Let's talk about one-way streets

[Innsertnamehere]

removing the narrow lanes will be nice as well, I'm always worried I'm about to get sideswiped whenever I drive on Main.

[TheRitsman]

I'm a bit disappointed about the widening of the lanes. I like to see lanes at the legal minimum since they encourage drivers to drive more slowly usually.

[catcher_of_cats]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

removing the narrow lanes will be nice as well, I'm always worried I'm about to get sideswiped whenever I drive on Main.

I was sideswiped once on Main West and so was my wife. Seeing Main St as a normalized street in which bad drivers who currently will commit a left hand turn from the center lane and cut across two other lanes of live traffic without looking will finally be a thing of the past.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by catcher_of_cats

I was sideswiped once on Main West and so was my wife. Seeing Main St as a normalized street in which bad drivers who currently will commit a left hand turn from the center lane and cut across two other lanes of live traffic without looking will finally be a thing of the past.

yes, exactly.

Narrow lanes are good to a certain extent, but below a certain width and they start vastly increasing accident risk between cars. Main already has some of the narrowest lanes in the province, and it's clearly not doing a whole ton for speeds and safety.

definitely ensure the lanes are 3 metre lanes and not wider, but right now they are only 2.7 or 2.8 metres wide which is simply way too narrow for people to safely drive on.

The lane removals, curbside parking, and signal timing changes should do a much better job of lowering speeds. Main will likely look more like Toronto's Adelaide and Richmond streets soon, which don't have speeding issues at all.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by catcher_of_cats

I was sideswiped once on Main West and so was my wife. Seeing Main St as a normalized street in which bad drivers who currently will commit a left hand turn from the center lane and cut across two other lanes of live traffic without looking will finally be a thing of the past.

We've avoided that but barely. Just the other day a guy kept crossing over the lane marker in front of me, and looked bewildered when I used my horn and then passed him before he could do it again. No road rage or anything, I usually just shake my head now at stuff like that.

Wider lanes may not help his ilk, but they will make the trip less tense.

And for those who feel this will all cause huge traffic jams, Main is very much given to feast and famine use... bunches of cars interspersed with vast emptiness. A more even flow would serve the same level of traffic.

I do expect the Paradise to Dundurn stretch to remain one-way for now, given the 403 ramp issue, so there will probably be congestion west of Dundurn as cars merge from 5 lanes to 2. But the left lane can be reserved for lefts onto Dundurn, and maybe the right one can become a dedicated right turn lane onto Dundurn south. It will be interesting to see how it's designed.

[Crapht]

I’m not sure narrow lanes actually slow people down. This city is full of horrible drivers. If you drive from Macklin to Ottawa st along Main st doing the limit of 50 kms/hr most cars will pass you. Many people refuse to use indicators for changing lanes or turning. I’m hoping for the best in this Main st conversion but I’m sceptical. There needs to be a culture change and right now car culture dominates.

[TheRitsman]

There have been numerous studies into this. 10ft (3m) lanes are safer, reduce vehicle speeds when paired with other road design elements and do not significantly impact traffic. Much of Hamilton's lanes are the older 12ft (3.5-3.6m) lanes that use up a lot of road space and lead to more speeding, and more severe accidents.

Intuition and anecdotes tell people wider is better but actually empirical evidence favours narrower lanes.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...plenty-of-cars

[Crapht]

But that’s what I mean. The 3 middle lanes on Main st between Dundurn and Queen are 10 feet in width. The curb lanes are wider. People continue to drive aggressively on Main st.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by Crapht

But that’s what I mean. The 3 middle lanes on Main st between Dundurn and Queen are 10 feet in width. The curb lanes are wider. People continue to drive aggressively on Main st.

The lanes are actually narrower, which is the problem. Most of Main has 3m lanes, which is the Canadian equivalent to 10ft lanes but are actually slightly smaller (~9'10"), but parts of the corridor have 2.9 metre lanes, which are substantially smaller (~9'6"). Those are the problematic ones for sideswiping. A tractor trailer or bus is 8'6" wide for example, which means these trucks / buses have only 6 inches of space on either side of them when driving. It creates huge sideswiping issues.

What the Spec article mentioned was that the entire corridor would brought to the 3m standard, which is generally considered the minimum safe lane width.

It's not that narrower lanes don't slow vehicles, it's that at a certain point lanes which are too narrow become a risk for causing vehicles to crash as it becomes too difficult for larger vehicles to not stray from them. I don't think anybody is asking for 3.5m or 3.75m lanes here, which is the standard lane width on a freeway, for example.

The truck route changes will also make a huge difference in the pedestrian experience of Main just by itself of course - and should help with traffic with the lane drop anyway as it will remove a substantial number of slower, more cumbersome vehicles from the road.

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by catcher_of_cats

I was sideswiped once on Main West and so was my wife. Seeing Main St as a normalized street in which bad drivers who currently will commit a left hand turn from the center lane and cut across two other lanes of live traffic without looking will finally be a thing of the past.

Some poor girl did that in front of me on King a couple years ago. Nothing I could do but honk and brake... luckily she was the one who came off much worse in terms of damage, I basically got half a free paint job, she needed an entire new front end. No injuries, which was lucky because she basically put her drivers door in front of my truck.

I'll admit I mostly only ever use Main to get from the 403 to the otherside of downtown, and don't hate the warp-speed green wave in terms of getting me there. But of course taking 5 minutes longer is nothing if it can mean more pleasant streets for everyone. Hopefully some effort at beautification goes along with the redesign, trees and flowers would really brighten up some stretches.

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by Crapht

I’m not sure narrow lanes actually slow people down. This city is full of horrible drivers. If you drive from Macklin to Ottawa st along Main st doing the limit of 50 kms/hr most cars will pass you. Many people refuse to use indicators for changing lanes or turning. I’m hoping for the best in this Main st conversion but I’m sceptical. There needs to be a culture change and right now car culture dominates.

They'll pass you, hit the red light and then watch you cruise by as you hit the perfectly timed green.... only to wash rinse repeat at the next light

[Innsertnamehere]

Yup. Honestly don’t understand why people speed on Main as it literally gets them nowhere.

I do find that most people do pretty close to the speed limit, generally speaking though.

[SteelTown]

https://twitter.com/cityofhamilton/s...59139448508419

[SteelTown]

City begins work to reduce Main Street to 4 lanes, adding a bus lane on Monday
These lane reductions are expected to be finished by Aug. 19
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...q7IIVIjMT2oIJ8

Starting Monday, crews will begin overnight work to reduce Main Street from five lanes to four and will also add a bus lane, a pedestrian buffer on the south lane, and bump outs.

The changes will see Main Street reduced from five lanes to four and will also add a bus lane, a pedestrian buffer on the south lane, and bump outs.

In a news release, the city said "this measure will help reduce the number of side-swipe collisions throughout the corridor due to narrow lane widths."

The lane reduction is part of the beginning stages to convert the road from a one-way into a two-way street, which was approved by city council in May.

These lane reductions are expected to be finished by Friday, Aug. 19.

In late July, the city also began implementing other changes on Main Street, with various "No Turn on Red" signs going up throughout the road.

Other changes along Main and King streets have also included pedestrian countdown signals and ladder crossings.

Hamilton has been grappling with several collisions in recent times, some of which have resulted in the deaths of 11 pedestrians and one cyclist this year.

[mikevbar1]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

City begins work to reduce Main Street to 4 lanes, adding a bus lane on Monday
These lane reductions are expected to be finished by Aug. 19
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...q7IIVIjMT2oIJ8

Starting Monday, crews will begin overnight work to reduce Main Street from five lanes to four and will also add a bus lane, a pedestrian buffer on the south lane, and bump outs.

The changes will see Main Street reduced from five lanes to four and will also add a bus lane, a pedestrian buffer on the south lane, and bump outs.

In a news release, the city said "this measure will help reduce the number of side-swipe collisions throughout the corridor due to narrow lane widths."

The lane reduction is part of the beginning stages to convert the road from a one-way into a two-way street, which was approved by city council in May.

These lane reductions are expected to be finished by Friday, Aug. 19.

In late July, the city also began implementing other changes on Main Street, with various "No Turn on Red" signs going up throughout the road.

Other changes along Main and King streets have also included pedestrian countdown signals and ladder crossings.

Hamilton has been grappling with several collisions in recent times, some of which have resulted in the deaths of 11 pedestrians and one cyclist this year.

Had a friend share this with me yesterday. I thought it was 3-4 lanes +1-2 traffic lanes? Where’d the bus lane come from, and is it one of the “4” lanes or is it actually replacing the fifth?

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by mikevbar1

Had a friend share this with me yesterday. I thought it was 3-4 lanes +1-2 traffic lanes? Where’d the bus lane come from, and is it one of the “4” lanes or is it actually replacing the fifth?

If they're adding bump-outs and a buffer there's not enough room to include 4 general purpose lanes plus a bus lane. So it will probably be 3 GPLs and the one reserved for buses.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by mikevbar1

Had a friend share this with me yesterday. I thought it was 3-4 lanes +1-2 traffic lanes? Where’d the bus lane come from, and is it one of the “4” lanes or is it actually replacing the fifth?

The bus lane is only like a block long close to the bus terminal. The Hamilton Spectator article on it explains it better.

It will be 4 lanes instead of the current 5, with curbside parking on one side. For the block with the bus lane, I imagine the 5-lane cross section will be retained for the one block with one being a bus lane, but I'm not sure.

[SteelTown]

Hamilton installs transit signal, bus lane on Main Street. Here’s what it means

https://www.insauga.com/hamilton-ins...6iHawiu_03cyBg

The summer revamping of one of Hamilton’s most dangerous streets continued this week with the overnight installation of a transit priority signal and designated bus-only lane.


The changes at Main and MacNab St. are intended to enhance safety ahead of the full one-way to a two-way street conversion.

The city began implementing “quick changes” to Main last week.

The transit priority signal is a light with a white vertical bar on a black background that allows transit buses to cross an intersection before other traffic. Only public-transit buses may proceed when the transit priority signal is shown, and all other vehicles must remain stopped.


Effective Friday (Aug. 18), this signal will be in place to help ease traffic flow, reduce the chance of collision, and allow transit buses to safely merge into the intersection ahead of other vehicles.

Additionally, “Bus Only” pavement markings are being added to an 85-metre section of Main between MacNab and City Hall that allows transit buses to safely pull over to pick up passengers and prepare to enter the Main and MacNab intersection when the transit priority signal is activated.

“Motorists looking to turn right on MacNab Street from Main Street are advised that the new right turn lane is located beside the bus-only lane,” issued the city. “Right turns are only permitted once the traffic signal has turned green. Motorists must remain stopped until the Transit Priority Signal turns off and the traffic light turns green. Pedestrians are also given priority at this intersection by way of a leading pedestrian interval.”



Hamilton city council passed a motion last May to convert Main, which has a disproportionately higher accident rate than other streets. Overall, the city had just reached double-digit pedestrian deaths within a few months when Hamilton typically averages around four per year.

[HamiltonBoyInToronto]

What a waste of money !!!! Just focus on the conversion of main to 2 way traffic and leave all this BS alone ... either they are doing this to postpone the conversion OR the mob is still in control of all city works and is making a killing on all this unnecessary extra work

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by HamiltonBoyInToronto

What a waste of money !!!! Just focus on the conversion of main to 2 way traffic and leave all this BS alone ... either they are doing this to postpone the conversion OR the mob is still in control of all city works and is making a killing on all this unnecessary extra work

When we protested at City Hall, we demanded immediate changes to improve safety. I doubt you'd so comfortably repeat this comment at the grieving families of the maimed and murdered at the hand of this street.

Why do you decide what someone's life is worth? If anything, I don't think this is far enough before full two way conversion. Conversion could take 2 or 3 years. At the pace Hamilton's streets are going well see another 30 deaths from car drivers, and at least 5 of those on Main.

Waste of money? That couldn't be further from the truth, this is one of the smartest uses of money Hamilton has done in a long fucking time.