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CityGuy87 · #**7801** Posted **Aug 11, 2015, 8:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10023

To get rid of the last actual neighborhood in Midtown? I'd rather keep the 19th century housing stock.

It's not that great of a neighborhood (what's special about it? Other than dumpy lowrises?) and besides, the density of midtown needs to be better balanced and expanded to the west side. Hudson Yards is an incredible project, but we should have further development that goes north of 42nd street and west of 8th Ave.

Pete8680 · #**7802** Posted **Aug 11, 2015, 8:34 PM**

Why do we just move all the old buildings upstate 2 make the preservationists happy? Henry Ford moved dozens of old buildings 2 Dearborn Michigan.

CityGuy87 · #**7803** Posted **Aug 11, 2015, 8:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete8680

Why do we just move all the old buildings upstate 2 make the preservationists happy? Henry Ford moved dozens of old buildings 2 Dearborn Michigan.

That sounds like an idea Patrick from Spongebob would come up with lol

Cynicism · #**7804** Posted **Aug 12, 2015, 3:40 AM**

.

kznyc2k · #**7805** Posted **Aug 12, 2015, 4:52 AM**

Crawford · #**7806** Posted **Aug 12, 2015, 4:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynicism

Agreed. That neighborhood has quite a charm to it and should never be rezoned to allow taller buildings that block air and sunlight. The commercial corridor of 9th avenue is great -- restaurants/bars/lively atmosphere/etc..

The same cannot be said of 8th avenue just one block away. All those block long buildings have created a windswept, dead, "neighborhood" shortly after 9PM. Most of the retail space is occupied by banks and never-heard-of-it restaurants. Case in point- A new TD will open on a (new?) building on 8th ave. Mind you there are five other banks within a ten block radius...

8th Ave. is vastly busier than 9th Ave., morning, noon and night. I mean, multiples busier. Tons more pedestrians and tons more retail/restaurants.

Your observations are consistently wrong, basically always. Like opposite-land wrong.

sbarn · #**7807** Posted **Aug 12, 2015, 4:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crawford

8th Ave. is vastly busier than 9th Ave., morning, noon and night. I mean, multiples busier. Tons more pedestrians and tons more retail/restaurants.

Your observations are consistently wrong, basically always. Like opposite-land wrong.

Calling 8th Avenue "windswept" is total hyperbole, however I disagree that 8th Avenue has more retail/restaurants. From my experience, 9th Avenue has far more restaurants/bars than 8th Avenue and it functions as the "main street" of the Hells Kitchen neighborhood. It is possible that 8th Avenue has more pedestrian traffic than 9th Avenue since its closer to Midtown but not by "multiples".

streetscaper · #**7808** Posted **Aug 12, 2015, 5:00 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbarn

Calling 8th Avenue "windswept" is total hyperbole, however I disagree that 8th Avenue has more retail/restaurants. From my experience, 9th Avenue has far more restaurants/bars than 8th Avenue and it functions as the "main street" of the Hells Kitchen neighborhood. It is possible that 8th Avenue has more pedestrian traffic than 9th Avenue since its closer to Midtown but not by "multiples".

This is correct!

chris08876 · #**7809** Posted **Aug 17, 2015, 11:34 PM**

Long Island City - ringside seats by Nick Parmar, on Flickr

10023 · #**7810** Posted **Aug 18, 2015, 6:58 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CityGuy87

It's not that great of a neighborhood (what's special about it? Other than dumpy lowrises?) and besides, the density of midtown needs to be better balanced and expanded to the west side. Hudson Yards is an incredible project, but we should have further development that goes north of 42nd street and west of 8th Ave.

Why does Midtown need to be "balanced"? It's not a seesaw and cities don't work better from a functional perspective if they're symmetrical.

New York needs a congestion charge (like London) to reduce traffic, and then it needs better crosstown transportation and to focus density around the two main rail terminals (one of which needs to be completely rebuilt from scratch).

There's no inherent reason to replace Hell's Kitchen with a bunch of office buildings. Those lowrises have more potential if the neighborhood continues to gentrify than anything built in a post-ADA world.

phoenixboi08 · #**7811** Posted **Aug 18, 2015, 5:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10023

Why does Midtown need to be "balanced"? It's not a seesaw and cities don't work better from a functional perspective if they're symmetrical.

New York needs a congestion charge (like London) to reduce traffic, and then it needs better crosstown transportation and to focus density around the two main rail terminals (one of which needs to be completely rebuilt from scratch).

+1

...they also need to get ride of on-street parking, and put buses (and cyclists) in dedicated lanes.

CityGuy87 · #**7812** Posted **Aug 18, 2015, 6:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10023

Why does Midtown need to be "balanced"? It's not a seesaw and cities don't work better from a functional perspective if they're symmetrical.

New York needs a congestion charge (like London) to reduce traffic, and then it needs better crosstown transportation and to focus density around the two main rail terminals (one of which needs to be completely rebuilt from scratch).

There's no inherent reason to replace Hell's Kitchen with a bunch of office buildings. Those lowrises have more potential if the neighborhood continues to gentrify than anything built in a post-ADA world.

Even though we're getting off topic, I will just say one more thing on the matter, eventually it will have the be rezoned if Midtown Manhattan needs to keep up with demand for office space and housing. Manhattan is not that big of an island, so after Billionaire's Row, Hudson Yards, Midtown East and WTC/Financial District, where else can Manhattan be redeveloped? While the area around Penn Station seems posed for a redevelopment in the not-so-distant future, there's gotta be other neighborhoods and Hell's Kitchen/Clinton seems obvious since it's part of Midtown and I imagine you'd have a lot more difficulty trying to rezone an area such as the Upper East Side.

chris08876 · #**7813** Posted **Aug 18, 2015, 7:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CityGuy87

Even though we're getting off topic, I will just say one more thing on the matter, eventually it will have the be rezoned if Midtown Manhattan needs to keep up with demand for office space and housing. Manhattan is not that big of an island, so after Billionaire's Row, Hudson Yards, Midtown East and WTC/Financial District, where else can Manhattan be redeveloped? While the area around Penn Station seems posed for a redevelopment in the not-so-distant future, there's gotta be other neighborhoods and Hell's Kitchen/Clinton seems obvious since it's part of Midtown and I imagine you'd have a lot more difficulty trying to rezone an area such as the Upper East Side.

I think the future of the city will not be Manhattan but the neighborhoods right next to the East River in Queens/Brooklyn. Places like Green point, Williamsburg, DoBro, LIC, and Fort Greene. What the city needs to do is focus on overhauling its transit. Manhattan needs to spill over East. Plenty of land to build on for residential, commercial, and so on.

Manhattan will see taller and bulkier developments as land becomes even more scarce (taller than what we are currently seeing), but with rising prices, developers will rush to these neighborhoods. JC could be a good candidate, and even Newark, but if we are talking NYC, than these are ideal places.

What will hold it back is transit. Overhaul transit, and the city will grow much quicker, and be able to accommodate the new density of these neighborhoods. Its happening too. What we are seeing with LIC and Dobro, the transferring of employees from various companies to the outer boroughs.