The whole corner of E 5th Street and Los Angeles Street has been replaced by the 5th & LA Plaza, but there are survivors further back. The B Black & Sons sign has faded over the years, but the company is still in business at 548 S Los Angeles Street. They've been on Los Angeles Street since the 1920s and at their current address since the 1930s. The building got a previous passing mention in post #28005.

https://hosting.photobucket.com/imag...080&fit=bounds
GSV

I guess you could say the fact we remember it so well after all these years speaks to how iconic Webb's style was. It was so stilted and flat it does lend itself to parody, but maybe being remembered for that is better than not being remembered at all.

There actually were/are people who talk like Sgt. Friday. Engineers, doctors & scientists mostly. Factual, predictable, no profanities, at least in an office/public setting. They were more common before the late 1960s. Now anything goes, in speech, fashion, appearance, behavior, etc. Sometimes I miss the old days. They were more predictable. On the other hand, people who broke the norms back then often paid a high price for their rule breaking. Lenny Bruce was a good example.

According to George Geary's "L.A.'s Legendary Restaurants," (highly recommended) the ingredients in the Hollywood Brown Derby Cobb Salad were iceberg and romaine lettuce, chicory, tomatoes, chicken breast, bacon, avocado, hard boiled eggs, chopped chives, and crumbled Roquefort cheese, arranged in strips on a plate and then tossed by the waiter at tableside.

The salad was dressed with Brown Derby French Dressing, reconstructed by Geary (almost all the recipes in the book are reconstructions) as:

3/4 cup red wine vinegar

1/4 cup water

1 tbsp Worcestershire Sauce

2 tsp fresh lemon juice

1 tsp sugar

1 tsp black pepper

1 tsp Dijon mustard

3/4 tsp salt

1 clove garlic

1 cup olive oil and 1 cup canola oil

Puree everything but the oil in a blender, then drizzle in the oils to emulsify.

I've made it and it's really good.

Cheers,

Earl

Growing up near the Tom#5 i would go there pretty often during the summer, (we used to get the fries after a nice swim in Pico Pool next door to the Sears)and i have to say Tomboys is my go to, i go to both locations at least once a week. The best fries in the South Bay hands down.

Once i got older we would go to Pan Pacific Park Pool, and afterwards we would bike down 3rd and head to Fatburger on La Cienega (then to the Beverly Center) and again get fries. My Parents would go to this location a lot and say its the original. But i thought the original was incorporated into a low income housing unit off Crenshaw along the new Crenshaw line?

I am a big fan of Tommy's, used to eat it often as a teenager/college age, but now only treat myself maybe 1-2 times a year.

I'm surprised no one has brought up Carney's, also an excellent chili burger, and housed in actual old rail cars converted to be the kitchen and dining rooms.

http://live.staticflickr.com/3007/28...69b47539_n.jpg Flickr

I always got a kick looking at the old black and white photos of them installing the train cars to convert to the restaurant:

https://www.dc83.com/carneytrain/wp-...3-SC-crane.jgp https://www.carneytrain.com/about/

A pickle is a pickle and a tomato is a tomato. The success of any hamburger is the meat. That's why people very much dislike fast-food burgers....their meat is junk infused with fillers.

Doug, I have eaten Tommy's for 61 years. Only once I have I eaten a Tommy's without the Chile...Never make that mistake again, it was not very good. In Tommy's case the CHILE is the success of their burgers. Double Meat, Double Cheese, Chile and Tomato are number one.

I first had a Tommy's with a friend in the 1970s, at about 2 am at their flagship location near Rampart. Boy, was it good and I had never heard of it before.
Fortunately the meat part has stayed fairly good quality since then. Its not the best imo but its acceptable. Yes, the chili is their hallmark.
Hamburger Hamlet, now defunct, save for one, had better but then that was an upscale place.

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-I9JLJfj05...35130_free.jpg
HH

As the sign says at Tommy's, "Everything Comes With Chili"

:previous: I somehow missed your discovery, Bristolian. ... Bravo! :worship:





The reason I guessed that Tom's #5 (in the 'Stingray'snapshot) was located near a beach is the blue area on the right. I thought it might be the ocean.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...924/ZSlg9Z.jpg

So do you think that blue area is the ocean or are we looking at something else?

.
mystery location


Do ya'll remember the 'Skid Row' photograph of the man in the brick alley that I posted 5 or 6 days ago?


Well the same ebay seller just listed another 'Skid Row' photograph from 1972 that shows a brick alley. ....It could be a street I guess.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...922/7dYu0d.jpg
eBay


The street number on the other slide was 695. . the street number on this slide is 451. ....So obviously this is a different alleyway.


Needless to say. .I feel sorry for the poor man. :(

.
Here's one more slide for tonight.


mystery location. (nope. no it's not)... San Julian Street. .and. .?




This is yet another slide taken in the 'Skid Row' area of Los Angeles. (1950s or 60s)

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...922/HzCqZ3.jpg
eBay

That's an excellent looking arched doorway on the right. ...I'm a bit surprised it's located on the side, and towards the back, of the building.

I spy the Southern Hotel.





.

The Golden Gate Cafe photographed by Robert Luthardt circa 1967.


https://i.imgur.com/CCF2PDF.jpg
esotouric.com

e_r, At first, I wasn't sure if that was the ocean and horizon or something else. Here's another street-level view looking west down Pico and what obviously is the ocean shows up looking remarkably similar so I would say yes, definitely.

https://i.imgur.com/AOUARF5.png?1

more images of same structure >> https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...postcount=6276



Undated image, probably late ~ '90s (although vehicular traffic may indicate later . Wilshire and Fairfax looking south. Roof in foreground is Johnie's.
https://thefader-res.cloudinary.com/...e-was-shot.jpg


:previous: From article discussing the late Biggie Smalls who died in '97. https://www.thefader.com/2011/05/25/...-biggie-smalls

1967: To the left of the Golden Gate Cafe, is the Qualified Temporary Help which has moved several stores to the left in E_R's 1970's dated slide.

In the 1996 book, The Brown Derby Restaurant (Sally Wright Cobb), the recipe for the Cobb salad ingredients also included "1 Bunch Watercress".

The recipe for "Cobb's Old Fashioned French Dressing" varies slightly here and there from the one you posted. (Mostly in amounts.) I put the differences from yours in parentheses.

(1) 3/4 cup red wine vinegar
(1) 1/4 cup water
(1) 1 tbsp Worcestershire Sauce
(juice of one lemon) 2 tsp fresh lemon juice
(1) 1 tsp sugar
(1 tbsp) 1 tsp black pepper
(1 tbsp dry English Mustard) 1 tsp Dijon mustard
(1 tbsp) 3/4 tsp salt
(1) 1 clove garlic (minced)
(1) 1 cup olive oil
(3 cups salad oil) 1 cup canola oil

...for what it's worth.

Lots of food talk lately! Are we all hungry? Or hungry for going to restaurants!

The picture was taken later than the late 90s. The MTA (Metro) bus is in the "Metro Local" color scheme, which wasn't introduced until around 2004/2005.

Greetings! Greetings!
 

It has taken me a little over two years, but I finally have read all the posts on Noirish LA. What a delight it has been.

You guys are some of the most passionate posters on any website. What magicians conjuring up the address or locale of even the most obscure photos! I can hardly wait for what come's next this week.

Thanks all! Dan

Welcome Dan to NLA. Lots of cool people here and most of them are like living history books.

Watercress? Harder to find these days as the farm field must have continuous running water to grow watercress.

Raw watercress has a peppery taste, similar to other related plants like mustard and wasabi. Once cooked the pepperiness of watercress diminishes, leaving a distinctive vegetable flavour which tastes delicious in soups, stews and stir fries. More mature watercress can sometimes taste slightly bitter. Its an acquired taste.....you either like or don't.

I wonder why Hamburger Hamlet failed? They had really good burgers. Maybe people associated burgers with a more casual dining experience and fastfood takeout, rather than a sit-down place. I used to go to the HHs in Sherman Oaks and Westwood when I was at UCLA. Is Westwood the surviving one? Junior's deli on Westwood Blvd south of Wilshire was quite good, but a notch below Canter's and Langer's probably.

Panda Express. A guilty pleasure. Popeye's chicken sandwich. Even more guilty pleasure. I'm sure they will triple your cholesterol, but they are good.

I think a hundred years from now, people will still be reading it. Some of these posts will be immortal.

Cali, you got it right about Junior's! I remember in the late 90's i was coming home from school and decided to check it out, i sat down and it took forever for service, the prices were sky high ( 10 bucks for a corned beef sandwich with no side), and on top of that everything was tasteless. Even the cookies were eh.

Since we're still on cholesterol talk, have you tried the fries at Burger City Grill on Artesia? Also, Five Guys who have a few locations in the South Bay, have to be considered for that honor.

Not yet, i will give them a shot. I just tried Rods on Artesia, it was ok...pretty much on par with any of the "Tom's", and also before they closed Louis Burger also on Artesia. It was the best for the value.

As for the demise of HH.....LA has a history of when the original owners of a family-owned restaurant pass on, their restaurants have no effective management.

HH was created as an upscale quality burger place for the Hollywood crowd. But does that scene and price work in Pasadena? The Recession era of the 1970s didn't help.

.
Welcome to noirish Los Angeles, DanVenture!

mystery location / somewhere in the Westchester area.


"Original 1950s 35mm Kodachrome Slide - Los Angeles Westchester district BBQ stand."


https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...922/iB6tEG.jpg
eBay / found a few weeks ago.




Here's a closer look at the sign.


https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/8...923/lH0pvR.jpg
detail

If we figure out the name we might be able to find the address.



.

.
Here's one more slide for tonight.


"Antique Magic Lantern Glass Slide Vintage Downtown Los Angeles Street Scene"


https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...923/WirG8w.jpg
eBay


The seller's description leaves out a lot of information. We're looking east on 5th Street towards the old Central Station (demolished).
We get a glimpse of the Hotel Orbis in the distance on the left. The little girl is cute as a button.


I'm not 100% sure of the cross street immediately in front of the photographer but there's a clue. . .


. . .this is written on the right side of the frame.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/8...923/Xy8eRC.jpg
detail


It looks like it says 5th and. . .Towne?






A closer look at the Hotel Orbis*

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...923/nKZcRs.jpg
detail

Go Here to see an exceptional view of Southern Pacific's Central Station.

More at wikipedia



* oops. It's Hotel Morris......:duh


.

It looks like the street sign says La Tijera and Airport (Can't make out the address number on the restaurant.)
https://i.postimg.cc/Px2vyjFN/Airport-La-Tijera.jpg
Google Street View

This is looking west from the intersection of La Tijera and Airport. The stairs seem to match the ones in the photo, and the house above them is consistent.

.
:previous: Good eye, Mackerm. :)..........I was like, "Steps? What steps?"

.

Since we are on the subject of food, anybody remember the Chris & Pitts BbQ places? I remember the one in the SF Valley when I was a kid in the 1960s. I think it was in NoHo or maybe Van Nuys. My family used to eat there once or twice a month. Was this a chain? I just remember the one in the Valley. I do recall they used to sell Chris and Pitts BBQ sauce in the markets, so it must have been a chain. I can't remember eating there after about 1975. Was it near Drysdale's Dugout owned by by the Dodger pitching great? We previously discussed Drysdale's Dugout bar & grill on Oxnard St. a few months ago.

We all seem to be hungry. The surviving restaurants and bars are going to boom once this endless pandemic is over. Everybody wear masks & survive until then.

When I was a little kid in NoHo I remember a restaurant called MARTIN'S on Oxnard or maybe Victory, near Vineland maybe? It was painted green. My memories are vague because I was maybe 5 or 6, but I do remember they served a really good hamburger. Does anybody remember Martin's Restaurant? It was probably around in the late 1950s or early 1960s when my family ate there.

Another place in NoHo I remember as a kid in the early '60s is a diner called FLOYD'S on Burbank or Magnolia. Tiny place but good diner food. The halibut steak with fries and cole slaw were great every Friday. There used to be a chatty waitress called Juanita with harlequin glasses and the grill man was Bill. A guy named Floyd owned the place, but he retired and turned it over to Bill. If anyone can find anything on Martin's or Floyd's I'll really be impressed.

Finally, when I was a kid I used to spend summers (1961-64) at a day camp place called the VALLEY SPORTS CLUB just off Cahuenga and Burbank Blvd. in NoHo (both of my parents worked). It was run by Buzz and his wife Corky. Really fun place. Anybody else remember this place from the early 1960s? We used to go on field trips to Griffith Park, Pacific Ocean Park etc. All the kids boarded vans with Disney characters painted on the sides. Donald Duck etc. The Sports Club was coed, with lots of girls. Had a crush on some of them. They had a huge Olympic pool. They also had a wood shop where you could make things, and lots of crafts. Really fun place.

In NoHo I also remember there was this western clothing dude called Nudie who drove a huge car with Texas longhorns on the hood. He ran a famous western clothing store called NUDIE'S. Everybody would honk when they saw Nudie in his big car with the horns on the hood. Another place I remember was a car place run by someone called Barris. I think he made the bat car and Munsters car.

Those were the days. Like I said, if any noirish sleuth can find info or photos of these ancient places from over 50 years ago, that would be very impressive. Anything on the Valley Sports Club especially appreciated.

I met Nudie after leaving the Palomino Club (famous western bar in N.Hollywood, next door to Nudies shop) he was taking a leak next to my car and my friends and I thought he was going on the car. He was not however and after confronting him he took us inside and bought us a beer or two. Both places were at their height at that time.

Chris and Pitts BBQ (so so food) became Valley Village's Hugo's on Riverside Drive just east of Coldwater--
After getting Nudie a huge sale of his western duds for my company's summer picnic- he squeezed my thigh on the way back to his Van Nuys shop --and offered me a job if I was interested (a coy pass? ) He later joined my department for our XMAS luncheon--- Giant sweetheart he was---

https://hosting.photobucket.com/imag...080&fit=bounds
Getty/Ed Ruscha

In 1974 Ruscha toured Melrose Ave., this curious building appeared in the 4800 block....a search revealed the property had been covered comprehensively by 3940dxer back in 2011....

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...le#post5506013



https://hosting.photobucket.com/imag...080&fit=bounds



https://hosting.photobucket.com/imag...080&fit=bounds

This guy wearing any pants? 

I didn't realize Chris & Pitts was a bigger chain.

The only ones I know of are in Downey and Bellflower... I grew up in Cerritos, and my orthodontist was in Bellflower, and I remember driving by the Chris & Pitts. But I've never eaten at one.

EDIT: Looking it up, now, there's also a Whittier location. So I guess it's now just a SELAC thing (Southeast LA County).

I had my colonoscopy in that building. It's a rectal investigation factory in there!

Yes the food at Pitts was so so, odd meat cuts and very greasy.
This reminds me of LOVE's BBQ. The food was good there but the servings were microscopic. One had to order 2 meals to manage to get enough actual food on a single plate. That may be part of the reason they disappeared.

Nudie was good for NoHo and all the country music stars seemed to buy his stuff. Everybody in NoHo liked Nudie. They always waved and honked when his big flashy car with the horns on the hood drove by. It helped that his store was near the country/western temple the Palamino. I think Elvis wore some of his flashy duds also, and I think John "Duke" Wayne did also. Nudie was a big deal in NoHo.

https://cdn0.wideopencountry.com/wp-...15/09/Gram.png
nudie

Nudie was the tailor for Western Music.

Hi Doug. I think the BBQ at Coldwater and Riverside you are thinking of was SMOKEY JOE'S. not Chris n' Pitts. I remember two Smokey Joe's from the 1970's. One was on Riverside Drive the other was outside of "Kiddyland" near La Cienega. There was a pump jack pumping oil outside the La Cienega location. I remember Case Swayne foods marketed "Smokey Joe's" beans in the area supermarkets. Same cowboy character as the restaurants. Chris n' Pitts had a valley location at Fulton and Victory. That closed some years ago. Your feelings about C + P, Smokey Joe's, Loves and maybe Bob's Big Boy were shared by my mom who hated all 4. My sister and I had to BEG to go to any of them.

https://hosting.photobucket.com/imag...080&fit=bounds

This guy wearing any pants? [/QUOTE]

^^^
Is that Nudie? :koko:

The original Rhinestone Cowboy, "Nudie" Cohen was born in Kiev to Jewish parents. He loved the American westerns that somehow got past the commie censors.

Besides Nudie, there was another eccentric I remember from my youth called Gypsy Boots. He was a pre Hippie Hippie, with long hair and a vegetarian health food fanatic. He hung around Santa Monica and Venice with a bunch of followers. Kind of a harmless Manson. He was on T.V. quite a bit, a resident oddball surrounded by squares.

Another interesting oddball from the 1950s and early '60s was the Laguna Beach "greeter". He was an older guy who would stand on PCH in LB and wave to passing cars as they entered town. Today he'd be just another homeless guy, but back then he was kind of the unofficial mascot for the town, and could eat free in many of the restaurants. Like Gypsy Boots, he had long hair and a beard. I remember seeing him during a vacation my family took to LB in 1963.

The one at Fulton and Victory is the one I remember from my larval stage. I think it was gone by the late '70s, maybe before. Chris & Pitts BbQ sauce went away about the same time from the markets.

Bob's Big Boy was not that bad, especially the drive in one in Burbank near the NBC studios. Bob Hope and other stars used to drop in quite frequently. Ate there once with Johnny Carson a couple of booths away. The place is still there I believe, and J. Leno sometimes dropped in with one of his collector cars on Friday or Sat. night. It might be closed now because of the pandemic--anybody know? Haven't been there in over 20 years.

HI CaliNative. The Victory / Fulton C+P persisted into the 2000's and had a loyal local following to the end. C+P sauces are still around. I've seen them at Stater Bros. and Northgate / Gonzalez markets in Orange County.

The BBQ sauces hit the big time in the 1960's or 1970's when DURKEE / FRENCH FOODS purchased the distribution rights to them. Durkee was owned by Glidden Paints who in turn was purchased by office equipment manufacturer SCM (Smith Corona). C+P sauce has been through several owners since and now is marketed by the Flagship Foods Group https://www.flagshipfoodgroup.com/brands

I still have my Nudie fringed leather Davy Crockett jacket.