Broadway facilitates cross town trips, but it's functionally a radial, since Central Broadway would be effectively part of the Downtown but for our downtown being defined by waterbodies rather than job concentrations. It's strength is that it connects to a lot of jobs in the centre of the region, rather than that people can make quicker transfer to the airport which is much more of a marginal use.
Now, it's true, you can't just build radial lines, but basically any region that's worth bothering with heavy transit is going to have an urban structure that draws a lot of people to a given point. Almost all rapid transit systems are, at the regional level, mostly radial, and while they may form something of a net through the very centre of the region, they're strongly biased towards the center. Most of the time those circumferentials get filled in with buses since they're lower demand, but particularly strong ones may warrant heavier investment. I just caution that this might not be the case. If you over invest in circumferential transit, you end up with the crushloads of the Yonge Subway
Gonna point out that only a tenth of Canada Line riders go to Sea Island - most trips are between City Centre and Bridgeport (i.e. if there's a transfer, it's to/from a "circumferential" line). And the Canada itself is nowhere near maximum capacity.
More to the point, in a semi-multipolar city like Metro Vancouver, circumferential and radial lines are often the same thing. Plenty of traffic is going directly between UBC/Oakridge/Joyce/Metrotown themselves, so the Sheppard Line isn't really analogous.
AFAIK the problem with Sheppard is being a line to nowhere - hook it up to the busier end of Yonge-University, and it becomes twice as useful.
Likewise, a 41st line would need to be anchored by both the Canada and the Expo; of course it's going to fail if it only goes from Kerrisdale to Oakridge.
I'd question whether we actually need more radials; East, SE and South are covered, and North/NE and West are in progress. Sounds like all that's left IS circumferential lines (that, or extending what we already have).
Just wanna point out that 1) Sheppard is connected to the *much* busier Yonge leg (line carries more passengers than SkyTrain every day), it actually has decent ridership given just how short it is and the fact that it only connects to the rest of the network in one place.
Yup, that's what I was getting at (though I was under the impression that University was the busy half): TTC needs to extend it at least to Sheppard West - possibly Scarborough - to see any use from it.
For what it's worth, I'd been sketching something like this for a while:
red being streetcar in the distant future, contingent on lots of upzoning
Mainly using the north shore line as an excuse to better serve the West End
One station in West Point Grey mainly serving the Jericho lands rather then relying on drastic changes to Sasamat village
For what it's worth, I'd been sketching something like this for a while:
By my calculations based on what I read off Google Earth the grade on Lower Lonsdale is over 8% (rises by 60m over a distance of 720m between Esplanade and Keith Rd W). That's too steep even for SkyTrain's LIM technology, which has a maximum grade of 6%.
By my calculations based on what I read off Google Earth the grade on Lower Lonsdale is over 8% (rises by 60m over a distance of 720m between Esplanade and Keith Rd W). That's too steep even for SkyTrain's LIM technology, which has a maximum grade of 6%.
I think your calculations are correct. I think that's why I doubt it will try to reach the Quay and go up to the central part of Lonsdale. But I want to see where they try to stick a guideway on Marine Drive..
I think that anything on the North Shore is going to be mostly underground on an E-W corridor just due to the geographical limitations; and the NIMBYs that will come out of the woodwork just to oppose its existence .
__________________
There is a housing crisis, and we simply need to speak up about it.
Pinterest - I use this social media platform to easily add pictures into my posts on this forum. Plus there are great architecture and city photos out there as well.
By my calculations based on what I read off Google Earth the grade on Lower Lonsdale is over 8% (rises by 60m over a distance of 720m between Esplanade and Keith Rd W). That's too steep even for SkyTrain's LIM technology, which has a maximum grade of 6%.
Would trams or cablecars do It? Lisbon uses them to get up steep hills, and everyone knows about San Francisco.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scryer
I think that anything on the North Shore is going to be mostly underground on an E-W corridor just due to the geographical limitations; and the NIMBYs that will come out of the woodwork just to oppose its existence .
Often the NIMBYs protest stuff for the sake of protesting, it seems. "We've got ours, it's our 'hood, so 'GIT!" often seems a Pavlovian response to try and keep the city as it ws in 1970.
By my calculations based on what I read off Google Earth the grade on Lower Lonsdale is over 8% (rises by 60m over a distance of 720m between Esplanade and Keith Rd W). That's too steep even for SkyTrain's LIM technology, which has a maximum grade of 6%.
Not that bad if SkyTrain stays on 3rd then turn on Lonsdale with a slightly deep underground station just south of 13th.
I think that anything on the North Shore is going to be mostly underground on an E-W corridor just due to the geographical limitations; and the NIMBYs that will come out of the woodwork just to oppose its existence .
What's the ground quality like - is it good for an underground line? I don't know the North Shore very well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trofirhen
Often the NIMBYs protest stuff for the sake of protesting, it seems. "We've got ours, it's our 'hood, so 'GIT!" often seems a Pavlovian response to try and keep the city as it ws in 1970.
People need their hobbies...
I've found with some older people if I talk to them about stuff when it's in the planning stage then it's not so shocking to them when construction starts - they've had time to get used to change coming instead of feeling like something was suddenly foisted on them.
What's the ground quality like - is it good for an underground line? I don't know the North Shore very well.
TBH, I'm not sure myself . I was just going off of speculating how dense and built up the North Shore already is from Phibbs Exchange to West Van. Just from my unscientific speculation, it would probably look a little crazy trying to do elevated rail .
__________________
There is a housing crisis, and we simply need to speak up about it.
Pinterest - I use this social media platform to easily add pictures into my posts on this forum. Plus there are great architecture and city photos out there as well.
TBH, I'm not sure myself . I was just going off of speculating how dense and built up the North Shore already is from Phibbs Exchange to West Van. Just from my unscientific speculation, it would probably look a little crazy trying to do elevated rail .
Trying to cut/cover through Marine Drive will be fun.
A Lonsdale -> Park and Tilford segment could be elevated if you need it to be...
Yes, true, but I think it would be noticeably ugly, unless built directly over the railway tracks (which are pretty ugly too, although I doubt they're going anywhere)
Yes, true, but I think it would be noticeably ugly, unless built directly over the railway tracks (which are pretty ugly too, although I doubt they're going anywhere)
Difficult to build an elevated line over the railway tracks between Chesterfield and St. George where they go underneath the ICBC headquarters building and all the new development east of Lonsdale Quay...
I think that anything on the North Shore is going to be mostly underground on an E-W corridor just due to the geographical limitations; and the NIMBYs that will come out of the woodwork just to oppose its existence .
The Burrard inlet crossing study implies poor conditions for bored tunnels on the north shore around Park Royal, Mosquitto Creek and again to the east around Lynn creek and the Seymour River. Here's what they had to say about the proposed park royal tunnel portal:
Quote:
To minimize risk in this challenging ground, the tunnel would be declined as steeply as possible to reduce the length of excavation (and potential ground improvement) within this Salish unit.
Tunneling conditions around Lonsdale are better as that area is glacial sediment rather than alluvial sediment.
Difficult to build an elevated line over the railway tracks between Chesterfield and St. George where they go underneath the ICBC headquarters building and all the new development east of Lonsdale Quay...
^ Yes, I thought of that after posting, in fact. Would it be possible to take the transit tracks underegound at that point also? I know that's asking a lot, but it might work, mightn't it?t
^ Yes, I thought of that after posting, in fact. Would it be possible to take the transit tracks underegound at that point also? I know that's asking a lot, but it might work, mightn't it?t
But I mean at that point you are jacking up the price tag of the project making it even that much more unfeasible.
Prev
.
. I was just going off of speculating how dense and built up the North Shore already is from Phibbs Exchange to West Van. Just from my unscientific speculation, it would probably look a little crazy trying to do elevated rail 
Linear Mode
