that's a bonus.

[TimeFadesAway]

Originally Posted by BigG

What ever happened to Colony Creek? Is it underground now?

Colony Creek was apparently diverted into Omands Creek at some point in some way, possibly underground.

Brown's Creek (the one that ran through the city hall property, down John Hirsch Place and into the Red) and the creek just to the north where Fort Douglas was built (I can't remember the name) were both forced underground. On the riverbank, you can still see where they drain into the river.

[Urban recluse]

I forgot about that creek. How nice to have it back, or some kind of canal (a la Bricktown in OKC)

[bomberjet]

A number of the small creeks etc, just get filled in when development comes their way. A lot of the land they were draining is now being handled by sewers etc. So there's no need for the creeks anymore. The major ones that are draining water from beyond the City would have to be diverted into something.

[TimeFadesAway]

Originally Posted by Andy6

I have Fort Rouge down to River Park, downtown south of Notre Dame and then the North End. Haven't found the Exchange district volume yet. Some were annotated by the original user with notes about when various buildings were torn down, so that's a bonus.

You've got me drooling now...

[snowmobile]

Always found it interesting how the Goldeyes played in the corner of Winnipeg Stadium
Could never find any good pictures of videos of how it was setup

but in this episode https://vimeo.com/107832849 of Baseball, Minnesota the Saints are in Winnipeg in the summer of '96 to play the Goldeyes. A couple Saints players make comments about how odd the stadium is with the short porch in left. Even former World Series MVP Jack Morris chimes in. Skip to 8:00 to see the stadium

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by snowmobile

Always found it interesting how the Goldeyes played in the corner of Winnipeg Stadium
Could never find any good pictures of videos of how it was setup

but in this episode https://vimeo.com/107832849 of Baseball, Minnesota the Saints are in Winnipeg in the summer of '96 to play the Goldeyes. A couple Saints players make comments about how odd the stadium is with the short porch in left. Even former World Series MVP Jack Morris chimes in. Skip to 8:00 to see the stadium

It wasn't very good but they could get a lot of people in there, and sometimes did. People weren't quite so fussy about everything in the long-ago world of 1996.
Prior to that, the baseball stand was at the other end of the field, but between the time that the Whips left and the current Goldeyes were born the Bomber offices encroached on the old ballpark area so it had to be relocated.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Andy6

It wasn't very good but they could get a lot of people in there, and sometimes did. People weren't quite so fussy about everything in the long-ago world of 1996.
Prior to that, the baseball stand was at the other end of the field, but between the time that the Whips left and the current Goldeyes were born the Bomber offices encroached on the old ballpark area so it had to be relocated.

I always thought it was a little peculiar that the Bombers were allowed to build their offices and clubhouse directly on the site where the original 1953 baseball stands were located. It's not like they were pressed for space at the old stadium site.

That's what triggered the 1987 renovation which ended up seeing the field converted to artificial turf and the "baseball stands" being built in a gap between the west grandstand and north end zone stands, along with the conversion of the lower parts of the east grandstand to retractable seating to extend the left field area by a little bit.

If you can believe it, an effort was mounted to attract a AAA franchise sometime in the late 80s or early 90s (they had a name and everything: the Mounties). It ended up failing, mainly, as I recall, due to the reluctance of the western Pacific Coast League teams to travel this far east. These days a setup like the 1987 baseball configuration probably wouldn't be considered for anything but the lowest levels (rookie level, maybe single A) of pro baseball, and even then it would only be accepted with the greatest reluctance I'm sure.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by esquire

I always thought it was a little peculiar that the Bombers were allowed to build their offices and clubhouse directly on the site where the original 1953 baseball stands were located. It's not like they were pressed for space at the old stadium site.

That's what triggered the 1987 renovation which ended up seeing the field converted to artificial turf and the "baseball stands" being built in a gap between the west grandstand and north end zone stands, along with the conversion of the lower parts of the east grandstand to retractable seating to extend the left field area by a little bit.

If you can believe it, an effort was mounted to attract a AAA franchise sometime in the late 80s or early 90s (they had a name and everything: the Mounties). It ended up failing, mainly, as I recall, due to the reluctance of the western Pacific Coast League teams to travel this far east. These days a setup like the 1987 baseball configuration probably wouldn't be considered for anything but the lowest levels (rookie level, maybe single A) of pro baseball, and even then it would only be accepted with the greatest reluctance I'm sure.

I can't say I minded it ... it was kind of fun to go to those early Goldeye games. I don't recollect ever being at a Whips game although I know I had a Whips cap.

[esquire]

^ I agree, it was a lot of fun attending baseball games in the weird baseball configuration at the stadium. The reason the Goldeyes had to get out of the old stadium was more about the club's balance sheet than anything else... the Goldeyes probably had a much better setup with regard to skyboxes and premium seating at the then-Canwest Global Park than the original Jets did at the Winnipeg Arena.

[snowmobile]

read a story on nlfan that one time during a thunderstorm the dugouts filled up with water since the turf had poor drainage and the players swam laps .

What was the buzz around Winnipeg about the Winnipeg Fury? Did they ever play at Winnipeg Stadium or only at the university?

What about the Cyclone or Thunder? The atmosphere at those must have been similar to goldeyes games i.e families .

[esquire]

^ The Fury actually had a pretty decent following considering the newness of the team. The lack of a properly-sized venue didn't help much... University Stadium was pretty lame for a pro venue, and Winnipeg Stadium was way too big... as I recall, the only time the Fury managed to draw decent sized crowds at Winnipeg Stadium was when their sponsor Superstore gave away tickets. I think their last season or two they played at the Winnipeg Soccer Complex. Fun fact: Troy Westwood briefly played for the Fury.

The Thunder was actually a pretty big attraction for the first season, but then the WBL sort of collapsed around it. I remember going to games and there were some pretty respectable crowds... it started off around the 6-7 thousand range in 1992 before dropping off to about 4 thousand. Then in 1994 the league was on life support and the Goldeyes had started up and interest in the Thunder evaporated... no one wanted to sit inside the arena on a warm summer night anymore when you could watch baseball outdoors instead. I remember going to a Thunder game in the summer of 94... there couldn't have been more than 2,000 people there and meanwhile across the street at the stadium, there must have been around 6 or 7 thousand people watching the Goldeyes. If the WBL hadn't collapsed I'm sure the Thunder could have stuck it out longer.

The Cyclone lasted longer than the Thunder even though no one remembers them (they played six seasons from 1995-2001). They never had the honeymoon that the Thunder briefly enjoyed. And the Winnipeg Convention Centre was terrible as a basketball venue. Unlike the Thunder which was actually kind of a cool attraction for a year or two, the Cyclone were pretty well always playing in front of families and hardcore basketball freaks who just wanted to watch live ball. I recall there being some animosity with the university teams because the Cyclone tended to steal the type of fans who'd otherwise go watch the Bisons or Wesmen live.

[bomberjet]

It was quite enjoyable to hang out in the parking lot behind the baseball bleachers at Canad Inns during those early Goldeyes games. Foul balls a plenty come flying over the top. No cars were parked there. But kids running allover trying to get those balls as they bounced around.

I also remember attending a few Thunder games and they were fun. I was still quite young at the time, but remember the ACDC blasting!