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Originally Posted by CIA
NYGUY, you assume we're all here for the same reason.
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I don't assume anything. I only make my statements based on your own.
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I may like or dislike the design of a skyscraper, but there are many other factors at play:
1) I believe in reasonable historic preservation. The Drake Hotel had beautiful architecture of the pre war era along with a little bit of history. It should have been landmarked and preserved.
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That's arguable, but it didn't happen anyway, so let's move along.
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2) I support high density that adds to the vibrancy of a neighborhood. It may be subjective but the 495 hotel rooms squats to more diverse group of people in the neighborhood than 99 condo units.
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Were it somewhere else besides Manhattan,
maybe. And a very iffy maybe at that. You could demolish 10 buildings in the area, and the vibrancy would be the same. Nothing was lost, more is to be gained. People walked by that old hotel, and never gave it a second thought, because Manhattan is covered in such buildings. 432 Park will be one of the skyline markers, seen from around the City and out of it. People will look up at it because it will be one of the wonders of the skyline, same as the original World Trade towers. In that regard, yes, this building brings
much more to the area. It's safe to say that if the Drake Hotel still stood today, and there was a thread on the building, we
might generate a page of posts. That's also iffy. Because, frankly, no one cared about it, as is usually the case.
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3) In the case of demolition, what is to be built should be better than what it replaced. I suppose this to can be subjective.
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Yes, it is. We're back to your judgment of the design, which is ok. But it is what is is,
your judgement.
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Many cities in China right now are so gung ho to build skyscrapers that there is a rush to demolish anything seen as old and inefficient.
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This isn't China.
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Lastly, I don't appreciate being referred to as a moron for sharing a difference of opinion. It was indirect, but disappointing language from a moderator. I thought was a good forum to discuss highrises and cities, but I see some issues I may have here.
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No one called you a moron. The only issue you have is that you can't have a disagreement with someone. Your points were "heard" and answered. Not everyone will agree on everything. What more you want, I don't know. But if your sensibilities are such that you are offended by a simple disagreement, then perhaps you should not be engaging at all.
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Originally Posted by photoLith
Dont ever say historic buildings are dispensable, thats how they become rare, people think theres so many so lets keep tearing them down and before you know it, youve lost a huge amount of history.
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This isn't the 60's, the City is not hell bent on some massive urban renewal program. This is New York City. It's well noted for it's density and lack of open spaces, both of which make it the city we know and love. It's also a thriving, growing, and living city, that will continue to renew itself. And to build in this great metropolis, sometimes something else is going to have to give. That's just a fact. Let's all understand this,
simply being old does not making something landmark worthy. Especially a city covered in the old.
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Originally Posted by M. Incandenza
Yes - Midtown is super boring at night and on weekends! What if every office building had ten floors dedicated to residences? It would be a vibrant residential neighborhood in addition to being a CBD. I think that would be pretty cool.
And there is absolutely nothing "moronic" about worrying that this building, despite being a billion feet tall, actually reduces density:
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Oh, you people....
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Originally Posted by Crawford
landmarking does nothing to preserve the 500 hotel rooms. That's a totally different issue.
If, in some alternate universe, the Drake had been landmarked, and 432 Park built somewhere else, you would still lose the hotel rooms from the Drake.
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Especially with the way the pricing is going in the neighborhood.
The bottom line is this: The Drake Hotel is gone. But so are many other buildings that existed, and guess what folks? New York City still lives, bigger now than ever before!
Now, if folks want to criticize the design of the building, because the Drake was
demolished, that's irrational, to put it politely. As I said before, you can most certainly hate the design of this tower, as I'm sure many do. But you cannot justify it by simply saying it replaced a "greater" building. Because that then tells me if you thought a tower of
superior design was being built as a replacement, then you're ok with it. And that makes you a hypocrite. So please stop it.
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