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HossC Aug 30, 2014 2:13 PM

:previous:

The 1942 CD lists Standard Auto Body Co Inc at 1501 S Central Av (as in the advert posted by Retired_in_Texas) and 1212 Clanton. I'm still looking for pictures of the Central Avenue address, but an article on coachbuilt.com says the company moved to 4900 S Soto Street in the 1940s, where they remained until their demise (by then the company was known as SABCO) in 1979. The article lists the company's active years as 1928-79, but I found the Standard Auto Body Wks at 1501 S Central Avenue listed as far back as the 1915 CD. The South Soto building was later occupied by GAMCO Industries. Other than being enlarged sometime bewteen 1948 and 1952, the building (and surrounding rail tracks) appears to have changed little since the Standard Auto Body days.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...0SouthSoto.jpg
GSV

PS. I wonder how aerodynamic those beautiful gas trucks were.

Retired_in_Texas Aug 30, 2014 4:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HossC (Post 6711712)
:previous:

The 1942 CD lists Standard Auto Body Co Inc at 1501 S Central Av (as in the advert posted by Retired_in_Texas) and 1212 Clanton. I'm still looking for pictures of the Central Avenue address, but an article on coachbuilt.com says the company moved to 4900 S Soto Street in the 1940s, where they remained until their demise (by then the company was known as SABCO) in 1979. The article lists the company's active years as 1928-79, but I found the Standard Auto Body Wks at 1501 S Central Avenue listed as far back as the 1915 CD. The South Soto building was later occupied by GAMCO Industries. Other than being enlarged sometime bewteen 1948 and 1952, the building (and surrounding rail tracks) appears to have changed little since the Standard Auto Body days.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...0SouthSoto.jpg
GSV

PS. I wonder how aerodynamic those beautiful gas trucks were.

As you know there was a "serious" aerodynamic vehicle movement during the 1930's. I look at it as a melding of Streamline Modern architecture into transportation. We saw it with Chrysler's Airflow, which I always considered a study in "ugly." GM, Ford, Packard, and Nash came along with inverted bathtubs, a different level of "ugly" from the Airflow. Railroads dressed up steam locomotives and club cars to make them appear aerodynamic. As for the Gilmore trucks, it is doubtful that they were significantly more functionally aerodynamic than a brick, but they did look a lot more appealing than a brick.

I think the real story with Gilmore's trucks is the illustration of just how close Los Angeles might have come to taking the vehicle manufacturing capital of the country title from Detroit and that story starts with the early Los Angeles Coach Works and the impact they had upon Detroit. Many of the great automotive designers came from those Los Angeles Coach Works businesses. We've only discussed a couple of them here, but there were certainly more, including the two companies whose names cropped up in association with the Gilmore Trucks.

Before I forget, be cautious about taking info from the Coachbuilt Web site as absolute gospel. I've found more than one contradiction in information there, even a couple within their site. But that is what can happen when attempting to reconstruct history from over fifty years ago.

ProphetM Aug 30, 2014 5:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loyalton (Post 6711632)
*Farmer John meat packing is covered in a mural, done in 1963. That may be it for Vernon's contribution to the Arts. The mural does not cover the stockyard smell, which was actually less than what I expected. I also remember a dirt road in the mural (now painted over) that some Wile E. Coyote-type tried to drive into.

I went and looked at this on Google Street View. That may be the largest mural I've ever seen in my life! It wraps around 3/4 of the complex and across some buildings on the inside as well. I noticed some flying pigs in one part. And then there was this amusing depiction:

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-G...307%2520AM.jpg
GSV

Martin Pal Aug 30, 2014 6:30 PM


Hey, hey...

Not too far from Monkey Island's location at 3300 Cahuenga was Dean Jeffries Automotive Styling at 3077 Cahuenga. Most likely this is the first photograph of the Monkee-mobile taken in June 1966 after it had been completed.

Tourmaline Aug 30, 2014 7:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JScott (Post 6711634)
This rooftop sign has been a puzzlement to me since I first saw it. Was it electrified and illuminated? I'd think it almost had to be, because in broad daylight, with its see-through letters, the sign would be barely readable (below). And yet it was clearly a very fancy (and probably quite pricey) piece of metalwork, so why would a business spend good money to make a sign for its store that is difficult for people to see? Obviously it wouldn't – the sign must have stood out in some way, but the only way it could would be if it were illuminated at night.


And what's that apparatus at the top? It looks like a canvas shade on a roller. It's affixed in such a way that it would cover the sign from the front, which makes even less sense, as when let down, that would make the sign flat-out impossible to read. What the hey is going on with this thing?



http://otters.net/img/lanoir/CHS-2856_detail_sky.jpg
USC Digital Library, "Intersection of Spring Street and First Street looking south, ca.1900-1904" (detail).



But, if it was an electric sign, what was the source of illumination? It couldn't be neon – in the aughts, that type of lighting hadn't been introduced to this country yet. Anyway, there aren't any glass tubes to be seen. It doesn't even have any light bulbs, like the sign on the cornice of the store next door in the second photo, or on Hamburger's rooftop sign in the background. Not even sockets for lights.


The sign does appear to be electrified, though. See the power line coming in from lower left, connecting to the insulator on the roof line, then appearing to connect to the metal frame of the sign? There also appears to be another smaller insulator on the frame a couple of feet above the connection point. And the rest of the wires connecting to various parts of the sign. A few of those seem to be for structural support, but others appear to have no other function than to connect one part of the metal sign to another (presumably to conduct current).



Finding some other photos of the sign, preferably from a later date, might provide answers.
This is purely a "lay" guess. Could it be that the sign was unfinished, and either in the process of construction or deconstruction? A cursory search regarding "Crandall Aylsworth" provides limited "illumination" on the subject and makes me wonder if the sign wasn't very short lived - which might have something to do with the state of the sign, as pictured.


I see what appears to be the framework of a sign that could be finished in many different ways. This might even include the eventual installation of incandescent lights, or a bright coating to reflect projected light. It would make sense to do most of the small construction, including lighting attachments, at ground level, but I could conjure several scenarios where this might not be the case. The lack of any visible scaffolding weakens my conclusion, but there could be numerous explanations for this too. :rolleyes:

The "apparatus" seems to be a rolled up tarp that could serve several purposes, including a temporary windbreak for contractors, or a means of limiting where parts and tools might drop, or even a temporary advertising banner. :shrug:


For some strange reason I am drawn to the Elk's signage. I don't know that it was designed for night illumination, anymore than the "Crandall" sign. It was plainly visible in daylight but I think reflected/projected lighting was likely an afterthought, considering its growing popularity at the turn of the century. With the Crandall sign, if painted white or silver, it would have been indirectly lit by all of neighboring self-illuminated signs.


http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5007/...67ca1d28_o.jpghttp://farm6.static.flickr.com/5007/...67ca1d28_o.jpg http://skyscraperpage.com/forum/show...70279&page=119

HossC Aug 30, 2014 7:48 PM

:previous:

I haven't found anything on the sign yet, but I did find that Crandall, Aylsworth and Haskell suffered a major fire at their warehouse on North Los Angeles Street in 1898. There was a big write-up in the Los Angeles Herald the next day. NB. I've rearranged to column positions to make it easier to read.
Los Angeles Herald, Volume 25, Number 241, 29 May 1898.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...1.jpg~original
California Digital Newspaper Collection

The story was accompanied by this drawing.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...2.jpg~original

Maybe today's insurance companies could learn something about settling claims more quickly!
Los Angeles Herald, Volume 25, Number 264, 21 June 1898.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...e.jpg~original
California Digital Newspaper Collection

This advert predates the fire by about a year. I wonder why Haskell's name didn't appear on the circular sign.
Los Angeles Herald, Volume 26, Number 255, 12 June 1897.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...t.jpg~original
California Digital Newspaper Collection


My Googling also turned up some discussion of the photograph on Alison Martino's 'Vintage Los Angeles' Facebook page. I see one of the replies in the second link contains the advert above.

https://www.facebook.com/VintageLosA...149090/?type=1
https://www.facebook.com/VintageLosA...675171/?type=1

shadyguy Aug 30, 2014 7:49 PM

At the NW corner of 4th & Hope there once stood the Hildreth Mansion and the road that went west from there was a dead end, so did that section ever go back to the south and possibly down to Flower st between 4th & 5th st. ?

Were there any structures on this road and it seems during construction the contractors turned this stretch into a possible service road running up behind the hill.

Tourmaline Aug 30, 2014 8:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HossC (Post 6711912)
:previous:

I haven't found anything on the sign yet, but I did find that Crandall, Aylsworth and Haskell suffered a major fire at their warehouse on North Los Angeles Street in 1898.

On December 31, 1900 - CA&H petitioned the Superior Court for a name change. Whether that included a certain deletion (Haskel) is unclear without viewing the file. http://hdl.huntington.org/cdm/single...id/69416/rec/1

My cursory search focused on the sign and the fact that the source approximated the photo date to 1900 ~ 1905. I don't recall seeing any specific CD listings for CA&H, although there were a few residential listings for employees/officers. The ad lists an up-to-date telephone number, "848," which leaves me to wonder how many calls were placed to or from that number on any given day. "No, Mr. Haskell is not in."

When I first read "up-to-date" I took this to mean "new and improved.":uhh:

HossC Aug 30, 2014 10:13 PM

:previous:

There's no phone number in the 1898 CD listing for Crandall, Aylsworth & Haskell, but it does call it an "Up-to-Date Department Store".

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...dall1898CD.jpg
LAPL

The 1900-01 CD has far fewer mentions of the company. The listing in the dry goods section is the only one which includes the name Haskell - the others just say Crandall, Aylesworth & Co. BTW, that's not a typo on my part - the company, and George W Aylesworth himself, are listed with an "e" in Aylesworth. I don't know how long the company lasted, by 1909 there was a notions store called E P Charlton & Co at 113 N Spring.

loyalton Aug 30, 2014 10:27 PM

Here's a more detailed view:
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3839/...bb8c7666_o.pngUSC digital library

There was fluorescent tube lighting in this period, carbon dioxide- and nitrogen-based, developed by Daniel McFarlan Moore and commercially available. http://nyneon.blogspot.com/2012/01/a...ube-light.html

Looking at the detail photo above, the lettering is tied (somehow) to the framing and looks a lot like neon signs of more recent vintage to me. It also looks like the backs are painted black; the sign wasn't meant to display backwards. This is all so complicated that nobody would do this for framing wooden or metal letters. I'd think no one would install the electrical connections before everything else was completed first. Electrical are the limp wires; guy wires are the taut wires.

As for the canvas, look back at the front view. I agree on how thin the sign looks in the daytime. HAMBURGERS really overwhelms it. I'll guess the canvas is the daytime sign with the sign lit only at night. I'll also guess it's rolled up here for the photographer.

Tourmaline Aug 30, 2014 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loyalton (Post 6712004)
Here's a more detailed view:
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3839/...bb8c7666_o.pngUSC digital library

. . . . . . . .

As for the canvas, look back at the front view. I agree on how thin the sign looks in the daytime. HAMBURGERS really overwhelms it. I'll guess the canvas is the daytime sign with the sign lit only at night. I'll also guess it's rolled up here for the photographer.


I neglected to mention another possibility. Because we are viewing this sign from the back, it is quite possible that it is festooned with many incandescent bulbs that are completely hidden from our view. Hence one of the reasons for finding another image. The framework looks deceptively thin but it still would be large enough to encase hundreds of standard sized bulbs and wiring for those bulbs - on the other side.

http://www.skyscraperpage.com/forum/...ostcount=22427

CityBoyDoug Aug 31, 2014 12:43 AM

Pin-striping heaven.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Pal (Post 6711851)

Hey, hey...

Not too far from Monkey Island's location at 3300 Cahuenga was Dean Jeffries Automotive Styling at 3077 Cahuenga. Most likely this is the first photograph of the Monkee-mobile taken in June 1966 after it had been completed.

Dean and a lady friend...doin the pin-striping thing. We see him using both of his pinkies as a support for the brush. That's a 1947 Mercury. The photo is probably sometime in the early 1950s. Dean Jeffries 1933 --2013 age 80...he was the King of Pin-striping..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dean_Jeffries

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ps6832c026.jpg
kustomrama

The 130 was painted by Jeffries. I think you all know the man at the left. The car? It was named ''The Little Bastard." Don't know the man...google the name of the car.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ps01d309e5.jpg
the selvedge yard

HossC Aug 31, 2014 1:01 AM

:previous:

A color view of Dean Jeffries Automotive Styling complete with Monkeemobile, probably taken at the same time as the one posted by Martin Pal.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...nJeffries1.jpg
www.reocities.com

It looks like the building was put up for sale after Dean passed away.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...nJeffries2.jpg
GSV

There's still a hint of the building's history in the window.
http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...nJeffries3.jpg
GSV

rbpjr Aug 31, 2014 1:02 AM

Barbecue location?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 6706086)
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/xq90/673/xlc28p.jpg
badge/history

The L.A. County Sheriff's Dept. held an annual BBQ from 1921 until the beginning of the war (1941). I initially thought the BBQs were located at various locations around the county, but this undated photograph with the in-ground brick BBQ pits makes me think there might have been a permanent location. This site appears to be at the foot of a pretty good size hill, if you look closely you can see a fence row above the chimney on the building in the top left corner.
(I just noticed they're offering Eastside Beer)

Anyone have an idea where this might have been located?

__

Without reading any further...just a wild guess but the background looks like the old LA Police Academy...

Hollywood Graham Aug 31, 2014 1:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbpjr (Post 6712094)
Without reading any further...just a wild guess but the background looks like the old LA Police Academy...

Some of the LASO (now LASD) BBQ's were held at the bottom of New York Ave. in La Crescenta.

FredH Aug 31, 2014 3:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadyguy (Post 6711913)
At the NW corner of 4th & Hope there once stood the Hildreth Mansion and the road that went west from there was a dead end, so did that section ever go back to the south and possibly down to Flower st between 4th & 5th st. ?

Were there any structures on this road and it seems during construction the contractors turned this stretch into a possible service road running up behind the hill.

Shadyguy - I couldn't find an old map showing a street next to the Hildreth Mansion, but there certainly was one:

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p...ps2c15a88e.jpg
http://onbunkerhill.org/hildreth_mansion#.VAKJPdddW-0

The sign in the photo says that it was not a through street.


By the way, here is a nice (fairly noirish) history of the mansion.

http://onbunkerhill.org/hildreth_mansion#.VAKJPdddW-0


One account I read says that it was taken out by the Fourth Street cut.

loyalton Aug 31, 2014 4:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tourmaline (Post 6712046)
I neglected to mention another possibility. Because we are viewing this sign from the back, it is quite possible that it is festooned with many incandescent bulbs that are completely hidden from our view. Hence one of the reasons for finding another image. The framework looks deceptively thin but it still would be large enough to encase hundreds of standard sized bulbs and wiring for those bulbs - on the other side.

We already have the front view, albeit from an estimated couple years earlier.
Quote:

Originally Posted by JScott (Post 6711634)

Blowing up the source image at USC to the max, I don't see any bulbs there, nor receptacles for them. Compare with SEE US FOR OVERCOATS down the block. The Crandall Aylesworth sign looks to be "only" about 20-25 feet across -- IMO receptacles should be evident against the tubing if they were there.

Tourmaline Aug 31, 2014 1:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loyalton (Post 6712200)
We already have the front view, albeit from an estimated couple years earlier.

Blowing up the source image at USC to the max, I don't see any bulbs there, nor receptacles for them. Compare with SEE US FOR OVERCOATS down the block. The Crandall Aylesworth sign looks to be "only" about 20-25 feet across -- IMO receptacles should be evident against the tubing if they were there.


I overlooked the obvious. :blush:

Maybe it's the exposure, but upon closer examination, this front image seems less substantial than the reverse view. It is also less clear that the date attributions for front and back photos are particularly helpful. I still see the possibility that the sign was a work in progress.

The idea of the tarp or sailcloth being used as a daytime advertisement, requiring a daily unfurling and refurling, seems impractical - unless this was a temporary measure pending the completion of a permanent sign. Or the tarp may have announced something seasonal rather than daily? Or, as suggested, the tarp was ordinarily unfurled except when accommodating a photographer.

One has to wonder whether the Hamburger's were fond of their view being impaired by the Crandall sign - and whether they might have influenced the sign's design (and brevity). As HossC observed, the missing name, and/or other business considerations, may have influenced the sign's evolution. :shrug:


http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/utils/...XT=&DMROTATE=0http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/utils/...XT=&DMROTATE=0
http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/utils/...XT=&DMROTATE=0http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/utils/...OTATE=0http://

Wig-Wag Aug 31, 2014 5:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HossC (Post 6712093)
:previous:


There's still a hint of the building's history in the window.
http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...nJeffries3.jpg
GSV

It is a bit hard to confirm but it appears that the poster in the window shows another piece of Dean Jeffires's work, the "Landmaster" from the move "Damnation Alley".

See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26n3RsXNyKE

Cheers,
Jack

John Maddox Roberts Aug 31, 2014 5:04 PM

Hello, all. First, let me introduce myself. I'm John Maddox Roberts, a professional novelist for the last 30-odd years. I discovered this site about a month ago and have been working my way through its pages and am up to p. 148. Only a little more than a thousand to go!
My own relationship with L.A. began on June 25, 1954, when I flew in from Texas on a DC7 with my mom and brother. My mother's sister lived in Pasadena and we were out for a summer visit. I can always remember the date because it was my 7th birthday. I don't remember much about the airport (not yet called LAX) but I remember vividly the giant donut atop Randy's Donuts, which we drove past on our way to the Pasadena Freeway, so I guess you can say that my memories of California began with LA's unique architecture.
I spent most of my summers there until 1961, when my aunt moved to Santa Barbara, but I've been back many times over the years, most recently for the Left Coast Crime Convention in 2010, which was held at the Omni, atop what used to be Bunker Hill, and got to ride on Angel's Flight at its reopening.
This site is a wonderful resource and I'm enjoying it immensely. I only wish I had pictures to contribute. Thank you all for giving me so many hours of enjoyment.
And the new James Ellroy book debuts in 10 days! 40s L.A. Noir reigns! My cup runneth over.


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