US News Global University Ranking: North America in the Top 100

[SIGSEGV]

That list also has UCSF tied with UChicago, which makes basically zero sense (yes UCSF is a really good medical school, but its research output is tiny compared to UChicago).

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I don't think these lists are biased to the coasts. They're biased to the Ivy League.

I agree these lists are totally biased. I mean, the University of Kentucky produces multiple first round picks in the NBA draft every year, including three No.1 picks in the past decade. That should merit some consideration on lists like these

[dave8721]

The ranking looks very different from USNews US universities ranking. For example they have University of Washington as the #8 in the world in their global ranking but only #58 in the US in their US ranking.

[pj3000]

List is proxy for:

Really Big Research Budgets with Lots of International Graduate Students


Some aren't even universities in the way we commonly think of what university is, and really shouldn't be ranked as such with those that are; i.e., Mount Sinai, Rockefeller

[suburbanite]

Based on the criteria surrounding citations you have to imagine being in an English speaking country is a huge advantage too. If publications are produced in English there's a much higher chance of them being cited in the vast English-speaking academic ecosystem, compared to say a Dutch paper on new cancer treatments. Not sure if that's accounted for.

[dimondpark]

Originally Posted by dave8721

The ranking looks very different from USNews US universities ranking. For example they have University of Washington as the #8 in the world in their global ranking but only #58 in the US in their US ranking.

Well the 2 rankings look at different things...

US News National Ranking Methodology:
Graduation and Retention Rates 22%
Undergraduate Academic Reputation 20%
Faculty Resources 20%
Financial Resources Per Student 10%
Graduation Rate Performance 8%
Selectivity for Fall Entering Class 7%
Graduate Indebtedness 5%
Social Mobility 5%
Alumni Giving Rate 3%

https://www.usnews.com/education/bes...d-the-rankings

US News Global Ranking Methodology:
Global Research Reputation 12.5%
Number of Publications that are among the 10% most cited
Regional Research Reputation 12.5%
Normalized Citation Impact 10%
Percentage of total publications that are among the 10% most cited
Total Citations 7.5%
Publications 10%
International Collaboration-relative to country 5%
Number of highly cited papers that are among the top %1 most cited in their respective field
Percentage of total publications that are among the top 1% most highly cited papers
Books 2.5%
Conferences 2.5%

https://www.usnews.com/education/bes...es/methodology

As you can see, the Natl Ranking focuses a lot more on student well being, which is important too, however the global ranking focuses entirely on academic reputation, peer review, citations, publications etc

[pj3000]

^ which is direct proxy for: who has the biggest research budgets and most international researchers

[mhays]

Some lists are also heavily influenced by university marketing departments and willingness to provide a ton of information. Some comply and put in a lot of effort, and others don't. Apparently US News is one of these lists.

[Nomad9]

As others have said, this is basically a list of research power. Not a useless metric by any means—any city would want a research powerhouse—but it shouldn’t be taken to mean the “best” universities from a teaching or prestige standpoint.

I graduated from two schools on this list: one in the top 50—a big public school—and another in the 400s—a relatively small private school with few graduate programs. Yet at least here in the US, most people would probably call the latter more prestigious.

[dimondpark]

Originally Posted by pj3000

^ which is direct proxy for: who has the biggest research budgets and most international researchers

Well, tbh I prefer rankings that focus on peer review, research and citations.

Here is the original US News ranking from 1983.
1 Stanford
2 Harvard
3 Yale
4 Princeton
5 UC-Berkeley
6 U of Chicago
7 Michigan-Ann Arbor
8 Cornell
8 Illinois-Urban-Champaign
10 MIT
10 Dartmouth

https://publicuniversityhonors.com/2...ies-1983-2007/

It was purely based on reputation and the results of a survey taken by university presidents.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by dimondpark

Well, tbh I prefer rankings that focus on peer review, research and citations.

Here is the original US News ranking from 1983.
1 Stanford
2 Harvard
3 Yale
4 Princeton
5 UC-Berkeley
6 U of Chicago
7 Michigan-Ann Arbor
8 Cornell
8 Illinois-Urban-Champaign
10 MIT
10 Dartmouth

https://publicuniversityhonors.com/2...ies-1983-2007/

It was purely based on reputation and the results of a survey taken by university presidents.

It's interesting that there were three public schools in the top 10. It's hard for a public school to get into the top 10 nowadays.

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by dimondpark

This was for something else, but I decided to share it here for whomever is interested, Merci.

US News' global ranking is much more reputation and peer review based then their domestic undergrad ranking, which adds an emphasis on class size, alumni giving and other peripheral criteria.

FYI The Overall Top 10 is as follows:
#1 Harvard University(USA)
#2 Massachusetts Institute of Technology(USA)
#3 Stanford University(USA)
#4 University of California-Berkeley(USA)
#5 Oxford University(UK)
#6 Columbia University(USA)
#7 California Institute of Technology(USA)
#8 University of Washington(USA)
#9 Cambridge University(UK)
#10 Johns Hopkins University(USA)

Interesting, so it would appear that Ivy League schools are actually overrated, considering there are more non-Ivy League schools, including two public schools, in the Top 10, than Ivy League schools. In fact, there are the same amount of public schools as there are Ivy League schools in the Top 10, one of which (UC Berkeley) ranks higher than all but one Ivy League school (Harvard).

Indeed, when you expand the list to the Top 100, there are only 6 Ivy League schools in the Top 100 vs 9 UCs.

[JManc]

Ivy League just means they are members of that athletic conference and over the years, "Ivy League" has come to be associated with a prestigious academic group that all others aspire to.

Stanford, Duke, MIT, CalTech etc all give them a run for their money.

[edale]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Interesting, so it would appear that Ivy League schools are actually overrated, considering there are more non-Ivy League schools, including two public schools, in the Top 10, than Ivy League schools. In fact, there are the same amount of public schools as there are Ivy League schools in the Top 10, one of which (UC Berkeley) ranks higher than all but one Ivy League school (Harvard).

Indeed, when you expand the list to the Top 100, there are only 6 Ivy League schools in the Top 100 vs 9 UCs.

I still think having Yale or Princeton on your resume gets you a lot further than UC Irvine or UC Santa Cruz. The benefit of attending an Ivy is as much about the alumni network and prestige as it is the quality of the education.

[Gresto]

What I always find insulting about these lists is how they consequently disparage faculty at what are regarded as "lesser" universities. Even taking into account Nobel nominations/wins, publications, etc., one can be a most gifted and beloved teacher, and that is disregarded in favour of these somewhat arbitrary variables. After all, isn't the principal function of a professor to teach and inspire his or her students with aplomb, mastery, and erudition? Research and publication should rightly be deemed secondary, but I reckon that's the only methodology that can be employed to enumerate the value of things that are not so cut and dried.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by edale

I still think having Yale or Princeton on your resume gets you a lot further than UC Irvine or UC Santa Cruz. The benefit of attending an Ivy is as much about the alumni network and prestige as it is the quality of the education.

Early on in your career, absolutely but once you gain experience, it matters less and less. I've met some highly successful people with degrees from local state schools and not so successful people from more prestigious universities. I had an ex-g/f who touted her UNC-Chapel Hill law degree all day long but never amounted to shit career wise.

[edale]

Originally Posted by JManc

Early on in your career, absolutely but once you gain experience, it matters less and less. I've met some highly successful people with degrees from local state schools and not so successful people from more prestigious universities. I had an ex-g/f who touted her UNC-Chapel Hill law degree all day long but never amounted to shit career wise.

For sure. Institutional pedigree and network connections help get you in the door for internships and first jobs, but those things matter less and less as your career advances. It's funny how this works across industries, too. I have a friend who's a writer for several shows, and she's commented a few times that there are a ton of Harvard grads in writing rooms, and they like to hire each other. I think about the Ivy League helping its graduates get in to finance jobs or gain admission to prestigious graduate programs, not writer rooms in Burbank

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by edale

I still think having Yale or Princeton on your resume gets you a lot further than UC Irvine or UC Santa Cruz. The benefit of attending an Ivy is as much about the alumni network and prestige as it is the quality of the education.

I've worked with Ivy League interns... some of them were the most obnoxious people.

Two in particular stand out, both from the "U of Penn."

If I were doing the hiring, the resumes of anyone from the U of Penn would be thrown in the trash.

[Shawn]

Originally Posted by pj3000

List is proxy for:

Really Big Research Budgets with Lots of International Graduate Students


Some aren't even universities in the way we commonly think of what university is, and really shouldn't be ranked as such with those that are; i.e., Mount Sinai, Rockefeller

Bingo, that's it.

I also see that their international efforts outside the English speaking world are more than half-assed. For example, my wife's and my alma mater wasn't even measured, even for the Japan Top 100. Which is surprising, given that the 2020 domestic Japanese rankings have my school as the #3 private university in the country. They missed 5-6 schools which Japanese rankings all have in the Top 20. My guess is that since these are liberal arts schools without massive STEM grad research programs, they're ignored.

[dc_denizen]

60%+ of people in the ivy's are there due to affirmative action, legacy, and athletics.

so much for our meritocracy.