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Busy Bee Dec 1, 2013 4:17 PM

HypotheticAlly speaking, if the Feds resurrected (miracle?) their funding offer to Florida for the original plan, and say Charlie Crist got the governorship back, is the original plan still doable now with FEC in the picture?

Jasonhouse Dec 1, 2013 5:08 PM

Yes, absolutely.

But at the federal level, the Republican HoR would still be a stumbling block. Depending on how it shakes out after 2014, I think a Rep senate filibuster could be broken though.

It's also important to note that Rick Scott has been laying the ground work to fill in the HSR right of way along I-4 with for-profit corporate toll lanes. If reelected, it'll be all but a sure thing.

Lakelander Dec 1, 2013 7:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Busy Bee (Post 6358954)
HypotheticAlly speaking, if the Feds resurrected (miracle?) their funding offer to Florida for the original plan, and say Charlie Crist got the governorship back, is the original plan still doable now with FEC in the picture?

I doubt the feds resurrect the $2 billion gift that was once up on the table but I could see AAF and FECI expanding to Tampa along the I-4 corridor (old HSR project's proposed path).

Lakelander Dec 1, 2013 8:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eleven=11 (Post 6358831)
I agree. So why is Rick Scott so stupid???

He's not stupid. That decision was more about self serving politics than what was best for the state long term. Unfortunately, in this state, there's a lot of money being made off of road building and sprawl.

For example, to make their project a reality, AAF had to agree to pay the Orlando Orange County Expressway Authority millions. Since the Beach Line is a toll road, they were fearful that a successful train would mean less automobile traffic. Without AAF agreeing to subsidize their desired profits, they would have refused to lease ROW for the rail line's extension from the coast to Orlando.

Leo the Dog Dec 1, 2013 9:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atlantaguy (Post 6356080)
You have absolutely NO idea of what you are talking about. The HSR project that was proposed was all about being a Federal demonstration project. As far as no need, just how recently have you navigated I-4 between Orlando & Tampa?

California will have a surplus this year. Look it up.

Rick Scott is a complete idiot, and is a total disaster as Governor of the 4th largest State in the country.

And AAF is not HSR. It will be faster than Amtrak at about 90 mph and will be successful, but don't kid yourself into thinking this is privately funded HSR. It most certainly is not. It is higher speed rail than we are used to.

True, CA does have a surplus this year however, CA is also in debt at least $132 BILLION, not including billions in liabilities for public pensions and retiree health care benefits. $10 Billion is owed to the Federal Government for unemployment benefits alone.

Source: http://www.bizjournals.com/sacrament...-load-132.html

eleven=11 Dec 2, 2013 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo the Dog (Post 6359226)
True, CA does have a surplus this year however, CA is also in debt at least $132 BILLION, not including billions in liabilities for public pensions and retiree health care benefits. $10 Billion is owed to the Federal Government for unemployment benefits alone.

Source: http://www.bizjournals.com/sacrament...-load-132.html

I know this is about the train from Orlando to Miami
also connects to the new Ft laud Wave Train

but what does CA & Arnold The Terminator have to do with
rick scott ??

ardecila Dec 2, 2013 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Busy Bee (Post 6358954)
HypotheticAlly speaking, if the Feds resurrected (miracle?) their funding offer to Florida for the original plan, and say Charlie Crist got the governorship back, is the original plan still doable now with FEC in the picture?

Sure, there's no technical reason why it wouldn't work. It could be structured as a TIFIA loan to AAF rather than a direct grant.

AAF would need local and state assistance to assemble the right-of-way between the airport and the I-4 median, but it's not inconceivable.

N830MH Dec 2, 2013 5:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasonhouse (Post 6358911)
^He's not stupid, he's a self serving asshole.

Actually, he lied to all Floridan people, and he didn't telling the truth. He should be removed from the office. He won't be next term. He will not be eligible for next Florida governor. Rick Scott is smartass. He stupid, cheat, steal and etc. I hate Rick Scott.

Good riddance to Rick Scott!!! Get him out of the office now!

Lakelander Dec 12, 2013 1:22 AM

Per the Orlando Business Journal:

Here’s what you can look out for in 2014 with regards to All Aboard Florida:

• The next series of public meetings will take place to get public input on an environmental impact study being done by third-party consultant Vanasse Hangen Brustlin Inc. The first series of meetings was held last spring. See details on that study process here.

http://www.allaboardflorida.com/wp-c...reen-FINAL.pdf

• Once the Federal Railroad Administration receives the study and the public input from the meetings, it can sign off on the project and construction can begin from West Palm Beach to Orlando.

• Infrastructure on the rail project will start, generating temporary 6,600 construction jobs and $400 million worth of construction work will take place in Central Florida.

• Construction to start on the 80-acre vehicle maintenance facility near the Orlando airport, where 80 permanent jobs will be created to manage eight of the rail system’s 10 rail cars.

• A contractor being named to handle the manufacturing of the passenger train cars, known as rolling stock.

Lakelander Feb 13, 2014 10:50 PM

Interesting. AAF and FEC's parent company just acquired downtown Jacksonville's largest hotel for $53 million. Gotta love the name.....Jacksonville Hotel 2014 Purchaser LLC....

Quote:

The sale of the Hyatt Regency Jacksonville Riverfront to a New York investment fund is a good thing for the Downtown hotel market, according to those in the business.

Fortress Investment Group (NYSE: FIG) paid $53 million for the 963-room Hyatt, which also boasts 110,000 square feet of meeting and convention space. Fortress purchased the hotel from the lender that foreclosed on it 2013.
http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonvi....html?page=all

Quote:

The Hyatt Regency Jacksonville Riverfront Hotel was sold this week for $53 million.

The city’s landmark hotel was purchased Monday by New York-based Jacksonville Hotel 2014 Purchaser LLC, a Fortress Investment Group company.

CapitalSource Bank issued a $34.5 million mortgage on Monday. The deed and mortgage were recorded Wednesday with the Duval County Clerk of
http://jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=542234

It's been long rumored that the service would be extended to Jax, assuming the Miami/Orlando line ends up as a success.

This acquisition is probably totally unrelated with bringing passenger rail back to the old downtown terminal but this hotel is the key to getting the convention center out of the old train station, adjacent to FEC's tracks through downtown.

The Hyatt property has first dibs on the old courthouse site across the street. The old courthouse and its parking lot, are the long rumored site for a new downtown convention center.

waltlantz Feb 14, 2014 6:02 AM

I think it'd be a couple of years before you see AAF trains head that far up the coastline.

What I am interested in is what the new downtown Miami station will look like.

Lakelander Feb 15, 2014 5:08 AM

No doubt. I can see something being operational before 2020 though, assuming the initial line starts off well. The track and destinations are already in place. I'm interested in what they do in Miami, as well as Fort Lauderdale and West Palm Beach. I want to see if any other rail companies consider jump starting similar operations tied to real estate development.

Jasonhouse Feb 15, 2014 12:20 PM

Crist needs to win in November, so that the state can then work out a deal with FEC for the I-4 ROW to Tampa.

Lakelander Feb 15, 2014 10:46 PM

One can't help but wonder how different the I-4 corridor would look today if Crist never left office early. It's entirely feasible the State could have ended up with that HSR line between Tampa and Orlando and AAF's project from Orlando to Miami.

Jasonhouse Feb 16, 2014 4:14 AM

Or FEC would be partnering with the HSR operator for a system linking Tampa, Orlando, Jax and Miami.

Regardless of who was running it, the line between Tampa and Orlando would definitely be UC like it was supposed to be, and the transit initiatives in Hillsborough, Pinellas and Polk would be looked at much differently.

N830MH Feb 16, 2014 5:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasonhouse (Post 6453646)
Crist needs to win in November, so that the state can then work out a deal with FEC for the I-4 ROW to Tampa.

I agree as well. I hope so. If Charlie Crist will win the election. He will return work for governor again. Rick Scott is not good governor. He has no experience at all. That's why he failed to do so. He canceled the HSR and etc. There is no reason to canceled it.

Lakelander Feb 17, 2014 10:42 PM

Hmmm, so Rick Scott is a rail buff now. Must be getting close to reelection time.....

The State is going to pay for the rail station at MCO. It will initially serve AAF but will be designed for a SunRail extension as well.

Quote:

Rick Scott announces $215M for new train depot at Orlando International Airport

Gov. Rick Scott announced this afternoon at Orlando International Airport that he intends to spend up $215 million in state money to build a new station at OIA that could house several trains, including a privately financed one that would link Central and South Florida.

Scott has set aside $123 million in his budget this year. The remainder would come next year, if he is re-elected.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/...0,892246.story

Eightball Feb 17, 2014 11:19 PM

Oh gosh, Scott was so wrong for canceling the free high speed rail project, but at least this is a moderate step in the right direction.

N830MH Feb 18, 2014 3:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eightball (Post 6456552)
Oh gosh, Scott was so wrong for canceling the free high speed rail project, but at least this is a moderate step in the right direction.

Yeah, he is idiots. He can't do something for HSR and etc. Yes, he was very wrong for what he did. He lied to all Florida residents. He won't able work for governor ever again for life. He will eventually to loses. He will be fired. They will kicked him out of State Capital.

Lakelander Feb 18, 2014 4:53 AM

The funny thing is if that HSR project wasn't torpedoed, this $200 million station would have been funded without local or state tax dollars as a part of that $2 billion project.

Jasonhouse Feb 20, 2014 1:57 AM

^It's never about doing what's right by the general public. It's always about what's best for themselves.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakelander (Post 6456505)
Hmmm, so Rick Scott is a rail buff now. Must be getting close to reelection time.....

The State is going to pay for the rail station at MCO. It will initially serve AAF but will be designed for a SunRail extension as well.



http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/...0,892246.story

Election year posturing.

At this point, both systems that would use the station are done deals, so really any governor who didn't pledge support for the project is being an asshole, just because he can.

Besides, the legislature will probably nix it anyways.

bobdreamz Feb 20, 2014 4:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakelander (Post 6457091)
The funny thing is if that HSR project wasn't torpedoed, this $200 million station would have been funded without local or state tax dollars as a part of that $2 billion project.

So true as evidenced by this map :

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ando_route.png

http://bettercities.net/sites/defaul...ilmap-full.jpg

If you look at the maps above Sunrail would have intersected with HSR in Orlando between the last 2 stops between the Orange County Convention center & the Airport.
But thanks to Rick Scott and his rejection of HSR as it stands now Sunrail and the All Aboard Florida trains won't meet at all. The closest Sunrail station to the Orlando Airport is about 5 miles away and as far as I know there isn't a CSX rail spur that turns east and heads to the Airport.

Could you imagine that Florida could have had a comprehensive rail system with HSR from Tampa to Orlando then connect with a AAF train down to Miami?
If there was a realistic way to recall and remove Governor Skeletor from office I would have signed a petition years ago. He really screwed us! :hell:

Lakelander Feb 21, 2014 11:45 PM

Even privately financed rail projects have opposition.....

http://www.floridanotallaboard.com/

Quote:

About

We are a grassroots group of citizens who have created this page to help facilitate communication and inform residents that are affected by All Aboard FL.


Description

Florida NOT All Aboard

What is All Aboard Florida? AAF, is an approved rail service using the existing Florida East Coast FEC railway.

How many trains are there? Each day 32 trains will pass through going between Orlando and Miami, West Palm and Fort Lauderdale.

How frequently will the trains be traveling? Each hour two trains will pass through the area everyday between 7am and ending at 11pm, 7 days a week.

What about the freight trains? The freight trains will also be traveling along the rail and are expected to stop to allow the passenger trains to pass. The combined number of trains is estimated to be greater 50 trains per day.

Where do the freight trains stop? It is not determined yet. The rail line bisects many roads, which may have possible impacts.

Will the railway bridge be open? Based on current operating speed, the bridge will be open less than 20 minutes each hour with the combination of AAF and freight trains. Mitigation plans indicate the speed of the bridge may increase, but the improvements have yet to be determined.

What happens to the intracoastal boating traffic? Boating will have to stop when the bridge is down.

What happens when the additional trains use the line? The amount of time the bridge is open becomes less. Possibly remaining closed during the day.

What about “bridge rage” from recreational boaters when the bridge opens? Is it not determined how this will be addressed. (Bridge rage is the frustration caused by the bridge being down, and becomes exasperated when multiple boats begin passing through a narrow opening in both directions in a short amount of time)

Doesn’t navigational law require the drawbridge to open for passage? Yes. The bridge must promptly open when requested by signal.

How can AAF plan to run the high number of trains and meet the navigational laws? It is unclear how this can be met with the current bridge construction.

How fast will the trains travel? Speeds of 110 MPH between Jupiter and Cocoa Beach.

Can the trains travel that fast through our cities? It is unlikely to reach these speeds due to the congestion, intersections, curves, and bridges on the track.

What safeguards will be put into place? An environmental impact study is underway and mitigation plans have yet to be released.

How loud are the trains? Don’t know… Quiet Zones are planned which mean the train horn is not required to blow.

What is the cost to upgrade to quiet zones? The cost for each county will depend on the number of crossing upgrades and is in the tens of thousands of dollars per crossing.

May we have to pay for improvements and not get any of the benefits? Yes

Why aren’t the tracks out west used that go directly between West Palm Beach to Orlando? Good Question! Everyone want’s to know, there is no information available.

How do I get more Information? Go to “Florida NOT All Board” facebook page to learn more.

What do I do to STOP this? Get Involved! Help spread the information to concerned citizens. Sign our petition on face book page.

What do I tell our elected officials? You can go to “Florida NOT All Aboard” facebook page and download letters to send your elected officials.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Flori...216658&sk=info

atlantaguy Feb 22, 2014 9:32 PM

NIMBY's suck. How selfish and short sighted can people possibly be?

chris08876 Apr 18, 2014 10:46 AM

All Aboard Florida has revealed a new site devoted to the project: http://www.allaboardflorida.com/

They have a E- newsletter for updates on the project: http://www.allaboardflorida.com/get-on-board/index.html

===================================
===================================

http://www.allaboardflorida.com/images/banner4.jpg

Quote:

ALL ABOARD FLORIDA IS…
An express intercity passenger rail service
Designed to serve tourists, business travelers and Florida residents
Connecting Miami and Orlando in just under three hours
With planned stops in Fort Lauderdale and West Palm Beach
And 4.5 million square feet of new development
Developed by Florida East Coast Industries (FECI)
THE DEMAND

New, alternative ways to get Florida moving in larger numbers are needed
Florida to become third largest state in the nation due to population growth
95+ million visitors to the state
50 million currently making the trip along the planned route

ECONOMIC IMPACT
A boost of $500M/year in the State’s production of goods and services over the first five years
Ongoing impact of $150M/year after that
$200M in tax revenues for state and local governments through 2021
Thousands of direct jobs created during construction and implementation
ENVIRONMENTALLY SENSITIVE

Three million cars taken off the road each year
Significant reduction in greenhouse gas emissions and fuel consumption
Leveraging the existing corridor means minimal impact to natural resources
Environmental Assessment for Miami to West Palm Beach segment received Finding of No Significant Impact (January 2013)

ADDITIONAL IMPACTS

More robust urban centers surrounding our three South Florida downtown stations
Increased tourism
Relief for Florida’s congested roadways



STATE OF THE ART
Best-in-class innovation and technology
Hospitality-driven on-board experience
Designed to optimize passenger time, ease and comfort
Faster than driving and just as fast as flying
A time savings of 25-30% vs. existing travel options
=========================================
http://www.allaboardflorida.com/facts/index.html

Lakelander Apr 20, 2014 10:59 AM

AAF responds to opposition groups via launch of new website that shows off a rendering of the Miami Station:

http://www.allaboardflorida.com/files/nav/aboutus.jpg

http://www.allaboardflorida.com/

ardecila Apr 20, 2014 4:54 PM

Wow, that's really high. If that's a train at the top, then top-of-rail must be 45' above the ground. At a grade of 2% for passenger rail, those tracks would have to start rising as soon as they crossed under 395.

I guess it has to be this high to clear the Metromover at 5th St, though. Usually urban viaducts are not that high. Ogilvie Station in Chicago has tracks at about 22' above street level. European cities are similar. Tokyo has some stations this high, though.

I'm glad AAF is planning an integrated retail development. The surrounding blocks here are filled with pretty impersonal office buildings and parking garages, narrow sidewalks and wide streets, so it's important that the station itself become a center for shopping/eating.

Jasonhouse Apr 20, 2014 5:42 PM

^I think I would have realigned the Metromover, rather than make the platform have to be so high.

ardecila Apr 20, 2014 9:26 PM

AAF doesn't necessarily have that choice as a private company, and the two-level Metrorail/Metromover transfer is a key lynchpin of the Miami transit system.

Doing a high platform also allows for two levels of retail below the tracks; this is much cheaper/easier than putting retail above the tracks.

From an urban design standpoint, the tall station is just so massive. The design seems to be good so I don't have a problem with it - the transit hub of a major metropolis like SoFla should be huge to correspond with its importance.

electricron May 5, 2014 2:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakelander (Post 6462908)
Even privately financed rail projects have opposition.....

http://www.floridanotallaboard.com/



https://www.facebook.com/pages/Flori...216658&sk=info

Most of the opposition is based upon two issues,
train horns and accessibility.

Establishing quiet zones isn't cheap and local governments wish to see FEC pick up that additional cost. All the FEC is required to do by federal law is the sound the horn on the trains at intersections. It's up to local cities to ask the FRA, plan, fund, build, and maintain the infrastructure for the implementation of quiet zones. Being quiet and being safe are two different things.

Intermediate cities and counties not getting a station initially want one too. They feel they are being left out getting none of the advantages (benefits) while getting all of the disadvantages (troubles). That's true with just about every rail project, high speed or not, some cities are bypassed.

My take: If the intermediate cities want train services, they can always implement their own transit service to do so using their own resources, then contract with FEC to use their tracks and build train stations on their property. Put some of their own skin into the game. Privately ran railroads will always cherry pick what services they will be willing to provide to maximize profits. A good place to start implementing a transit agency is by assuming the costs for implementing quiet zones establishing a working relationship with the private railroad company. If the intermediate cities aren't willing to accept the costs of implementing quiet zones, what creditability will they establish creating a transit agency?

eleven=11 May 21, 2014 6:00 PM

is there any updates on the Orlando airport ???

Lakelander May 23, 2014 9:05 PM

This is the latest article about AAF I've come across this week:

All Aboard Florida will generate $6B in economic impact over next 8 years: report

full article: http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonvi...-economic.html

eleven=11 May 24, 2014 1:30 AM

the new airport station for All Aboard will also connect
with the new monorail to the convention center and florida Mall .....
anybody got route/plans for the monorail track.....

eleven=11 May 24, 2014 3:26 AM

oh yeah , the maps are new for Orlando /ft laud & Miami
the wiki map & google maps.......

nice update on the MIA train station/Amtrak & TriRail

N830MH May 29, 2014 1:40 AM

Miami-Orlando train executives unveil plans for massive downtown station, shops


http://www.miamiherald.com/2014/05/2...xecutives.html

Quote:

All Aboard Florida executives and city officials believe the station complex, about 3 million square feet, will spur commercial development for miles in all directions as well as become an iconic city landmark like the San Francisco Bay Bridge, the Brooklyn Bridge or New York’s Grand Central Station.

“Think of Grand Central Station,” said architect Roger Duffy, whose New York company Skidmore, Owings & Merrill designed the station. “It’s an important anchor for the center of the city, and it spurred development of downtown Manhattan. Miami has sort of lacked that.”

ardecila May 29, 2014 2:03 AM

http://i60.tinypic.com/288jr5.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/687exy.jpg

http://i62.tinypic.com/2s8oe48.jpg

http://i58.tinypic.com/2aj0umd.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/20r2rg6.jpg

http://i57.tinypic.com/2ytzdkl.jpg

Eightball May 29, 2014 4:34 PM

This looks incredible!

Hopefully it is actually built!

bobdreamz May 29, 2014 5:47 PM

^ Florida East Coast Industries who owns the right of way for the AAF train station and the adjacent 11.2 acres of land on the edge of downtown Miami has very deep pockets to build this including a 80 story tower. In the map below everything in red is Florida East Coast property:

http://cdn.cstatic.net/images/gridfs...pfor%20web.jpg

^ then the land between the American Airlines Arena to the Miami-Dade County Administration building is where the huge Miami World Center project is set to rise.

http://miami.curbed.com/uploads/eafIta1.jpg

^ in the above rendering you can see on the upper left side where the current Metrorail line is & where this project will be behind the Miami World Center project. This is going to radically transform downtown Miami.

202_Cyclist May 29, 2014 6:13 PM

bobdreamz:
Quote:

Florida East Coast Industries who owns the right of way for the AAF train station and the adjacent 11.2 acres of land on the edge of downtown Miami has very deep pockets to build this including a 80 story tower. In the map below everything in red is Florida East Coast property:
This is one of the most interesting transportation investments in the United States right now. This is very exciting to see.

Leveraging development and land-use around the stations to pay for infrastructure is the model that several of the Japanese high-speed rail operators use to help finance their system.

bobdreamz May 29, 2014 6:32 PM

202 What is crazy about this is that FECI has been sitting on these 11.2 acres in the heart of downtown Miami for about 50 years when they abandoned passenger rail and sold the right of way to the county to build Metrorail in the 1980's. They just basically used them as parking lots! This is what they own:

http://i.imgur.com/WVk59.jpg

and what is to come :

http://www.transitmiami.com/wp-conte...miCorridor.jpg

I think they finally realized they have a Gold mine by owning adjacent property along the entire ROW on the All Aboard Florida route up to Cocoa.

bobdreamz May 29, 2014 6:40 PM

This is also what is happening in Ft. Lauderdale:

http://mms.businesswire.com/media/20...jpg?download=1

atlantaguy May 30, 2014 2:01 AM

This is all so exciting. Henry Flagler's legacy lives on, and in an amazing way.

Lakelander May 30, 2014 3:12 AM

I hope this Miami to Orlando train is a great success. I'd love to see them extend to Jacksonville and do something with the old Jacksonville Terminal. They already own the tracks and have been scouting the area out for a potential second phase. Hopefully something materializes before the decade is over.

atlantaguy May 30, 2014 3:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakelander (Post 6598474)
I hope this Miami to Orlando train is a great success. I'd love to see them extend to Jacksonville and do something with the old Jacksonville Terminal. They already own the tracks and have been scouting the area out for a potential second phase. Hopefully something materializes before the decade is over.

That would be fantastic, imo. I think a line to Tampa from MCO would also be a huge success.

FEC could basically replicate the original route of the HSR. I'm convinced they could make it work.

Prahaboheme May 30, 2014 4:19 AM

Key to the success of this entire project is a link to the Port at Cape Canaveral -- quickly expanding and a prime mass transit contender from OIA. I hope they jump on the opportunity to provide that connection.

N830MH May 30, 2014 4:22 AM

One more thing? What about West Palm Beach station? Did they consider it? I just wonder that they didn't build one yet.

electricron May 30, 2014 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prahaboheme (Post 6598539)
Key to the success of this entire project is a link to the Port at Cape Canaveral -- quickly expanding and a prime mass transit contender from OIA. I hope they jump on the opportunity to provide that connection.

Where should they build a train station in the Cape Canaveral area? At the port on an offshore island, on a beach on another island, or on the mainland next to their mainline where most of the population lives? It will be significantly cheaper to do so on their mainline. Don't forget, All Aboard Florida is a privately ran and financed "express" train. For multiple stations in a metro area - at the port, at the beach,, at every town center - a publicly ran and financed rail line would be better. ;)
Placong a light rail line down the center of US 1 would reach the most beaches, business, industries, and homes. A few spurs could be built off that spine for local traffic.

Eightball May 30, 2014 4:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobdreamz (Post 6597584)
^ Florida East Coast Industries who owns the right of way for the AAF train station and the adjacent 11.2 acres of land on the edge of downtown Miami has very deep pockets to build this including a 80 story tower. In the map below everything in red is Florida East Coast property:.

Thanks for the response, but I'm quite familiar with the project. There have been some pretty compelling arguments made about why it won't be built. Hopefully they are wrong and construction starts soon :tup:

Could be truly transformative for Florida. Talk is cheap though, so I won't get my hopes up until it is nearing substantial completion.

atlantaguy May 31, 2014 8:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by electricron (Post 6598742)
Where should they build a train station in the Cape Canaveral area? At the port on an offshore island, on a beach on another island, or on the mainland next to their mainline where most of the population lives? It will be significantly cheaper to do so on their mainline. Don't forget, All Aboard Florida is a privately ran and financed "express" train. For multiple stations in a metro area - at the port, at the beach,, at every town center - a publicly ran and financed rail line would be better. ;)
Placong a light rail line down the center of US 1 would reach the most beaches, business, industries, and homes. A few spurs could be built off that spine for local traffic.

I could certainly envision a station near Cocoa, and it would definitely be on the mainland before the Western turn down the Beachline Expressway to OIA.

Disney has an entire fleet of luxury coaches that shuttle people back and forth all day long from OIA to the Port. Not all trains would have to stop there, but a more frequent schedule just between OIA and Cocoa might interest Disney enough to be a minority partner. And, this will be the segment with the highest speeds. Several through trains from South Florida a day could stop there, but not all.

I think it could work. Disney of course would provide the 10 minute coach connection to the Port.

electricron May 31, 2014 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atlantaguy (Post 6600066)
I could certainly envision a station near Cocoa, and it would definitely be on the mainland before the Western turn down the Beachline Expressway to OIA.

Disney has an entire fleet of luxury coaches that shuttle people back and forth all day long from OIA to the Port. Not all trains would have to stop there, but a more frequent schedule just between OIA and Cocoa might interest Disney enough to be a minority partner. And, this will be the segment with the highest speeds. Several through trains from South Florida a day could stop there, but not all.

I think it could work. Disney of course would provide the 10 minute coach connection to the Port.

The new 125 mph tracks next to the Beachline Expressway will be mostly single track. All Aboard Florida (AAF) is planning to run 32 express trains a day over it within an 16 hour daily window. That's a train every half hour or so. That's about as many trains that can be run on a single track line without creating congestion and slowing down trains. There isn't that many windows for additional Disney trains heading towards the port over it. Double tracking the line will double the expense building that last 40 miles next to the Beachline to make room for more trains. Considering all the complaints about the additional 32 passenger trains a day further south - I don't think AAF will ever double track that section of track. Although Sun Rail might lay the second track for commuter trains. The best hope AAF may do is build a train station and have some or all of the trains stop there. But that still will not provide resort to port (without transfers) service that the motor coaches already provide. Every local resort to port passenger occupying a seat would reduce the amount of seats available for higher fares coming from Central to South Florida passengers. The all important higher fares AAF is relying upon to make this train turn a profit. That's why AAF is not planning a station there at this time......
And please don't reply with the counter argument that AAF is planning three stations in South Florida. Few passengers will be paying the higher fares AAF will be charging for local traffic when TriRail can charge significantly (80%) cheaper fares because they are subsidized and don't need to turn a profit. Most of the AAF passengers will be riding between Central and South Florida.


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