[Jamaican-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by ue

Except that there is no serious interest in splitting Ontario up like this, except for maybe Northern Ontario, thus this thread is nothing but a bunch of hypotheticals because democracy, at least in this regard, seems to be working, sans Northern Ontario.

Except as I and others have pointed out, it really isn't working.

Northern Ontario is easily the most ignored region of this gargantuan province, but as I and others have pointed out, the rest of Toronto outside the GTHA or adjoining satellite cities are also ignored a fair bit.

Originally Posted by Wharn

This guy knows the deal.

The rest of these proposals look generally hairbrained. More duplication of services with more levels of government that impose more taxes and restrictions on the private sector while reducing Ontario's influence on a national and international level.

Where are you getting that idea from?

I've got a better idea. The problem is the government, and its bureaucrats, are all concentrated in Toronto and by extension, in the South. They only know one reality: streetcars, sushi and Rob Ford. What we really need to do is move the government out of the most populous city, for attitude and efficiency reasons. Keep Ontario united, and move all the government offices to Sudbury. You would completely revolutionize the region and pivot the balance of power northwards. At the same time, you ease congestion in Toronto, which like most southern cities can survive on its own, without the additional government positions. Provinces are not like municipalities, and should not be so callously split apart. Let's work together and use each others' core competencies to move forward, and retake our rightful place as the Province everyone envies, rather than Quebec 2.0 (sans l'histoire et culture).

Except people in the GTA will likely throw a fit. Also, I'm not sure congestion would be relieved as much as you're implying.

It's not a bad idea, but the chances of any Ontario government (now or in the future) turning its gaze away from the GTHA are slim to none. I know this, and Northern Ontarians know this. A subregional polity of sorts for Northern Ontario could be a good start though.

Originally Posted by Blitz

^ That's a good idea but if they did that the government in power would lose too much support from around Toronto (e.g. the uproar when there was discussion of moving the Ministry of Labour to Windsor in the early '90s).

One of the most well-known sayings in Windsor is that "Ontario ends at London". Just like northern Ontario, we feel no connection at all to Toronto and there is much anti-Toronto angst.

I like the idea of dividing it into 4 provinces. I think Kitchener/Guelph/Cambridge/Brantford should be part of a new GTHA province instead of being part of Southwestern Ontario since those cities are turning into mini-satellites that have more in common with the GTA than with London. We need our own province down here where everything is centralized in London.

I think that would end up being too small a province. I'd rather the GTHA/Golden Horseshoe be its own thing, Northern Ontario, and then a rump remainder.

This rump remainder would actually be relatively similar across the landscape (save for Eastern Ontario which has a Francophone history and character). It would have similar geography, a similar economy, several good educational institutions, and would be relatively balanced in a population sense across the province. Plus, it would have some decent cities; Ottawa, Kingston, London, Windsor, and K-W, plus several smaller cities and towns.

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Drive North on highway 400, and then go on to Highway 11. Once you get to North Bay... KEEP GOING.

Now, after fixing your car due to the horrible state of the highways, you can say that the north gets too much for the highways.

The roads progressively gets worse north of Barrie. Except for the new construction of the 4 laning of 11 and 400, there is little new construction that is improving the roads.

This man speaks the truth.

I remember having the opportunity to drive down the 11 towards Huntsville as part of a detour (crash on the 17). I was surprised (and jealous) to see this relatively new and paved 4-lane highway. It doesn't really exist anywhere else in the region. The 17 towards Ottawa is a two lane undivided highway that occasionally widens to three lanes. And it sucks.