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  #5101  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2014, 3:10 PM
Azstar Azstar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Lyons View Post
Looks like Moore gets his wish:

http://tucson.com/news/local/govt-an...b3fd19de8.html

This guy has no business being on this board. Voting 1,000-70 after clearly violating the rules is only only going to delay the project and give Rio Nuevo a bad name again.
Pretty sure this project will end up like the other Rio Development projects, e.g. Thrifty Block, Gadsden Co... no development following years of delays, extensions, excuses, etc.
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  #5102  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2014, 3:41 PM
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southtucsonboy77 southtucsonboy77 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ritarancher View Post
This is pretty good news. I'm excited for the development. I'm a little concerned about how it will affect the Tucson and Park Malls because only a fool would pay full price for the same product.
I'm hoping for a Fossil store lol!!
A lot of people from Mexico and here in S. AZ already make a special trip to the Phoenix Outlets at Wild Horse Pass, especially for X-mas and back-to-school shopping. This development will keep more of that business in our region. So I don't think it will hurt those 2 malls...the one I'm concerned with is the Foothills "outlet" Mall.
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  #5103  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2014, 3:57 PM
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southtucsonboy77 southtucsonboy77 is offline
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Originally Posted by Azstar View Post
Pretty sure this project will end up like the other Rio Development projects, e.g. Thrifty Block, Gadsden Co... no development following years of delays, extensions, excuses, etc.
He's a Nimrod...his scoring is a joke, his "speech" was a joke, his interrogation of Peach Properties was a joke. Ok, we get it, you don't like Peach Properties, but as a public official and as a scoring panelist who made an oath to abide by the rules, you violated the process.

One other factoid that blew me away: Chairman McCusker scored the presentations in favor of Nor-Gen 835-795...whaaaat? Did we the public see the same presentations?

I'm reaching here...but if this development goes thru (which I don't think it will anytime soon) is that there will be new blood, landscape design, and architecture for downtown Tucson. I was disappointed that these 2 were the only ones who went for the RFP (hmm, I wonder why?). Peach has alot of presence downtown already, this development would have really overwhelmed us. But to settle for Nor-Gen???
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  #5104  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2014, 4:42 PM
Ted Lyons Ted Lyons is offline
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The one saving grace, in my mind, is that Nor-Gen still would have won had Moore graded Peach the equivalent of the lowest legitimate vote cast and Nor-Gen the equivalent of the highest vote cast. In other words, had he scored Peach 700 and Nor-Gen 980, Nor-Gen still would have won. This still doesn't make me feel better about the project given the complete lack of financing for half of the proposed construction and the poor grading on the construction schedule.

If I'm Rio Nuevo, my priorities on this project are construction schedule and available capital. Everyone but Moore scored Nor-Gen lower on construction schedule, which was oddly weighted less than every other field but one.

As for financial capacity, everyone seemingly ignored the fact that much of Nor-Gen's proposal will not be financed by Nor-Gen. Thus, their personal financial capacity doesn't really mean much and the fact that they're relying on ABOR should have probably counted against them.

So, TLDR, I think the decision was flawed but at least Moore wasn't able to game it on his own.
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  #5105  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2014, 6:12 PM
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southtucsonboy77 southtucsonboy77 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Lyons View Post
The one saving grace, in my mind, is that Nor-Gen still would have won had Moore graded Peach the equivalent of the lowest legitimate vote cast and Nor-Gen the equivalent of the highest vote cast. In other words, had he scored Peach 700 and Nor-Gen 980, Nor-Gen still would have won. This still doesn't make me feel better about the project given the complete lack of financing for half of the proposed construction and the poor grading on the construction schedule.

If I'm Rio Nuevo, my priorities on this project are construction schedule and available capital. Everyone but Moore scored Nor-Gen lower on construction schedule, which was oddly weighted less than every other field but one.

As for financial capacity, everyone seemingly ignored the fact that much of Nor-Gen's proposal will not be financed by Nor-Gen. Thus, their personal financial capacity doesn't really mean much and the fact that they're relying on ABOR should have probably counted against them.

So, TLDR, I think the decision was flawed but at least Moore wasn't able to game it on his own.
Seeing dirt fly for the AC Marriot hotel will keep my mind off this fiasco for a while. (Of course, the timeline and cost is pending on the city procedural goof). Any status on that?
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  #5106  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2014, 7:08 PM
kaneui kaneui is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Lyons View Post
The one saving grace, in my mind, is that Nor-Gen still would have won had Moore graded Peach the equivalent of the lowest legitimate vote cast and Nor-Gen the equivalent of the highest vote cast. In other words, had he scored Peach 700 and Nor-Gen 980, Nor-Gen still would have won. This still doesn't make me feel better about the project given the complete lack of financing for half of the proposed construction and the poor grading on the construction schedule.

If I'm Rio Nuevo, my priorities on this project are construction schedule and available capital. Everyone but Moore scored Nor-Gen lower on construction schedule, which was oddly weighted less than every other field but one.

As for financial capacity, everyone seemingly ignored the fact that much of Nor-Gen's proposal will not be financed by Nor-Gen. Thus, their personal financial capacity doesn't really mean much and the fact that they're relying on ABOR should have probably counted against them.

So, TLDR, I think the decision was flawed but at least Moore wasn't able to game it on his own.
Both proposals for the arena site have their plusses and minuses, and any final design should include some fine-tuning and adjustments. However, I have my reservations that any of these small, local developers can pull off a project of this size ($100M+). Just witness what we have seen with Bourn, Gadsden, HSL (Hotel Arizona), and even Peach (they're still sitting on that big Broadway lot just south of The Cadence, even with the streetcar up and running; ditto for Gadsden and their empty lots in the Mercado District).

And I think it's rather telling that no large regional or national developers threw their hat into the ring on a project of this size. (Maybe the memory of what happened to Garfield Traub on the convention center hotel gave them pause, or how Williams & Dame promptly left town after realizing the byzantine problems they would face in dealing with the city on the One North Fifth project.)

Rio Nuevo will have to take a leap of faith that either one of these proposals can get built, although my money would be on Peach at this point. However, Mr. Moore should have no place on the Rio board, given his abuse of the board's rules and obvious inability to be reasonably objective with his scoring of the RFPs. It's behavior like his that will continue to push away quality developers from doing business here, as the city's reputation of being business unfriendly and the antics of the prior Rio Nuevo boards still hang over Tucson like a dark cloud.
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  #5107  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2014, 8:46 PM
Ted Lyons Ted Lyons is offline
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Originally Posted by kaneui View Post
Both proposals for the arena site have their plusses and minuses, and any final design should include some fine-tuning and adjustments. However, I have my reservations that any of these small, local developers can pull off a project of this size ($100M+). Just witness what we have seen with Bourn, Gadsden, HSL (Hotel Arizona), and even Peach (they're still sitting on that big Broadway lot just south of The Cadence, even with the streetcar up and running; ditto for Gadsden and their empty lots in the Mercado District).

And I think it's rather telling that no large regional or national developers threw their hat into the ring on a project of this size. (Maybe the memory of what happened to Garfield Traub on the convention center hotel gave them pause, or how Williams & Dame promptly left town after realizing the byzantine problems they would face in dealing with the city on the One North Fifth project.)

Rio Nuevo will have to take a leap of faith that either one of these proposals can get built, although my money would be on Peach at this point. However, Mr. Moore should have no place on the Rio board, given his abuse of the board's rules and obvious inability to be reasonably objective with his scoring of the RFPs. It's behavior like his that will continue to push away quality developers from doing business here, as the city's reputation of being business unfriendly and the antics of the prior Rio Nuevo boards still hang over Tucson like a dark cloud.
Well said.
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  #5108  
Old Posted Aug 23, 2014, 7:10 PM
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ComplotDesigner ComplotDesigner is offline
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McKale Renovation Update - 082314

Video here

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  #5109  
Old Posted Aug 26, 2014, 5:08 PM
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southtucsonboy77 southtucsonboy77 is offline
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I hope with the modern renovations and efficiency with space, the McKale Center can go back to hosting Round 2 and 3 (Rounds of 64 and 32) of the NCAA men's basketball tournament. Seating capacity was a slight knock a few years back, but the attendance was always above average. It's always good for tourism and econ development.

Too, I wonder if the renovated McKale Center can now host concerts? The Pan American Center (New Mexico State) in Las Cruces, for example, hosts a lot of concerts. Several years back Kanye West did a fantastic soldout concert at McKale.
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  #5110  
Old Posted Aug 27, 2014, 9:13 PM
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Old Main, The Center of Campus Restored

More images HERE.

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  #5111  
Old Posted Aug 27, 2014, 11:06 PM
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crzyabe crzyabe is offline
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So it looks like the Rio Nuevo board is moving forward with Nor Gen regardless of the controversy.

Rio Nuevo moves forward on hotel, housing project

It took me a little searching, but I found Nor Gen proposal to the board. I don’t know if it has been posted here before. It gives more insight into the plan. It still really comes down to whether or not they will get the funding to move forward.

Nor-Gen Proposal
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  #5112  
Old Posted Aug 28, 2014, 3:30 PM
Ted Lyons Ted Lyons is offline
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http://realestatedaily-news.com/rio-...ahead-gen-far/

Wow. This entire situation is shameful. I feel bad that the reputations of the other committee members (as they relate to their work for Rio Nuevo) will be dragged through the mud because of this moron's antics.
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  #5113  
Old Posted Aug 28, 2014, 7:09 PM
Azstar Azstar is offline
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Don't expect anything to be accomplished for decades, if ever. It's a sad fact that the low intelligence and ethical level of City Commission and some Rio Nuevo Board members has prevented any progress from taking place.
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