Bank Street: a redevelopment thought

[eternallyme]

I always wondered how easy (or difficult) it would be to redevelop the middle and lower sections of Bank Street (from, say, Billings Bridge to Blossom Park) into a mainstreet like sections farther up Bank closer to downtown. My conclusion is that it is not hard at all.

Billings Bridge to Kilborn

The Riverside-Bank intersection is one that needs work. IMO, Riverside SB should be shifted to an adjacent alignment with the current NB side (the abandoned Harvey's would be gone, as would two businesses which could easily relocate). The presence of businesses in the Billings Bridge area do act as hinderances, but some redevelopment is possible, especially in the land reclaimed after Riverside is realigned (the rest becomes parkland). The hill beyond the Transitway cannot be improved, however.

Kilborn to Walkley Yards overpass

Prime for redevelopment IMO. For the most part, these are early post-war commercial developments, and many of the buildings are in poor condition. Numerous open lots also exist, as well as near-fronting buildings (i.e. fronted by one row of parking).

Between Heron and Walkley, there are a large number of Arab-oriented businesses. If it weren't for the fact that it would potentially create controversy (from NIMBY's who associate most or all Arabs to terrorism), this would be a prime area for a Arabian-themed BIA, much like Little Italy and Chinatown. BIAs should be set up for the areas, perhaps an Arabian one in the middle, with additional ones for the Kilborn-Heron and Walkley-overpass sections.

Walkley Yards overpass to Hunt Club

Probably the toughest section and probably impossible. Bank has a suburban design here that is difficult to overcome with the severely segregated South Keys shopping area to the west and reverse-frontage residential to the east. While densities are high to the east, they run close to Bank, fronted in reverse. It would be quite wasteful to build-in South Keys here with such a design. In the ultimate Bank Street design, this would be a break in the mainstreet - it should (briefly) remain a 60 km/h suburban arterial for about 1.5 km.

Hunt Club to Queensdale

Old Blossom Park would be another prime redevelopment area, which could be something like the Westboro of the south end. This section has many open and abandoned lots and wasteful uses (like car dealers) that could be purchased and redeveloped. Most Bank-fronting residential buildings are old, in poor condition and with large lots from the Highway 31 days. The cemetary does act as a hinderance, however, but it might be possible to build small-scale in front. An Old Blossom Park BIA should be set up.

[McC]

Harvey's has a sign up saying they will be reopening soon. In any event, I think that all three of the old gas stations at Riverside and Bank (1 of which is still in operation) would be great to redevelop with some tall apartment buildings with retail on the ground. The old Billings PetroCan would be especially good for a seniors residence with varying levels of care, could be integrate right into the shopping centre with a carriageway-like second level above the Bank St entrance connecting from the new building to the shopping centre.

[lrt's friend]

Hunt Club to Queensdale

Old Blossom Park would be another prime redevelopment area, which could be something like the Westboro of the south end. This section has many open and abandoned lots and wasteful uses (like car dealers) that could be purchased and redeveloped. Most Bank-fronting residential buildings are old, in poor condition and with large lots from the Highway 31 days. The cemetary does act as a hinderance, however, but it might be possible to build small-scale in front. An Old Blossom Park BIA should be set up.

It will never happen. Bank Street was built as a 'highway' here and too much of the area has residential property backing onto Bank Street, in addition to the cemeteries already mentioned. There is simply not enough population and population density and the Greenbelt is too close by to recreate Westboro here. The limited retail base barely survives because of the much larger retail area at South Keys.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

It will never happen. Bank Street was built as a 'highway' here and too much of the area has residential property backing onto Bank Street, in addition to the cemeteries already mentioned. There is simply not enough population and population density and the Greenbelt is too close by to recreate Westboro here. The limited retail base barely survives because of the much larger retail area at South Keys.

One advantage DOES exist: there is NO large regional shopping mall in the south end of Ottawa (Billings Bridge doesn't count). Since they can be attracted to outside areas, maybe their south-end versions can all fit in Old Blossom Park, especially if the Leitrim and Riverside South areas grow.

Richmond Road was also built as a highway in the west end (Highway 15).

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

One advantage DOES exist: there is NO large regional shopping mall in the south end of Ottawa (Billings Bridge doesn't count). Since they can be attracted to outside areas, maybe their south-end versions can all fit in Old Blossom Park, especially if the Leitrim and Riverside South areas grow.

Richmond Road was also built as a highway in the west end (Highway 15).

Yes, Richmond Road was a highway at one time but there is a big difference. Westboro was established before cars were popular, it was part of the streetcar suburbs and Richmond Road ceased to be a highway before it was widened.

None of this applies to Bank Street in Blossom Park.

Also, retail trends have changed dramatically in the south end. Blossom Park was originally the retail centre for the south end. This changed when Hunt Club Road became a major arterial and South Keys was chosen as the site of the Regional Shopping Centre. Eventhough, South Keys is a big box shopping centre, it is a large shopping area. Will we ever again see another indoor mall built in Ottawa? There was a plan to build the regional shopping centre further south and really at the time, it was a Gloucester versus Ottawa battle. That was settled in the late 1970s or early 1980s. It will be difficult to recreate a main street retail environment in an already established residential area especially with the problems that I listed in my previous post. It will be very difficult to get a critical mass going, and the density is too low to support walk-in retail. Most of Blossom Park's density is located in the northwest corner adjacent to South Keys Shopping Centre. There is poor pedestrian access from there to more southerly parts of Bank Street. Those cemeteries are indeed a major impediment for success of something like this.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Yes, Richmond Road was a highway at one time but there is a big difference. Westboro was established before cars were popular, it was part of the streetcar suburbs and Richmond Road ceased to be a highway before it was widened.

None of this applies to Bank Street in Blossom Park.

Also, retail trends have changed dramatically in the south end. Blossom Park was originally the retail centre for the south end. This changed when Hunt Club Road became a major arterial and South Keys was chosen as the site of the Regional Shopping Centre. Eventhough, South Keys is a big box shopping centre, it is a large shopping area. Will we ever again see another indoor mall built in Ottawa? There was a plan to build the regional shopping centre further south and really at the time, it was a Gloucester versus Ottawa battle. That was settled in the late 1970s or early 1980s. It will be difficult to recreate a main street retail environment in an already established residential area especially with the problems that I listed in my previous post. It will be very difficult to get a critical mass going, and the density is too low to support walk-in retail. Most of Blossom Park's density is located in the northwest corner adjacent to South Keys Shopping Centre. There is poor pedestrian access from there to more southerly parts of Bank Street. Those cemeteries are indeed a major impediment for success of something like this.

I doubt there will ever be another indoor mall in Ottawa, even if one is planned the established ones will fight tooth and nail.

[BlackRedGold]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

I doubt there will ever be another indoor mall in Ottawa, even if one is planned the established ones will fight tooth and nail.

What about the outlet mall planned for Palladium Drive?

The regular indoor mall concept is more or less dead in Canada these days. It's been replaced with the power centre concept.

[Uhuniau]

Mkay, so if there is no way to retrofit the highway-ish extensions of central main streets, and no willingness to build new ones...

... does that mean we are permentently stuck with the extent of traditional high streets that we have now?

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Mkay, so if there is no way to retrofit the highway-ish extensions of central main streets, and no willingness to build new ones...

... does that mean we are permentently stuck with the extent of traditional high streets that we have now?

It takes a will to make a way! I think a strong design plan for the Bank Street corridor is needed.

[Ottawan]

I've long thought that Bank Street south of the Rideau River provides one of the best opportunities for pushing the boundaries of what I think of as the urbanized area beyond the traditional core.

It seems that the City of Ottawa has quietly been going through a CDP process regarding this exact area (Bank Street & environs from Rideau River to the train tracks): http://ottawa.ca/residents/public_co.../index_en.html

Sadly it's a bit too late now to participate - the consultation phase is over, and the plan is out next Spring.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by Ottawan

I've long thought that Bank Street south of the Rideau River provides one of the best opportunities for pushing the boundaries of what I think of as the urbanized area beyond the traditional core.

I think it would be hard. Merivale Road, and Montreal Road, would be my priority candidates. Possibly also Whatever The Hell Its Called in Bells Corners.

[eternallyme]

It seems they share a lot of our ideas in that Community Development Plan, too bad I didn't know about it until now!

Area 3 (Kilborn to Walkley) should be split. The section between Heron and Walkley, IMO, should be redesigned as a Little Italy/Chinatown type community, which I would call the Arabian Bazaar, which would be Middle East-themed. The focal point of such could be at Alta Vista/Bank. There are a large number of Arab-themed businesses in that area, and by giving them an official BIA designation would allow it to prosper greater. (The only downside is that such could create a lot of negative publicity from anti-Islamic people, although most live in the suburbs or in rural areas.)

[drawarc]

EMC news article on Bank Street Community Design Plan: http://www.emcottawaeast.ca/20120308...rian%27s+dream

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by theKpa

EMC news article on Bank Street Community Design Plan: http://www.emcottawaeast.ca/20120308...rian%27s+dream

Oh look! Setbacks! Curvy street-like things! Open space! Lego trees!


*sigh*

[Ottawan]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Oh look! Setbacks! Curvy street-like things! Open space! Lego trees!


*sigh*

I'm equally unimpressed by this rendering. Some real height, real mainstreet treatment for Bank, and a real street-grid could be introduced here. Hopefully the land owners have that much sense when they redevelop.

Also, there was a suggestion in the study for the CPD that all of Riverside could have been moved up to join the south (eastbound) branch. This could have been one part of the city with REAL riverfront development. Of course that option was rejected. I am unsure of the rationalization for its rejection.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Ottawan

I'm equally unimpressed by this rendering. Some real height, real mainstreet treatment for Bank, and a real street-grid could be introduced here. Hopefully the land owners have that much sense when they redevelop.

Also, there was a suggestion in the study for the CPD that all of Riverside could have been moved up to join the south (eastbound) branch. This could have been one part of the city with REAL riverfront development. Of course that option was rejected. I am unsure of the rationalization for its rejection.

I believe it came down to two things:

1) Pedestrian difficulty crossing all the turn lanes, as opposed to two 3-lane roadways. Not that I buy the argument, as a careful design can be made even with a 4-lane cross-street.

2) Capacity issues on Riverside. Again, I don't buy it. It should be designed as a parkway, hence they should make an effort in careful design. Trucks should be banned from Heron to Industrial on Riverside as well.

Another possible reason for not developing the riverfront might be due to flooding issues.

[Jamaican-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Oh look! Setbacks! Curvy street-like things! Open space! Lego trees!


*sigh*

I also can't help but notice that Billings Bridge Plaza is all but gone in that render.

[MountainView]

Originally Posted by Jamaican-Phoenix

I also can't help but notice that Billings Bridge Plaza is all but gone in that render.

I noticed the same thing...the only thing that remains is the Zellers. I thought they wanted to incorporate a newly renovated mall into this plan. Also 16 storey (50m) buildings along Bank Street is 'low' in my opinion, especially when it won't be shadowing residential homes or parks. Plus there is already some taller buildings on the east side of Bank St at Riverside. Further - 70m which is roughly 22 storeys along the transit corridor could easily be increased to 25-30 storeys, especially if the city wants to encourage Transit-Oriented Development (which is the whole idea of this plan isn't it!).

[Kitchissippi]

Originally Posted by theKpa

EMC news article on Bank Street Community Design Plan: http://www.emcottawaeast.ca/20120308...rian%27s+dream

This plan misses out on such an obvious, hit-in-the-head opportunity: Move the transit station closer to Bank Street, maybe even right above it. The only reason it is so far in is room needed for BRT and because it serviced the mall directly. Removing the mall makes it senseless for transit to be so remote from the main street. Shifting the station east, they could even add an extra BRT stop closer to the RA Centre and move the bus layover facilities there

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

This plan misses out on such an obvious, hit-in-the-head opportunity: Move the transit station closer to Bank Street, maybe even right above it. The only reason it is so far in is room needed for BRT and because it serviced the mall directly. Removing the mall makes it senseless for transit to be so remote from the main street. Shifting the station east, they could even add an extra BRT stop closer to the RA Centre and move the bus layover facilities there

I agree with that, it would better serve the high-density areas in the NE and SE quadrants as well as what was Billings Bridge Plaza. I would also add a pedestrian signal about mid-block between Kilborn and the Transitway entrance, which could also act as a speed check (so often cars are speeding up and down that hill but forced to slow down for safety ahead, that short stretch operates much faster than the 50 km/h speed limit outside of rush hour).

They could just move the bus layover into what is now the station. There would be two sets of local stops - on Bank Street (Route 1) and at the entrance (all other local routes). The loop would remain at the east end, with the main stops at the edge of the loop (a new turn would allow Routes 112 and 148 to drive off, while all other routes can turn around - Route 5 would have to exit via Data Centre as a left turn onto Bank would not be possible).

Route 1 would remain on Bank Street and not enter Billings Bridge at all, but with the close-in development, it would be more beneficial with a straighter trip. An extra stop could be provided near the Transitway access if safe to do so as well.