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THE FULL HISTORY OF 641 SOUTH IRVING BOULEVARD IS HERE: wilshireboulevardhouses.blogspot.com/2013/02/641-south-irving-boulevard-please-see.html http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3457/...5d1e98d5_o.jpgLos Angeles Times http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3480/...5df93f31_o.jpgvokoban gs: You know it pains me to contradict a master, but I believe that only the exterior of 641 S. Irving was used as "10086 Sunset Boulevard" and that most, if not all, interiors were studio sets. Somewhere I've seen pics and descriptions comparing the front hall, for instance. In this still from SB you can see the studio ceiling: https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-f...2520PM.bmp.jpg In that same place I saw a reference to the actual interiors being used in another Paramount release of 1950, Fancy Pants with Bob Hope and Lucille Ball. The IMDB refers to "641 N. Irving" as a filming location (they mean, of course, S. Irving). Here are a couple of screenshots of that film--I can see some of Norma's mansion in them--perhaps even a lamp or two, and maybe even a corner of "that enormous oil painting that had been presented to her by some Nevada Chamber of Commerce." I am of the mind that these interiors were a reuse of sets for Sunset Blvd. rather than scenes actually shot at 641 S. Irving. Studio sets or actual location shots--either way, it seems that Paramount piggybacked the shooting of Fancy Pants onto SB's schedule: https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_d...83917%20AM.jpg https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_d...84037%20AM.jpg https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_d...90529%20AM.jpg Three shots above: Paramount Pictures |
i'm ready for my close up mr. wilder
http://www.corbisimages.com/images/I...e-fc691e04483c Source: Corbis Images That camera stand doesn't exactly look OSHA approved! i'm pretty sure that i read somewhere that the interiors of the mansion were actually filmed there. A neglected house gets an unhappy look. This one had it in spades http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5148/...5913df34_b.jpg Source: DVD Beaver i'm ready for my close up mr. demille http://www.corbisimages.com/images/B...b-eeb4ee0c8af6 Source: Corbis Images |
thanks gaylordwilshire
im glad that i have the memories.my question now is how would i get the blueprints or a record of who designed the getty mansion,and or my old house and my neighbors house.mrs lewis's house has always been the odd one in the area,ive seen alot of houses in the area which have the same floor plan as some on my street and are exact copies but not mrs lewis's.my house on the other hand (1442 s spaulding)had a major remodel in the late 60s,the owner before my grandmother was shot dead in the front door,the blood splater messed up mrs lewis's brand new gold caddy(that she got from lou elhers),ive looked online for more info about the murder,but nothing.so when my grandma bought the two properties (1436 and 1442)in about 69 or 70,my house had been lifted so it could have a basement by the guy who got killed.pictures of the house before that don't exsist.when my grandma sold the house to my dad in 72, the house didnt have a front door for most of my life(our front door was in the back) and was just a shell.dad did work and made the little barn as i called it a home but never finished and passed away in late 2000.the house was then sold last yr to an artsy type and now its an eyesore.so how would i go about getting info?
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this is an excerpt from pages 291 and 292 of the book, "On Sunset Boulevard: The Life and Times of Billy Wilder.
Paramount's location Scouts were busy finding excellent examples of the way HoIIywood's citizens variously lived. The Alto Nido Apartments at 1851 North Ivar at the top of the hill at Franklin, would work well for the drab barracks of an unemployed screen writer. For Norma Desmond's mansion they had to look farther afield than the 10,000 block of Sunset Boulevard, on which the fictitious house is situated in the script. They found it about six miles away, at the northwest corner of Wilshire and irving Boulevards. The immense heap of a house, built in 1924 for the then-astronomical figure of $250,OOO, currently belonged to J. Paul Getty's ex-wife , who hadn't lived there for several years. More ghostly then derelict, the building itself fit the filmmakers' description superbly, as did the vaguely seedy-looking yard and garage. There was no pool, so Paramount built one. (The ex-Mrs. Getty was said to be thrilled to get a free swimming pool, but the pool the studio built had next to no plumbing and was never used for swimming once filming completed.) Paramount also sweetened the mansion's interior by adding stained glass windows to the front hall, heavy draperies and a pipe organ in the living room and palm trees in the conservatory They probably did shoot some interiors of the Desmond mansion on a set at paramount, but by the looks of the above, quite a bit of the main interior shots, particularly the living room were filmed on location at the Jenkins Mansion UNIHIKID, building permit plans are typically considered public records. a visit to the building department microfilm archive records to perform a search on a particular property would reveal if the city has the plans on file. if they do, they normally charge a nominal fee per sheet copied. microfilm records are typically printed out on 11 X 17 paper, and can be somewhat difficult to read |
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More Sunset, Segueing into Sun
FOR A FULL HISTORY OF THE HOUSE USED IN SUNSET BOULEVARD, SEE http://wilshireboulevardhouses.blogs...lease-see.html
Other than somehow delving into Paramount archives, assuming any detailed records were even kept, we'll probably never know exactly how much the Getty house was used for Sunset Boulevard interiors. From David Wallace's Lost Hollywood: "There was another problem.... Although the interiors were fine for the story, they weren't spacious enough for Wilder to move his cameras freely, so they were recreated on the Paramount lot. Assigned the task [of recreating the actual rooms] was...Hans Dreier, who had been brought to the studio...the same year the Jenkins house was built.... [Dreier] was responsible for the 'stunningly pretentious rooms and staircase'.... The tiles used for the floor of the New Year's Eve ball sequence were exact copies of those in the Jenkins home.... The interior sets were restyled several times for later films, most memorably by Dreier himself for... A Place in the Sun": https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_d...63411%20PM.jpgParamount Pictures https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_d...63009%20PM.jpgParamount Pictures https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_d...63403%20PM.jpgParamount Pictures https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_d...63635%20PM.jpgParamount Pictures While I'm at it...the Eastman bathing suit factory in A Place in the Sun... https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_d...60234%20PM.jpgParamount Pictures was actually the Los Angeles Goodyear tire plant: https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_d...2/goodyear.jpgUSCDL https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_d...55934%20PM.jpgParamount Pictures |
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-Scott |
Wow, thank you for all the info on Norma Desmond's "great big white elephant!" Interesting that all the other houses on that block are still standing. Apparently, fronting directly on Wilshire Blvd. was the eventual kiss of death for all its original residential properties...
-Scott |
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Well, Scott, not all Wilshire houses got demolished... some were adapted to commerce, a handful of those lasting into the early '80s, even if they weren't still recognizable as once having been major residences. And a number of Wilshire houses were actually moved out of the way of commerce, most famously the Verbeck, which was built at Wilshire and Rampart and moved in the '20s to where it still stands at 637 S. Lucerne, now only in the shadow of commerce. The house at 617 S. Plymouth traveled from the corner of Wilshire and Highland; the O'Melveny house, built at Wilshire and New Hampshire, is now at 501 S. Plymouth. The Gless house at 605 S. Plymouth was originally on Ardmore half a block north of Wilshire. That the Getty house was built after these moves began indicates that not everyone understood what A. W. Ross did: Wilshire was destined to become a linear downtown, and any single residence in its path, from Grand to the sea, had better move or face doom! Moving some of the huge houses was no mean feat, but it doesn't sound as though a fortress like Norma's house could ever have been moved. At least it has been immortalized on film as... 10086 http://i.cdn.turner.com/v5cache/TCM/...2720051057.jpgTCM FOR A FULL HISTORY OF THE HOUSE USED IN SUNSET BOULEVARD, SEE http://wilshireboulevardhouses.blogs...lease-see.html |
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Great photos, all of them! Thanks for the pics of Lou Ehlers, guys. :) And that Pettit story really is bizarre. Would make an interesting screenplay... |
A definitive L.A. Noir "Top Ten"?
I'd like to make a suggestion – that the principal participants in this thread compile a definitive list of the top 10 greatest examples of L.A. film noir. (Or maybe a top 20, whatever number's appropriate.) I would find this a great help, myself, as I am somewhat of a naif when it comes to this genre, and I'd really appreciate having a best-of-the-best list to refer to for future movie-viewing enjoyment. What do you think? Is a "Best of L.A. Noir" list doable?
-Scott PS: Some possible criteria to consider: * Critical acclaim * Historical city views * Great performances * Notoriety And I'd start off by nominating (in no particular order): "The Exiles," "L.A. Confidential," "Sunset Boulevard" and "Chinatown." |
Haven't seen the Exiles yet, but those other 3 are at the top of my list.
L A Confidential Chinatown Sunset Boulevard The Prowler Double Indemnity The Turning Point The Big Sleep The Killing Kiss Kiss Bang Bang (and a 50 way tie for 10th) |
as i was compiling my list of fav-o-riffic noir guilty pleasures, i was tracking down photog's to go with my selections. (after all this is the found photos forums).............anywho......
i stumbled upon these screen captures from a 1969 episode of the Darren McGavin detective television series, "The Outsider". these images are from the show titled "through a stained glass window". i don't know how, but i will hunt and track this episode down, as i must absolutely have it to watch over and over again. feast your peepers on this http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-01.jpg Source: Bunker Hill Goes to the Movies and take a gander at that http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-03.jpg Source: Bunker Hill Goes to the Movies while we're at it, take a peep at this http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-09.jpg Source: Bunker Hill Goes to the Movies we ain't done yet http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-11.jpg http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-12.jpg http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-13.jpg http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-14.jpg http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-15.jpg http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-16.jpg http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-17.jpg http://www.electricearl.com/bh/Outsider-18.jpg stunned is all i can say..............stunned.................................(i'll get back to my noir list after i regain normal breathing) |
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Whoa, holy crap! Talk about a lost gem! That's INCREDIBLE, gsj! Actually, the more I think about it – nevermind a Top 10 or 20 – why don't we try to compile a complete list of the best of L.A. noir films? No need to be snooty or exclusive about our choices. Let's just go whole hog and try to list them all! -Scott |
Movie Titles
Gorgeous job, Jansen! Thanks.
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Here's four of my favorites that I think fit....
White Heat The Big Sleep The Bad and the Beautiful War of the Worlds |
Great list of films, gsjansen, though I haven't yet seen "Detour" or "Cry Danger."
I don't know if this film would be considered true film noir, but I like it nonetheless. It's called "The Crimson Kimono." I like that it's set in LA's Little Tokyo, one of my favorite neighborhoods, which I frequent. You see shots of Parker Center, too, back when it was brand-spanking new. It's basically a crime drama, with a bit of interracial love triangle thrown in. It's currently on youtube in 8 parts. The opening scenes after the opening credits really grab your attention: |
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http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5189/...36fa2ebc_z.jpghttp://farm6.static.flickr.com/5189/...36fa2ebc_z.jpg
Joe Musso who was a partner in the original Musso and Franks. He married my grandma Emma Scaramuzzi |
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5067/...e1086c35_z.jpghttp://farm6.static.flickr.com/5067/...e1086c35_z.jpg
He gave up his interest in Musso and Franks around 1927 and opened up his own place on Wilshsire. Musso's Parisian Garden It opened up around 1930 |
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5229/...2949455b_z.jpghttp://farm6.static.flickr.com/5229/...2949455b_z.jpg
He passed in 1946 and so did Musso's Parisan Garden |
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5022/...10f0402928.jpghttp://farm6.static.flickr.com/5022/...10f0402928.jpg
He and Grandma are entombed at Calvary Cemetary. |
that is always the problem with making lists..........folks like Ninja55 and S_EJ point out that you missed some gems.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5266/...8054efc7_o.jpg http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5141/...4a31d455_o.jpg http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5070/...1a28223e_o.jpg The main reason for my selections, is that each of these noir classic films take place in los angeles at some point during the film. there are lots of examples of noir that i love, but they take place in joints other than the city of angeles, thus they did not make my list here. |
Hey Ninja55, great stuff -- I lunched at Musso's today! Crab Louie and flannel cakes, natch.
Gsj, I'm with everyone else in the Holy Crap! department. Let me know when you get that copy of "The Outsider" if I don't git it first! As for noir pictures, alla those mentioned are great (including, I'm certain, those I've not seen). I will say though I don't pay mind to critical acclaim or great acting and such, thus, sooooo, my all-timer has to be http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5212/...20a214f3_o.jpg There aren't a lot of female serial killers, and fewer movies about them, much less movies made fifty years ago...that are shot entirely on Bunker Hill. I've got a gaggle of screen grabs of this picture and intend to put them up here when I get around to it... My second-fave LA noir, modern tho it may be, has to be Barton Fink. (Two things made me move to Los Angeles in 1993: seeing Barton Fink in '91, and watching The Riots on TV in '92.) One might argue that Lebowski (another Coen outing) is also a great uniquely LA noir picture: that's pretty correct. But if we're playing loose with genre description, I'd say Ed Wood is tangential but important to the canon. But back to Original Noir, what we have so far is awesome, I especially dig KMD, Criss Cross, Cry Danger, and Act of Violence, but that's just me. Lots of shots of Old LA after all. I could probably tell you about each'f those shots, but precious little 'bout each film's diegetic structure. I would add the Joseph Losey remake of M. Gsj's photo-essay on it a few pages back cemented its place in LA noir history without question. Also Hollow Triumph, AKA The Scar. First of all, I've watched it ten times, and I can't get over how effing weird it is. Secondly, between 23:00 and 26:00 there are these amazing shots of the Barclay neon lit up, and the Hotel Belmont, and then they ride Angels Flight?! -- it's an orgasm of greatness. Given as I abjure "craft" and "talent," what other films noir do I think should be on the LA list? TISCTSLaBMUZ, of course. (Scroll down to the tail end of this post.) And the universally reviled Ask the Dust, for whom I'll perennially pennant-wave, because it's so...awesome. |
:previous: thanks for these links, it's nice to find new art from others who like noir, but even better to "find" them, if possible.
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i did track down an outsider dvd which contains the "through a stained glass window" episode.
it's available from "Thomas Film Classics". obviously, i placed an order! http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5103/...c0ed8a6b_o.jpg has incredible Los Angeles. (particularly bunker hill), location filming, however, the story completely creeps me out, thus i did not include it as a favorite of mine. (when i do pop the disk in to view, i just skip around to the scenes of bunker hill and the bradbury building and pretty much stay away from the rest of the story) http://stagevu.com/img/thumbnail/uvlqghgukqcfbig.jpg....Doh! another great los angeles noir film that i inadvertently left off my list this undated image captures the ultimate noirish los angeles mood http://www.corbisimages.com/images/B...2-c23c4601fc90 Source: Corbis Images does anyone know where strip city was? |
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https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_d...82940%20AM.jpgGoogle Street View 1304. Western https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_d...85353%20AM.jpgGoogle Street View A little context--the SE corner of Pico and Western http://jpg3.lapl.org/pics37/00068432.jpgLAPL The Commercial National Bank under construction, August 29, 1925 https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_d...91450%20AM.jpgGoogle Street View I love the classical details of the old bank, and that while Strip City is now given over to respectable furniture manufacturing, the bank is a liquor store.... |
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Wow Gaylord, I'm amazed that you found where Strip City was! Impressive! |
wow! i am impressed GW! urban angelese archeologist extraordinaire!
an undated aerial of the intersection of pico and western. it probably is around 1923 or so. the location of strip city is to the right of the real estate office right of center http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics26/00032984.jpg Source: LAPL |
another los angeles noir film that i am ashamed to have left off my list
http://bp0.blogger.com/_s_30zQFJp4g/...+man+shill.jpg not much for story line, but great los angeles location images, not to mention a full four and a half minutes of 3rd and hill/angels flight/hillcrest inn extravaganza! |
The Turning Point (discussed here on pp 69 & 70) is certainly great LA noir -- but it's set in the midwest. Which complicates matters when discussing it as "LA noir!"
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1295/...296cd7b1_b.jpg |
https://i.postimg.cc/d3rtVbgn/florentinegruen-bmp.jpg
LAPL Seems that Gruen figured nightclubs were a good place to advertise... perhaps an admirer gave Beth Short a Gruen after a little dancing here... http://lh5.ggpht.com/_8qEDwfHWKL0/S3...00/LA50s20.jpgLAPL or after a little music here.... Not that the Bowl was a nightclub exactly.... |
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Does anybody know where the gas tanks seen briefly in 'Best Years of Our Lives', possibly the ones in the above shot, were located? I believe the scene in the movie is when Dana Andrews meets Theresa Wright at a lunch counter across from the tanks. |
Great posts everyone! All your lists of 'noirs' are amazing. I haven't even heard of "The Indestructible Man'.
Since you guys have covered most of the L.A. connected 'noirs', I thought I would think outside the box. What came to mind was Ridley Scott's 'Blade Runner'. The setting of the movie is Los Angeles 2019, population 109 million. The production designer Lawrence Paull immediately saw the script as 'film noir'. "I started to think of those late 1940s, early 1950s movies which always took place in a dark, brooding city and then extended that look 40 years past our time." Briefly in this thread we discussed several locations used in the film / Frank Lloyd Wright's Ennis House, the Bradbury Building and Union Station. Blade Runner was released in 1982, the year I moved to Los Angeles. Here is a link to a brief scene from 'Blade Runner' (remember, this is before CGI). The short video ends with a brief shot of the interior of Union Station. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XcGSJ6Of9g Be sure to watch it full screen and with the sound turned up. Enjoy! |
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http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/7...ispups1930.jpg Our Gang I'm not sure where reality ends and the backdrop begins in this photo. Is this the brick wall you speak of MikeD? |
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P.S. http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...2064657999893# be sure to check out 39:40 - 44:19... |
Auto Row survivor
1540 S. Figueroa, 1925 and 2011:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_d...91158%20PM.jpgLAPL https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_d...91445%20PM.jpgGoogle Street View ethereal: Love the "PAN AM" sign in the year 2019.... |
Pups is Pups!
http://i38.tinypic.com/xo4g7n.jpghttp://onbunkerhill.org/TheDirtPatch...ill#comment-17 I love gas holders, AKA gasometers. Here http://users.bergen.org/dondew/GLA/WGPModule.html is a site that describes these curious structures, once ubiquitous in American cities. In the TTP pic we're looking south on Ducummon across Vignes; I've never seen Best Years of Our Lives so I can't say. There were big tanks the other side of Aliso at Howard, and above Keller. Also scattered throughout the city (7th & Alameda, Hollywood, etc.) But the ones behind Union Station are my faves. I never got to see them in person, that I can recall; I think they disappeared in the mid-70s. http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3275/...67ff5fac_o.giflapl They are discussed in some detail here http://viewfromaloft.typepad.com/vie...for_the_m.html and here http://blogdowntown.com/2006/11/2417...on-gas-holders -- in short, the Big Three down by the river date to 1906, 1912, 1906 was felled and replaced in 1922, and 1925. Here's some more stuff about our gas holders in general: The first LA Gas & Electric plant was opposite the Pico House and ran between 1867 and '69. http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5308/...1f03f98c_b.jpg June 27, 1906: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5150/...9342cf51_b.jpg March 3, 1912: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5266/...842cefa6_b.jpg American Gas Journal, April 16, 1921. P. 349 (googlebooks): http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5230/...3734865a_o.jpg http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5301/...ee54518c_o.jpg Jan 18, 1923: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5028/...3ae7e358_b.jpg Feb 11, 1923: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5305/...0222b0b3_o.jpg May 13, 1925: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5187/...b48331a6_o.jpg Sept 14, 1930: http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5025/...911e4321_o.jpg Anyone out there with memories or images of the gas holders, please drop 'em by here. Oh, and here's something I penned for a local mag a short while back (I know this is an image-driven forum, but I thought it germane to the gassy topic). http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5101/...19d07872_b.jpg ...seems likely I'll buy and build one of these. |
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I'm not sure. The section of wall I was thinking of isn't quite as tall. Wheezer's puppies run back and forth along the wall as different bells are being rung. Here's a link to the brick wall today. The gas tanks were on the other side. http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...97.29,,0,10.39 Wow! Thanks Beaudry for all that info on the gas tanks! Back here on Long Island we used to be able to tell how bad traffic was on the Long Island Expressway when the radio would announce that traffic was backed up to the Elmhurst gas tanks. Sometime when I had a job in the other direction from NYC, the gas tanks were dismantled unbeknowst to me. I probably passed the area a few times in my travels before I realized they were gone. |
http://media.kickstatic.com/kickapps...96372_main.jpgdearoldhollywood.com
The Best Years of Our Lives: Dana Andrews and Teresa Wright in downtown "Boone City"--hard to tell which L.A. gasometer this might have been. I didn't realize that there so many over the years. Not knowing much about municipal gas supplies, I have a question: Where is all the gas stored now? Or is it that pipelines have taken over the local manufacturing of gas? MikeD: I used to love hearing references to the Elmhurst tanks in the traffic reports on 1010WINS etc--I think they were taken down in the early '90s. Beaudry: Great history of L.A. gasometers-- |
a great 1935 view from city hall looking at chinatown, with handwritten overlay of where union station will be located.
here is a screen cap to use as a roadmap that i captured using the nifty snip it tool in windows 7 http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5029/...c359f5b2_b.jpg get ready for some serious right, left, up and down scrolling.....(sorry) the detail of so many different elements, on so many different levels, is amazing http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6...05d87c6970b-pi Source: LA Times Blog |
[QUOTE=GaylordWilshire;5243951]https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_d...22254%20PM.jpgLAPL
Seems that Gruen figured nightclubs were a good place to advertise... perhaps an admirer gave Beth Short a Gruen after a little dancing here... I have a picture of my parents inside the Florentine Gardens...sometime in the 40's...I don't know how to upload it so perhaps I could send it to Sosa and he could post it. RBPJr |
rbpjr, it would be great to see the photo of your parents at the Florentine Gardens.
I don't know why, but it's fairly difficult to find good photographs of the Florentine Gardens. |
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http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/8...westfromsa.jpg usc digital archive I believe this is looking west along Santa Monica Blvd. from the area of Mansfield or Highland Ave. |
gasometer bites the dust in war of the worlds - 1954
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5184/...47b67d39_o.jpg |
Gassing on
http://catalog.library.ca.gov/exlibr...8CBFDQBGRK.jpgWilliam Reagh/California State Library
http://jpg3.lapl.org/pics51/00075422.jpgWilliam Reagh/LAPL http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics19/00009386.jpgLAPL http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics48/00043551.jpgLAPL http://jpg3.lapl.org/pics34/00066588.jpgLAPL I couldn't find any of these shots by doing a seach of past posts-- but we may have seen some of these before.... |
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